FAO Those With Existing Safety Devices Roll Cage, Msa Eligibilty

[Ads29]

Thank you Daniel @SafetyDevicesDaniel for all the updates and for responding personally, it is greatly appreciated.

I'll be in touch soon regarding an exchange

Adam

 

[loggyboy]

@SafetyDevicesDaniel does this mean there will there be some heavily discounted used cages available from you guys in a few months?!

 

[masekwm]

@SafetyDevicesDaniel does this mean there will there be some heavily discounted used cages available from you guys in a few months?!

Raises hand, as someone who has no intention of competing, I'll take a piece of that scrap away from you...

 

[Marshal10]

Anyone got any recommendations of who to get to fit a cage in the greater Bristol area...

 

[Ads29]

I'll be going to Simpson Motorsport in Lydney @Marshal10, but then I live there anyway

 

[Pauleds]

I bought the Safety Devices cage as I was in a car that tested one to the max when I used to codrive in the 205 Challenge..........

It was scrap after that
@SafetyDevicesDaniel

 

[Ads29]

May have ended up as scrap metal but it certainly looks to have done it's job @Pauleds

 

[...]

And to further Back up Safety devises , as i sill get my blue book updates , this from custom cages looks like the relevant rule update wording , though no date is on it that i can see

http://www.customcages.co.uk/news-room/msa-rule-changes-and-update-kits

 

[Pauleds]

And to further Back up Safety devises , as i sill get my blue book updates , this from custom cages looks like the relevant rule update wording , though no date is on it that i can see

http://www.customcages.co.uk/news-room/msa-rule-changes-and-update-kits

Which is what I mentioned about only having one bend on the front leg

 

[loggyboy]

And to further Back up Safety devises , as i sill get my blue book updates , this from custom cages looks like the relevant rule update wording , though no date is on it that i can see

http://www.customcages.co.uk/news-room/msa-rule-changes-and-update-kits

That change was from 2011.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=978366

 

[...]

Proving they made a cage that should never have been passed after 2011 then

 

[SafetyDevicesDaniel]

Proving they made a cage that should never have been passed after 2011 then

Hi harvsurrey, The regulation change in 2011 purely related to the number of bends in a front leg, which doesn't affect the R017 cage as it complies with that wording.
We posted the 'MSA ROPS Bulletin March 2011' on our website when it was released, and it remains today along with other current regulations. This was important at the time because with so many of our roll cages homologated, the statement at the bottom of the first page was good clarification for our customers.

 

[SafetyDevicesDaniel]

I bought the Safety Devices cage as I was in a car that tested one to the max when I used to codrive in the 205 Challenge..........

Nice to see the cockpit still so intact! Great photo

 

[SafetyDevicesDaniel]

does this mean there will there be some heavily discounted used cages available from you guys in a few months?!

You're quick off the mark! I think we'll assess the situation once we have an idea of cage numbers

 

[...]

you are correct and my appologies , as it does look as if your cage complies with that update.

In fact that update my be responsible for the issue now faced by revised designs

 

[BlackGoldMatt]

You're quick off the mark! I think we'll assess the situation once we have an idea of cage numbers

I would also be interested in a used non-MSA compliant cage. Keep us updated please!
Matt

 

[Hyperhatch]

Hi
I've just picked up my car with the new R022 cage from Safety Devices. I believe this is the first customer car to have it fitted. Here are some photos for those who are interested. I'm very happy with the cage. It should look better when I get time to paint and smarten up the interior! The service from Mark Fish was excellent.

Cheers Chris

 

[Digger90]

Looks great.

But why is the harness bar so low.... proper fitting is to have it level with the harness holes in the seat.

 

[AdamCup]

But why is the harness bar so low.... proper fitting is to have it level with the harness holes in the seat.

It can be level or max 20 degrees downwards angle.

 

[shiftspark]

It's difficult to see from the pictures but I dolbt it's more than 20 degrees. Perhaps would be easier to see with a harness in.

 

[Fraser.J.]

Looks great.

But why is the harness bar so low.... proper fitting is to have it level with the harness holes in the seat.

Difficult to achieve if people have seats at different heights. Lower the better in my opinion as my seats are very low.

 

[Fraser.J.]

Cage looks great. Did you have the previous cage?

I'm down for an exchange, my old cage is being collected tomorrow.

Can you get some photos of the top dash showing how it was cut for the cage?

 

[Hyperhatch]

It's difficult to see from the pictures but I dolbt it's more than 20 degrees. Perhaps would be easier to see with a harness in.

Harnes is only in temporary. Also the seats can still go down another 10mm (which it will when I use it).

 

[shiftspark]

Looks fine to me.

 

[Hyperhatch]

Cage looks great. Did you have the previous cage?

I'm down for an exchange, my old cage is being collected tomorrow.

Can you get some photos of the top dash showing how it was cut for the cage?

No my car didn't have a cage in it before (there is a build thread in the project section).

Some photos of the dash......

 

[Pauleds]

My only potential issue looking at those pics is the harnesses to the bar not being able to taper in towards each other.
Where they are fitted onto the bar in the pic, the rear diagonal cuts across it and stops them being closer together which is required now with the use of hans devices.

I would prefer the harness bars where the harnesses are fitted to be unobstructed by another bar like on the original cage.
@SafetyDevicesDaniel

 

[DCELEC 182]

Looks quite different design wise to the old model, not sure I like that it still incorporates the dash dodging design though.....wonder why that's necessary? Is there no box section for the feet to sit on now too?
Either way, nicely put together bolt in cage to be fair!

 

[Martin.]

not sure I like that it still incorporates the dash dodging design though.....wonder why that's necessary?

Is that a joke ?

 

[Martin.]

Cage looks bloody great to be fair. Does the glove box still open properly?

 

[DCELEC 182]

Is that a joke ?

No, why?

 

[loggyboy]

not sure I like that it still incorporates the dash dodging design though.....

We included the windscreen reinforcement bars to provide additional strength, given the front legs are now at a steeper angle. Although not required by regulations in this instance, it's our standard practice for new developments.

 

[DCELEC 182]

Thanks for the constructive reply mate, I looked back through and realised you'd asked that already now...my mistake! Just not seen others designed like that, and as safety devices say not strictly necessary at the moment but good practise.
May look at swapping mine over for the new design next winter, will incur a fair amount of fitting costs again sadly!

 

[Hyperhatch]

Cage looks bloody great to be fair. Does the glove box still open properly?

Yes but it has been cut slightly on the left hand side. It's minor but hard to see in the photo.

 

[quiksilver.cm]

Hyperhatch has the steering column support bar been cut to fit the front drivers side 'a' pillar leg?
From your pic it looks like it's been cut.

In the second pic you can see which bar I mean

 

[Digger90]

It can be level or max 20 degrees downwards angle.

Read this: http://www.msar.co.uk/pdf/UsersGuideRacingHarness.pdf

Harness mounting bar is far from ideal, it's much too far back, introducing extra elongation in the event of a frontal impact (it would be better to be mounted straight from the main hoop). Plus, as Pauleds states, the design looks like it inhibits harness cross-over as the diagonal intersects the harness bar very widely.

That aspect could have been thought out better given the amount of time/effort that's gone into designing it.

Nice cage otherwise though - I like the front section with the extra legs through the dash and the treatment of the door cross braces looks both neat and effective.

 

[quiksilver.cm]

If you look at the pic on safety devices website of the unpainted cage, the rear double cross and harness bar are totally different. It actually looks correct in this pic

 

[massivewangers]

Read this: http://www.msar.co.uk/pdf/UsersGuideRacingHarness.pdf

Harness mounting bar is far from ideal, it's much too far back, introducing extra elongation in the event of a frontal impact (it would be better to be mounted straight from the main hoop). Plus, as Pauleds states, the design looks like it inhibits harness cross-over as the diagonal intersects the harness bar very widely.

That aspect could have been thought out better given the amount of time/effort that's gone into designing it.

Nice cage otherwise though - I like the front section with the extra legs through the dash and the treatment of the door cross braces looks both neat and effective.

If the harness bar was in the main hoop, might this restrict seat mounting I wonder? Obviously the Clio is a pretty small car, so I wonder if a harness bar might limit how far back the seats could be mounted? Can't think what it would be like off-hand.

 

[Pauleds]

If you look at the pic on safety devices website of the unpainted cage, the rear double cross and harness bar are totally different. It actually looks correct in this pic

Yes I would definitely prefer the harness bars to be like this cage, which is pretty much like my photo.
Could SD check to see why there are differences between the test cage and the one in Hyperhatch car @SafetyDevicesDaniel

 

[AdamCup]

@markfishy installed the cage, perhaps he can provide more info ?

 

[SafetyDevicesDaniel]

Hi All,

Thanks for the feedback, always useful. Nice to hear about the excellent service from Mark Fish too!
It seems there are a few similar comments regarding harness bar, so I'll try to clarify.

Given this is a production roll cage which must fit a range of drivers and seat types, we have to err on the side of caution to ensure we are compliant. That means we place the harness bar in the backstay assembly rather than the main hoop, to provide clearance for taller drivers.

Although it is allowable to have harnesses up to 10 degrees above horizontal, this is not recommended for Frontal Head Restraints (FHR's) such as HANS. It is recommended that harnesses are angled between 0 and -20 degrees for FHR’s, with a maximum of -45 degrees allowable.

Obviously the angle of the harnesses will change depending upon how far forward or rearward the seat is positioned, as well as the height off the floor pan. So for shorter drivers with seats mounted as low as possible, the angle will be near 0 degrees. However, for taller drivers the angle will be nearer 20 degrees or greater. We have tried to position the harness bars in the best position for everyone.

With regards to the dash bar, the tube is not cut. We cut one small tab to allow the clearance required, which I will post a photo of later today or tomorrow.

Thanks

Daniel