Clio Trackday Guide? (Burp, D4ve, MarkCup, etc)

[Schweppy]

Just a thought, but it would be good if the likes of MarkCup, Burp, D4ve and many others could give a few tips for the track day beginners.

Things like what to bring, tools, etc, car preparations as well as what to expect on a full day open pit lane or sessioned.

I know that lots of people are interested in tracking their clios so we could maybe have it as a sticky in the track-day subforum.

 

[theduck]

would love something like this, also maybe some info on the amounts of wear and tear you can expect on things like tyres, pads, discs and anything else that could be a hidden cost.

 

[Christopher]

+1

Great idea!

 

[whatisjustis]

Perhaps it could lead to one? I'd be very interested...

 

[ForceIndia]

There's already dozens on the net
http://www.ten-tenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38950
http://www.easytrack.co.uk/beginner/beginner.asp

 

[Ali]

Yeh i think theory's all well and good...But pratical application is litterally getting on track and doing it!

More time in the seat, the better driver you will become!

 

[iain187]

would love something like this, also maybe some info on the amounts of wear and tear you can expect on things like tyres, pads, discs and anything else that could be a hidden cost.

yes this is what I would most like to see!

I have a friend begging me to take my car around the track but I am wary until I know what sort of work/cost will need doing before/after.

I dont want to spend £100 on a day out then do my car in so I cant go to work after, as my clio is also my daily runner

So I will be looking out for this!

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

I've seen a few threads like this (not asking for a guide) but involving questions on track days etc.

IMO:

There's nothing to worry about, if you're nervous about it perhaps not going is the easier option.

Depending how brutal you are, will depend on what might need replacing afterwards, that said; if you even have the slightest bit of mechanical sympathy then the car will be fine.

I took my dci 80 to the Nurburgring on part worn Exaltos, brand new standard brakes (bedded them in on the way to the track (10 miles) and changed the oil before the journey as it needed it anyway. Did 20 laps, first was 14 minutes. Last was 10 minutes so I wasn't hanging about.

I know a lot of people have 172s on here, and with nearly 100hp more you'll be braking more (thus upgrades become more worthwhile), but I doubt anyone with no experience on a track could do a BTG lap of the ring in 10 minutes even with 170hp.

Lastly I'd say if you have NO experience with braking points or racing lines (i.e. karting etc, even video games) then get some tuition, in which case they'll tell you everything anyway.

 

[Ali_M]

Just make sure that the car is in fit condition really...

First check that you do not have any oil or coolant leaks and that rad hoses are not likely to split.

- make sure you have some decent meat on your pads.

- check oil, coolant & brake fluid levels are as they should be.

- make sure that your tyres have enough tread for you to do the day and get home again (legally!)

- Make sure wheel bolts are at the correct torque as over tightening can in extreme cases cause warping of the discs.

- Re-check the above when you come in after a session as they can slacken with the heating up and cooling down.

- When you park up in the pits, dont leave the handbrake on and the car out of gear - instead leave it in gear with the handbrake off. If you are on a slope and you do not do the above, you may end up chasing after a run away car...

- Set a max limit for number of laps depending on length of track possibly. I usually go out for 10 laps or so and then allow the car (brakes, oil, coolant etc) to cool down before going out again.

- If you feel the pedal going soft - do not keep hammering it for one last lap - take it as a warning as you will probably lose all braking as you have boilled your fluid.

- You do not need any 'special' modifications as such, if you do any, fit braided hoses along with a proper brake fluid like Motul RBF600 as your brakes will last far longer.

Also, something I have learned, if something does not feel right with the car you are usually right! Just take it in and give it a quick check for peace of mind. I chose to ignore a funny vibration and a wheel later came off!

Other than that, just take it easy, have fun and remember - it's not a race!

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

I have a friend begging me to take my car around the track but I am wary until I know what sort of work/cost will need doing before/after.

If you don't want to cook your tyres and brakes, then don't leather it... Brake a little bit earlier (costing you a few seconds per lap at the very most) and your tyres/brakes will last so much longer.

 

[Schweppy]

This is the sort of info i'm looking for.

Thanks to those that answered, keep it coming!

 

[Ali_M]

For wear and tear...

Track action will wear components such as ball joints, track rod ends and bushes as well as the more obvious consumables such as tyres, pads and discs.

This does not mean you have to replace these like your pants but just keep it in mind and keep an eye on them for excessive play. Even with hard regular track driving these should all be lasting years rather than months...

To give you some idea, the RSR 197 has done something like 30,000 miles at the Nurburgring and only now had a failled ball joint iirc...

Depending on the circuit, tyres will wear reasonably quickly depending on your driving. On a tight clockwise circuit my front n/s took much more of a pounding than the rest and caused some uneven wear. Nothing major - the tyre is still ok, it will just need replaced a bit earlier now.

Edit - Also, tyres overheat. Another reason for doing say, 10 laps at a time. When tyres overheat this is the point when maximum wear will occur.

Standard brake discs are a weak point, especially with more aggressive pads. Try to minimise the time you are stationary on the brakes after a session as this will cause warping. Discs are cheap enough from the motor factors so not too much to worry about.

Doing a cool down lap before you come in helps. Just cruise round out of the way of faster traffic and try and stay off of the brakes.

I went through one set of brake discs and one set of R888's in 5 days of the Nurburgring, that gives you some indication...

Tyre pressures - Something to keep an eye on. Imo, just set them to the tyre manufacturers recommended or if they came with the car, what Renault recommend. I prefer to pump a few more psi in mine to stop the sidewalls rolling over too much, but it is a personal choice. I am constantly playing with them to try and find the right balance.

If you think the tyres are working for you as you want them, take note of the pressure, and when the pressures rise with increased heat, bring them back down to your 'prefered' level. That is only what I do though, I still dont fully understand different pressure for different conditions...

If it is only the odd track session you are doing I would not worry about wear and tear, it will be pretty minimal imo.

 

[Russ_16v]

^^ this is good advise, i hear alot of people blaming the car (ie brakes have boiled,or not enough grip) now while both these do happen i believe you should drive your car not only remembering your limits but the cars as well, a few sighting laps of a track should give you a rough idea of how fast you can go,then work up to your and the cars limits, if there are faster cars there let them past,dont try to keep up,and if your brakes or tyres go off then there limits been reached so keep to that,even if you think you can drive faster

 

[Henry]

have a look for Art Marcus's book, which is fairly comprehensive

lots of really good advice already. it's a bit obvious, but try and get a good night's sleep beforehand, without booze; you'll need appropriate footwear, long trousers and long sleeves, too

most of the thought goes into the car prep and the good news is that RS Clio's aren't really old enough to be that ropey (IMO), so you likely just need be sure that it's serviced, that any relevant problems are sorted, and be checking things like brakes, tyres/pressures, wheel studs, etc

also, not sure if it's already been mentioned, but clear it out of all clutter

 

[Ali_M]

^^ this is good advise, i hear alot of people blaming the car (ie brakes have boiled,or not enough grip) now while both these do happen i believe you should drive your car not only remembering your limits but the cars as well, a few sighting laps of a track should give you a rough idea of how fast you can go,then work up to your and the cars limits, if there are faster cars there let them past,dont try to keep up,and if your brakes or tyres go off then there limits been reached so keep to that,even if you think you can drive faster

Exactly

...and if you see a car appear in your mirrors that was not there 2 corners ago - let it past! It is faster!

 

[Schweppy]

OK thanks again guys.

What about things to take with you?

Equipment, helmet, tools, spare brake pads?!??

 

[Henry]

shouldn't ever need spare pads unless they need doing before you go

a lot of them will hire out helmets but it's just nicer to have your own that fits and doesn't ming of other people's sweat

might be an idea to take a very basic tool kit, zip ties, tank tape, etc - but, even if you don't, there'll likely be others there with tools; people are generally really friendly and helpful if you do have any trouble

 

[Ali_M]

OK thanks again guys.

What about things to take with you?

Equipment, helmet, tools, spare brake pads?!??

You will need a helmet. For a trackday, a motorbike helmet is ok, car lid is better. You can usually hire from the track for a small fee if you do not have.

Dont go overboard on the tools for a local trackday. A torque wrench for wheel nuts, tyre pressure gauge and pump are the main things to remember. As long as your car is in good condition you should not need anything else.

As long as you have good pads to begin with you will not need to bring spares.

Also, increasing you oil changes is a good idea. Some people do it before and after doing a trackday. Imo that is excessive, I just make sure I change mine on a regular basis.

 

[Ali_M]

^^^ Henry is spot on with the cable ties and duct tape - essential!

 

[Steve]

For wear and tear...


Tyre pressures - Something to keep an eye on. Imo, just set them to the tyre manufacturers recommended or if they came with the car, what Renault recommend. I prefer to pump a few more psi in mine to stop the sidewalls rolling over too much, but it is a personal choice. I am constantly playing with them to try and find the right balance.

If you think the tyres are working for you as you want them, take note of the pressure, and when the pressures rise with increased heat, bring them back down to your 'prefered' level. That is only what I do though, I still dont fully understand different pressure for different conditions...
.

With Toyo R888's side walls are stiffer so drive to circuit at say 30psi all round.

Go out & do 5 laps come in check pressures, at this point i dropped to 26psi F 28R & kept them at this throughout the day. Not dropping can cause them to wear out in one day easy, by over inflating due to heat.

On the way home back to 30 psi.

Best piece of advise is don't go out for first or last 30/45 mins as most accidents happen with green track or tired over confident drivers.

Open pit lane events are far better than sessions & give airfields a miss.

 

[iain187]

whats wrong with airfields?

 

[Schweppy]

whats wrong with airfields?

+1

i have just booked one LOL

 

[ForceIndia]

Poor surface tends to kill tyres, featureless, boring.

 

[Schweppy]

Poor surface tends to kill tyres, featureless, boring.

Fair enough but at least there's nothing to hit....on my first go!

What tyre pressures should I be running with 15s? I'm running slightly less than the book pressure for the standard 16s.

 

[Henry]

i quite like airfield days. they do tend to be harder on tyres but some circuits are quite harsh as well. better idea to start on an airfield rather than find yourself in trouble around Castle Coombe!

who've you gone with Schweppy? Motorsport Events do a lot of local ones, are cheap, and well organised - recommend them

 

[Schweppy]

i quite like airfield days. they do tend to be harder on tyres but some circuits are quite harsh as well. better idea to start on an airfield rather than find yourself in trouble around Castle Coombe!

who've you gone with Schweppy? Motorsport Events do a lot of local ones, are cheap, and well organised - recommend them

My thinking exactly.

I have also used Motorsport Events. Doing Hullavington in November.

 

[Henry]

haven't been to Hullavington, but the organisers are a really good bunch - can't go wrong

 

[Steve]

Poor surface tends to kill tyres, featureless, boring.

+1.

Lost a headlight & fogs & windscreen years ago never again.

If it's choice of cones or craner curves, you work it out

I want to experience what the famous drivers have done

Cheap is not always best:quiet:

 

[drhowser]

i've been to quite a few of the motorsports events days, and had a good laugh at all of them, best thing is later in the afternooon a lot of people set off early and it gets quiet.

 

[sean_d]

Great idea this thread

 

[Henry]

also, don't tailgate cars as they go off-line and throw up all the litter at the side of the track..

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

whats wrong with airfields?

+1

i have just booked one LOL

Airfields are good fun... For top speed and straight line runs. So pointless in any standard engined Clio.

Plus navigating cones is no fun at all.

 

[dzm]

Lots of good advice here. I would also like to add, the Renaultsport track days are just about the best i've come across and would heartily recommend them. Considering the interest in trackdays, i can't believe how quiet they are.

Very good value, great circiuts, open pit-lane, no traffic, the opportunity to drive one of Renaultsport's cars with an instructor for free, equally paced cars, no bad manners and very novice friendly. They really are a no-brainer.

I did Spa, Bedford, Cadwell and Oulton this year with Renault and would give 'em 10/10.

 

[Adey.]

always good to note, tracks are actually a very safe enviroment to drive fast in, everyone is going in the same direction, no one crossing from another road and such like. there is usualy a very high standard of driving on a track day, most people are driving there everyday motors too so tend not to want to kill them. you can alway do a slow lap and keep to the right and then speed up at ure own pace. a good driver wnt be hussling you to go faster they will just pass you when they feel thay can do so safley.


saying all this tho you do get some t***s out and about on track

the best thing you can do is to get to as many track/airfields as you can, the seat time alone will make you a better driver when you need the skills

buy ureself a helmet if ure going to go to a few days, as after 3 or 4 you could of payed for one in rental charges.

i usualy take the day off before a track day to give the car a once over and to fix anything i need to. as mentioned the general stuff, oil water brake fluid checks. basicly a well maintained road car will be quite handy on track, if you get into a situation where your out of control your either pushing the car too hard or have taken a drasticly wrong line.

most important bit of info for a beginer on track, dnt lift off mid corner all tho it can be very usefull when ure actually trying to shave seconds off in a timed enviroment,keep it soft and smooth. other than that have fun, thats what these events are for, dont drive out thinking your going to be setting new lap records as its just not going to happen, its a relaxed and safe place to drive your car faster and harder than you do on the road

 

[Russ_16v]

i quite like airfield days. they do tend to be harder on tyres but some circuits are quite harsh as well. better idea to start on an airfield rather than find yourself in trouble around Castle Coombe!

who've you gone with Schweppy? Motorsport Events do a lot of local ones, are cheap, and well organised - recommend them

My thinking exactly.

I have also used Motorsport Events. Doing Hullavington in November.

Let me know when chap and il pop over and have a look, i live 4 miles from hullavington lol

 

[ForceIndia]

Poor surface tends to kill tyres, featureless, boring.

Fair enough but at least there's nothing to hit....on my first go!

What tyre pressures should I be running with 15s? I'm running slightly less than the book pressure for the standard 16s.

Better off doing bedford. Great surface, nothing to hit, nice and quick. You'll get bored fairly easily (you can learn it in a day), but excellent for a first time, and it's a proper track.

 

[1PBY]

I would suggest running slightly less tyre presure than normal for 2 reasons. Firstly the greater the tyre contact on the road the better traction and grip you will have (within sensible limits). Secondly is the tyres will get hot and will make the air in the tyre expand, thus causing tyre presure to incease during the session, often up to 25% more psi after the session than before going out on track. Just a few things to thnk about but 25 psi would be a sensible presure. any less and the side walls with get a hard time.

 

[TooneySonic]

if theres tuition there take advantage of it. i can't recommend it enough

i've said it before but £1000 spent on tution will make you a hell of alot faster than £1000 spent on modifications. you will be faster, cleaner, more aware and kinder on your car and its tyres

remember to BUILD pace rather than go all out as your learn the lines and become more comfortable

personally vision is a big thing for me: i like to look as far ahead as possible at all times, plan your braking point, as you turn in take a quick look at your apex clipping point then its back to as far ahead. this means you are always one step ahead and are smoother and faster. hope that makes sense

just re-iterate what has already been said about tyre pressures and brake fade

oh, and have fun

 

[Pep]

Good thread!

I've got my first trackday booked at Curborough Sprint Track, only £47.50!

Gonna take a spare wheel, tools, jack, axle stands etc, compressor, tyre pressure guage and a few bits and bobs, but all will be taken out for when i'm on track.

Mods to the car are stripped, H&R's, Lightweight 15's + new Yoko Paradas (hope it's dry!) 2 month old pads all round, discs I will replace after going out, as well as an oil change.
I'll get all the levels checked and topped up accordingly.
I'll get my tyre place to double check all of my wheel bolt torques the day before. Anyone know what i should get them set to?

Also, where could I buy a torque wrench for a decent enough price that will do the job for me?

Any last minute tips etc would be welcomed

 

[AlexG]

Halfords should do an oright torque wrench for a reasonable price. most places should have some machine mart and maybe screwfix. obviously snap-on whould be the best depending on budget. but halofords tools are pretty good if you get the ones with lifetime gauruntee.

Id set the wheel nuts at 100lbs all round.