Arch rust

[Bmac]

Hi, I'm looking to get my first clio. There are a couple out there that tick the boxes for me... Apart from arch rust.

How much should I be concerned about this, there isn't an easy fix is there like sanding it back, treating and painting? Does it have to be cut out. I just dread buying one with what appears to be minor rust on the arches only to take the rear door cards and find it rotten.

There are plenty out there with no rusty arches, but is it only a matter of time? Has anyone had their arches cut out, any idea on cost?

 

[Robbie Corbett]

Some people have indeed had their arches cut and repaired, others have had entire quarters put on the car to solve the issue. Trouble is its very invasive and you can't reinstate the galvanising or e-coat.

The issue seems to be that the rust can get to work for a long time before you notice a bubble on the outside, so you cant just rub down, fill and paint without it coming back later.

Your best bet is to find a car which is either rust free or one where a previous owner has caught rust early and treated properly. Basically removing any rust an epoxy coating or properly protecting.

Rust free cars do exist imo, and they corrode far less than other cars of the era. I wouldn't buy another one without seeing pictures of behind rear door cards or myself removing and inspecting.

 

[R3k1355]

There's plenty of rust free cars to chose from.

 

[SharpyClio]

The problem with the arch rust is it is from the inside out. So by the time its visible on the outside its going to have eaten through the panel. That means you cant just sand it down and treat it a it just comes back.

There are rust free ones about, mine is an example of that. Just need patience.

 

[Akay]

Also if theres rust on the arches then 99% of them will have rust on the sills behind the skirts, or around the filler cap area!

 

[RustyMojo]

Thing is even if the arches are clear in my experience (all) clios will be suffering under the rear side of the vehicle specifically around the fuel tank and rear beam area, especially the rear spring upper perch. It’s not a particularly well designed area and traps salt/mud and traps water. It’s completely treated by owners on a drive way, with a bit of time, attention and the correct products/tools. However I should imagine many will succumb to it over the next 5 years. My car is rust free on the upper side (fuel flap needed sorting) but the underside needed some love. I wouldn’t want this to put anyone off, but these cars are all about 20 years old now so it’s to be expected. They were cheap new and have been largely been used as they should be. I still think Renault did a great job with rust prevention vs comparable cars of this era.

 

[Bmac]

Thanks for the responses.

My thought was that even if I found a rust free one, it would only be a matter of time.

Some of the cars for sale at the moment can be put into two brackets:
1) no rust but also no engine work/maintenance eg. Cambelt, gearbox, clutches, bushes, no history etc, or
2)a bit of rust but a car with history, new clutches, refurbed gearbox, cambelt changes, etc.

Not sure which group is the best option?

Does anyone have an example cost of cutting out arches, just wondering how that compares to engine work?

 

[MRBILLYUK]

Thanks for the responses.

My thought was that even if I found a rust free one, it would only be a matter of time.

Some of the cars for sale at the moment can be put into two brackets:
1) no rust but also no engine work/maintenance eg. Cambelt, gearbox, clutches, bushes, no history etc, or
2)a bit of rust but a car with history, new clutches, refurbed gearbox, cambelt changes, etc.

Not sure which group is the best option?

Does anyone have an example cost of cutting out arches, just wondering how that compares to engine work?

Have a look @Darren S thread.

182 rear quarter panel replacement - Part 1

So, after a while of procrastination, I bit the bullet and decided to get the offside rear panel sorted. As most will be aware, the crap design of the fuel filler area and the lottery of the cill protection means that rust can be on a sliding scale of pretty much zero to a clump of brown metal...

cliosport.net

 

[Mr Underhill]

Thanks for the responses.

My thought was that even if I found a rust free one, it would only be a matter of time.

Some of the cars for sale at the moment can be put into two brackets:
1) no rust but also no engine work/maintenance eg. Cambelt, gearbox, clutches, bushes, no history etc, or
2)a bit of rust but a car with history, new clutches, refurbed gearbox, cambelt changes, etc.

Not sure which group is the best option?

Does anyone have an example cost of cutting out arches, just wondering how that compares to engine work?

If somebody has taken the time to restore or prevent rust, you can guarantee they'll have pictures of the restoration work in the for sale advert.
If they haven't then assume it's rusty.

£250 ish to have an arch cut out and welded back up. Prices from 2 years ago, so probably more now. A lad at work had his done at our body shop, which is how I know. The rust hasn't come back to date.

5 years ago, cars were showing signs of surface rust which were treatable and prevented from coming back. The ones I saw in 2021 when I was searching for my RB were showing signs of rot around the arches/lower sill - so that would be in the quarter panel, under the rear chassis legs, in the seam under the rear bumper and also lower front sill drivers side.

A friend bought a Black 182 and had it exterior detailed. It was pristine.

He never looked underneath. Booked a track day at Croft, got one lap in and the passenger side rear spring went through the chassis leg - where the bump stop is above the coil. There's a lad on here who has a restoration thread and he has a picture of his, which was rotten.

Out of the two options I'd go for 2)

But there are cars that are fully restored, rust free and in perfect mechanical condition......but......they're not cheap.

 

[Brigsy]

Find a rust free example, worth spending more initially. Once rust is visible on arches etc, you will be forever chasing it unless you spend a lot of money cutting it all out for fresh metal.

Mechanical stuff is an easy fix in comparison.

 

[Robbie Corbett]

I would personally go with option 1. As Brigsy says above mechanical stuff is easy, unbolt, replace, rebolt with the occasional engine removal in the middle.

Are you able/willing to do any work yourself? I found a mild restoration to be very enjoyable on these - rear end comes out so easily. With engine out belts and all bushes are a doddle. Engine out in 3-4hrs. Mine was thankfully pretty free of corrosion but it was the right time to clean it all up and protect it for the future.

Where are you based?

 

[Mr Underhill]

I guess I just like getting filthy

You can cure rust, but you can't add service history to a car that's had none. IMHO!

 

[MarcB]

.

 

[RustyMojo]

Thing is why can’t you have both a clean car that’s been treated and decent history? They will come for sale. But they will be more money as you’d be buying a well cared for, higher end of the market car. There is a chance I will sell mine at some point, it’s overdue it’s belts now so I’ll be getting that done before I sold it. For no other reason than I really want the car to be 100%. This isn’t a stealth ad by the way it’s not for sale at the moment and no one wants silver anyway.

 

[Bmac]

Is there a guide for viewing cars just from a rust point of view.

As some have said it can look fine from the outside but under the covers it's falling apart.

If the arches look good, I'd be wanting to take the door cards off and seeing what it's like on the inside.

Would it be unreasonable to take off the sills or do you not have to do this, can they be seen just by looking underneath.

If I can't see any rust around the filler cap, is there anything to look at behind this easily at a viewing?

Basically how far can you reasonably go on a viewing without just looking at the surface?

Also, at what stage can rust be treated to prevent it spreading?

 

[Ph1 Tom]

One of my old Clios rusted from the inside out.

From the outside it wasn't too bad. On removal of the rear 1/4 panel trims the diagnosis was terminal.

So just keep that in mind that it can look ok, but could be a complete shed.

 

[high_octane]

Does anyone know a decent company in Hampshire, Dorset, Wiltshire, Surrey, West Sussex who knows how to tackle rust on 182s?