Calling all wiring experts - Help needed

[Grats]

Hi

As titled need help from some of you wiring experts, fitting a (07)197 engine into a (05) 182 - before anyone asks why as people always do I acquired a Mk3 Sadev box so it was easier to use the 197 engine. I still feel it also gives some £/bhp advantage but that's a separate discussion.

Firstly I've had a look to find detailed wiring diagrams for both cars but no luck - so direction to any would probably do the trick.

The car was running DTA management before I started this silly project, I am struggling to work out how to connect the following;

• Crank sensor -182 has White and Red wires and 197 Green/Black Stripe and Orange/Black Stripe
• Electrovanne Solenoid valve - 182 Green and Pink wires and 197 White and Orange Wires

thanks

 

[andy-reid]

why don't you just use the wiring and plugs you had???
electrovanne solinoid ???? what where is it

 

[Edges]

So the only two issues are plugs with 2 wires. Can't you just connect them, code read the ecu then if there's a fault swap them over

 

[Grats]

Thanks,

The plugs, sensors and location of the crank sensor are different on the 197. I've found some wiring diagrams so i think I've got it sorted.

Newbie to engine management, ill have a play to see what it says.

ta

 

[NorthloopCup]

I've got a 197 and a 172 cup loom that are spliced together for my R3 maxi engine I'll be fitting. The 197 dephaser solonoid isn't an on/off like the 1*2 is so you'll need the wiring for the cam phase sensor as well. Your better off running it on fully sequential injection too.
You can run it the same way as a 1*2 if you wanted though without issue. Grats

 

[Grats]

Thanks, I new the Cam phasing was fully variable but assumed it would be only rev related and not requiring a signal from a cam - so thanks a lot. I want to just get it running so I can talk it to someone who knows what they are talking about

Again thanks for the comment on injection, assume better in performance terms.

Are fitting your R3 with Sadev into a 1*2 - it's tight but does fit. Ill try and load up a pic, but always have fun.

 

[Grats]

Pic of engine bay, sorry don't know how to insert a bigger picture - happy to share my build experiences if you need any?



Can you tell me more why the dephaser needs a cam input so i can try o explain it to someone else, I have a map from DTA (from their French partner)and as far as i can see its no cam input - but to be honest not sure what i am looking at. A Motor club mate is calling round this wk who's a lot more familiar with ECU's to help me set it up but any comments / help welcome. I need to learn, cant be a dinosaur all my life.

Thanks

 

[MicKPM]

Standard management use both Crank position and Cam position and plots a graph to ensure they're in the correct position relative to one another... We call this "synchronisation".

The engine management then can see what "advance" the Dephaser pulley is pulling and adjust the timing accordingly.

As these new dephaser are constantly changing, without the cam sensor to synch with, the ECU would have no idea what position the camshaft is actually in.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Standard management use both Crank position and Cam position and plots a graph to ensure they're in the correct position relative to one another... We call this "synchronisation".

The engine management then can see what "advance" the Dephaser pulley is pulling and adjust the timing accordingly.

As these new dephaser are constantly changing, without the cam sensor to synch with, the ECU would have no idea what position the camshaft is actually in.

It also uses the cam sensor for the fully sequential fuel injection.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Thanks, I new the Cam phasing was fully variable but assumed it would be only rev related and not requiring a signal from a cam - so thanks a lot. I want to just get it running so I can talk it to someone who knows what they are talking about

Again thanks for the comment on injection, assume better in performance terms.

Are fitting your R3 with Sadev into a 1*2 - it's tight but does fit. Ill try and load up a pic, but always have fun.

You need to give it a pwm signal, or a digital signal opposed to a analogue signal for the fully variable cam timing. Your ecu should have these outputs.

The R3 engine I'm fitting is just all the running gear into a 1*2 block mate and running on a jc5. Don't have the money or the interest level to bother with the sadev unfortunately. The standard R3 maxi makes 230hp on standard everything apart from high lift cams and high comp so that'll do me nicely as I've done a bit of additional fettling. Plus I'll be running the maxi evo airbox as well. This will allow me to upgrade to maxi evo spec should the need arise.

What at hp does yours put out on the itb's? Or has it never ran yet? Be interested to know the size of the itb's also.

 

[Grats]

Thanks all, think i understand it a lot better - ive got the engine started in basic mode so i can run the engine in, will do the rest of the wiring and book it in to the rolling rd to get the sequential injection, dephaser and flat shift set up.

No idea on HP at mo.

The ITBs are 48's, i do have a spare inlet manifold to suit the 197 head if interested?

cheers

 

[NorthloopCup]

No idea on HP at mo.

The ITBs are 48's, i do have a spare inlet manifold to suit the 197 head if interested?

cheers

Ah yeah that's fair enough mate. Whats your engine spec then?

For serious hp you need to be up in the regions of 50+ mm on the bodies due to the size of the inlet ports. You also want around a 7-10 degree taper from the itb to the inlet valves. It all helps with cylinder fill you see.

I'm sticking with the oe 197 inlet manifold mate, but thanks for the offer on the itb mani.

 

[Grats]

It was an easy decision on the size of ITB's - the ones i had on a self in the garage

Engine as steel rod and pistons upgrade and a set of cat cams, everything else standard.

Will see how competitive it is before considering any further upgrades.

cheers

 

[NorthloopCup]

It was an easy decision on the size of ITB's - the ones i had on a self in the garage

Engine as steel rod and pistons upgrade and a set of cat cams, everything else standard.

Will see how competitive it is before considering any further upgrades.

cheers

Lol yeah I can see how your decision was influenced then!!

Ah right ok, so a similar spec to mine then other than you've got itb's. I'd certainly be interested to see what hp yours makes as a comparison for what the R3 spec engine should make.

 

[Grats]

Ok will do, will be a while lots of jobs to finish and don't get a lot of spare time these days.

 

[andy-reid]

my megane rally car is running a 182 x cup race engine (they are prety standard) so it has a random steel crank (but i want a 197 crank) steel wods 83.5mm wosner hi comp pistons just going back together with a cometic mls steel gasket and a set of 197 cat cams (rally speck without the vvt) did make a strong 197bhp 17? lbft but the vvt not working last rr session but i cooked it in apfil as i bust my rad and lost coolant so when it goes back together would like to see 220 ish as it is on 45mm jenveys and omex 600