Should i get an r-sport ecu or an dastek unichip?Im going to get a BMC CDA and de-cat and exhaust,then what?I know the unichip is more expensive and can be programmed to suit the mods but will it be much better than a r-sport ecu?Ive not seen much on here about dastek has anyone had any expereince of them.
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Dastek or R-sport
- Thread starter BIGDAVE
- Start date
Should i get an r-sport ecu or an dastek unichip?Im going to get a BMC CDA and de-cat and exhaust,then what?I know the unichip is more expensive and can be programmed to suit the mods but will it be much better than a r-sport ecu?Ive not seen much on here about dastek has anyone had any expereince of them.
Rich-D
ClioSport Club Member
E90 LCI 330d
You cant really compare an R-Sport ECU to a Dastek, as they are different things...
The R-Sport is a bit like a Superchip, just another set of parameters for the engine to use in order to improve performance.
Wheras the Dastek is a piggy back unit that basically allows you to setup the car to run how you want, so you can put it on the rollers and set the thing up perfectly for your engine. Then it can be altered for any future mods you do.
Thats why an R-Sport is £240 and a Dastek is about £650!!!
because they havent got the proper equipment to set them up properley.i know this because of two reasons 1,somebody i know bought all the tuning equipment 2,my mate had a unichip fitted there and it run crap after and they never sorted it(it run better with the standard ecu)
all they do is download a basic program to the chip from a computer.they havent the equipment to fine tune it and set it up/adjust the mapping properley.
jay
Do NOT get a Unichip or any other chip fitted by muppets (i.e the vast majority of garages as I discovered at my cost).
The F4R engine has a very unusual characteristic in that it seems to produce more power a while after you begin to get serious detonation due to a lean mixture. basically if the guy whos mapping it hasnt got a blinding clue - (read your average Unichip garage), they will simply look at the max power readout and map the chip to keep you there. On most cars you can get away with that because the power plateau as you begin to det, whereas the 172 F4R engine keeps going. The only way to do this properly is to lookout for the first sign of det as you are mapping and back off about 4 degrees advance.
If you dont - Warning to everybody else on this site with a chipped 172 maxed out for power - You WILL suffer detonation at WOT and you WILL wreck your piston rings. The first signs will be copious oil in the inlet manifold/air filter and white smoke in the exhaust at full load.
Ive been there, done that, and I recommend you think twice before embarking on this exercise. An engine rebuild and new pistons doesnt come cheap.
Hve fun.
we do a programmable chip system for £450 inc fitting + rolling road set up time.
its similar to the unichip one...... and the advantage with this type of system is you can of course reprogram it if you change engine components etc without the cost of changing the whole chip.... much more flexable..... half way to a fully mappable system...
a mild cam profile on inlet/exhaust will give an additional 8bhp or so. By mild I mean that max lift at TDC should not be more than 1-1.5mm in order to keep the hydraulic lifters and current springs etc. The duration/overlap can be increased in order to improve the engines breathing, again within reason in order to keep idling behaviour ok for road use. I got an extra 8bhp from my cams. In theory you could get up to 12-15 but you will be sacrificing low rev tractability.
Cams and proper head/manifold porting and flowing adds 25-30 bhp
Nippy white cup
Interesting......
no I got the cams developed by Piper and installed by the same people who did the head. Not Colin, who was involved with the suspension and most importantly with diagnosing and solving the blow-by problem caused by detting etc as you know. However, Colin is more than capable to supervise your cam/head work should you decide to go that way.
If you read my post, youll understand that the problem doesnt come from the Unichip as such. It comes from the fact that the F4R engine has the unusual tendency to reach peak power AFTER it has already been pushed into detonation (i.e youre damaging your pistons/rings/cylinders). So ANY chip used on an F4R which is setup for maximum power without looking out for detonation will cause precisely the same problem. The only way to do this safely is for each rpm map to take the mixture just where it starts detting and back off 4 degrees advance or so.
To Neils question, I have unichip (..) cat back, race spec ported/flowed head, regrind cams, different oil breather system, new springs/dampers and a few braking improvements
the cams were the first regrind of an F4R by piper. Discussed them with their head techy Warren.
The original (badly done as it later transpired) unichip was fitted with a catback exhaust and a BMC filter only . The other mods came later. The standard car was pushing 166bhp, with the unichip it went up to 174bhp. Thats also probably when the detonation damage began.
if you want serious power increases you have to improve the breathing (head,cams, TB, turbo). Just playing around with chipping etc will just screw up your engine.
this does sound like the chips were set up to produce max power rather than concentrating on drivability.... if they were set on the rollers why was the CO not checked under load throught the rev range and at the majour loading points....
the 172s ecu is harder to map than the other renault cars, so your right in saying - care must be takes... but this is no different to any car... its really down the the skill of the rolling road operator.......
Youre both absolutely right. the job was botched. I have no problem in naming and shaming the dastek operators Ive used, as they have caused me significant financial loss: Owen Developments in Oxfordshire and Millway in Hampshire
Whats the best map process to be 100% sure that det will be avoided?
still have the unichip. Nothing wrong with it. But now I have it mapped regularly by people who have a clue what they are doing (re ben/andy posts).
If the site had a section on what not to do, or problem diagnostic and solutions, that would be a definite candidate given the number of people here who have chipped their cars, and given my own experiences that show how many RR operators are doing more damage than good. There must be a few dozen guys on here who are damaging their engines every time they are at WOT, but will not know it until its too late and spend £xxx to fix it! My advice for anybody with a chipped car is to have it checked by somebody competent.
When mapping an engine IDEALLY instead of running off an exhaust gas analyser in th tailpipe (slow reaction) using a wide band (expensive) lambda setup to monitor a/f ratio, using the knock sensor if they can to keep an eye as itll be tailored to the frequency this engine emits when knock starts creeping in before det.
Det will occur and crankcase pressure will increase.
