First Car Project - Clio 172 PH1

[Touring_Rob]

Clutch is normally heavy. New cable improves then a lot for a while.

If you have an engine crane you can have engine out the too within an hour. It's really a piece of piss while under looks a struggle.

 

[Jakeeaton127]

So the gearbox was fine, and the only thing that's happened is your brother was rowing the gearstick about while stationary with the engine off and that's what's leading you to believe there's a complete failure of the box?

And you haven't yet disconnected the linkage from the box and attempted to put the box in each gear from underneath the car?

gearbox was fine, my brother slammed it into all the gears with the engine off the then the next day the car was stalled in reverse and then the gearbox had gone.

Haven’t tried disconnecting the linkage, decided to align it first and after about 15 attempts we reckon it’s the box as there was 0 difference whatsoever. After that many tried i’d suspect there would be some kind of a difference.

It seems to go into gear fine, i can hear the selector move into reverse on the box. it’s like there’s a break in between the selector and the selector fork

 

[Jakeeaton127]

Clutch is normally heavy. New cable improves then a lot for a while.

If you have an engine crane you can have engine out the too within an hour. It's really a piece of piss while under looks a struggle.

I reckoned the clutch would be fine. A cable can be a job for the future i reckon.

i don’t have a crane personally, but i may know a someone who does. Dependent whether it fits in the back of an 01 plate Fiesta mainly. i’ll ask him now.

 

[TheBandit]

What's the saying, you can lead a horse to water?

 

[MAXRUNDOWN]

gearbox was fine, my brother slammed it into all the gears with the engine off the then the next day the car was stalled in reverse and then the gearbox had gone.

Haven’t tried disconnecting the linkage, decided to align it first and after about 15 attempts we reckon it’s the box as there was 0 difference whatsoever. After that many tried i’d suspect there would be some kind of a difference.

You're jumping in two feet first for probably no reason at all, it seems like your 'mechanic' friend is selling you down the river.

Whatever state of unnecessarily dismantled it currently is, it's going to be significantly quicker, cheaper and easier to do as we all have recommended which is to put it back together to the point where you can discount the linkage/alignment and manually put it into each gear on the gearbox to prove or disprove that the gearbox is the issue.

Pulling the engine and box out of the top isn't hard, but based on how things have gone so far with the work you've already done I'd try the simple things first.

 

[Jakeeaton127]

You're jumping in two feet first for probably no reason at all, it seems like your 'mechanic' friend is selling you down the river.

Whatever state of unnecessarily dismantled it currently is, it's going to be significantly quicker, cheaper and easier to do as we all have recommended which is to put it back together to the point where you can discount the linkage/alignment and manually put it into each gear on the gearbox to prove or disprove that the gearbox is the issue.

Pulling the engine and box out of the top isn't hard, but based on how things have gone so far with the work you've already done I'd try the simple things first.

It’s currently at the point where the subframe and all that would be the next to come off it. It’s not too much work to sling the end plate, mounts and battery back onto it with some fresh box oil.

I’m going to do it tomorrow once i finish work, spend a few hours on it before it goes pitch black just to try it. I probably should have tried it but i lost all patience and gave the go ahead to take the end plate off.

If the box is the issue, i can still go pick up the one i have lined up for it this weekend. If it’s not, then i’ll be glad i did.

I’ve just spoke to my mate about it and his exact words were “sh*t, i forgot to do that but im 100% sure linkages goes all the way into the reverse position. Still worth a try though” Definitely going to be trying it then.

 

[Louis]

Disconnect the linkage, can you manually change gear on the box?

 

[Jakeeaton127]

i completely forgot to do it last weekend. Mainly as i thought about scrapping the thing as i couldn’t be bothered with it any longer

 

[AUS-172]

If i had of know the gearbox would go i’d have just taken the whole engine and gearbox out to do it and the belts but i think it’ll be staying in. Mainly as i can’t be arsed but i’ll speak to my mates who will be helping to see what they thinking about pulling the engine.

I highly doubt it’s the linkages at this point, nothing was catching at all and with the noise it made. It sounded like something deep within the box rather then some kind of linkage isssue.

As for reverse, it’s worked well up until this point i’ve drove it in reverse multiple times. As i’ve mentioned before, my brother was swinging off the gearknob and then the box has gone. Very important lesson already learnt. The release bearing squealed when i first got the car, it seems to have gone better over time but on start up a squeal does come from that kind of area then goes away. Not a clue what that is hopefully it fixes itself.

I have found a full guide on here of doing it so it can’t be that hard on axle stands. People said the timing belt was horrible but it wasn’t too bad in my mind.

Are the Clutches on these normally heavy? Mines got some weight to it, i’m not sure if that’s normal for one of these. I haven’t driven another 172 or anything older than a 13 plate so i’ve got no idea.

They aren't an especially heavy pressure plate, no.

BUT, being cable clutch, they have a pretty distinct feel which I guess could be called 'heavy'.


EDIT - re: gearbox. It can be done on axle stands or a hoist and lower it out with the frame halfway dropped, but it's a s**t job. Engine/box out is the only way I do mine now. If you want to replace sump gaskets/thermostat gaskets and s**t while you're there, I'd be yanking the lot. Will also give you a chance to clean the bay and tidy up some bits and pieces that you can't otherwise get to.

 

[Struggler]

Clutch is normally pretty heavy as they cable.

I think, just to keep the peace, you need to drop the linkage and try and select the gears on the box manually. Just to shut everyone up!

 

[Jakeeaton127]

that’s why i’m doing it, im pretty much convinced it’s the box but what do i know? Im not exactly a specialist in these Clios yet. I guess i’ll find out today or tomorrow.

 

[TheBandit]

It's possible its completely fucked, but at least do the easy check to see if it is! Assume makes and Ass out of U and Me

 

[Jakeeaton127]

i should have checked the forums before stripping it down, would have made me remember to do it. Wish i did now, would have saved me a job.

It’ll be having a new linkage either way, the one on it is probably original so is a bit crusty. There isn’t a difference between ph1 and ph2 linkages are there?

 

[Jakeeaton127]

that went incredibly wrong. Long story short, my idiot mates have essentially thrown all the bolts around the floor. So i've had a great time fixing it.

I bolted the lower mount in, and decided to unbolt the linkage and go from there. How do i get it into reverse from this position?

It’s very stiff and won’t go into any gears other than what i’m guessing is 5th which i have 0 idea why. That’s a tomorrow job.

 

[MAXRUNDOWN]

You get the box into reverse by pushing the selector up/in and back.

Stop your mates from touching your car , it's good to get into the habit of putting any fasteners you remove into small zip lock bags that you can label, or into plastic meal prep trays. It'll save you major headaches in future

 

[Jakeeaton127]

Makes sense with the box. it seems a bit stuck but i don’t know that could be me. we shall see tomorrow i didnt put gearbox oil in as i need to make a tool but i wouldnt have thought that would be a big issue with the engine off

I had all the bolts sorted out into a cardboard boxes but thats pretty much useless now. Not a clue where some of them go or what bolts where, can’t be that hard.

 

[AUS-172]

Makes sense with the box. it seems a bit stuck but i don’t know that could be me. we shall see tomorrow i didnt put gearbox oil in as i need to make a tool but i wouldnt have thought that would be a big issue with the engine off

I had all the bolts sorted out into a cardboard boxes but thats pretty much useless now. Not a clue where some of them go or what bolts where, can’t be that hard.

skip to 36:17 to see the manual gear selection process.

Watching the video is going to be better than us trying to explain it in words. BUT, the basic premise is that the shaft goes 'in and out' of the box (if you're on your back under the car, it is 'up and down'.. and it also goes back and forth (towards the passenger side inner CV or towards the front of the vehicle. They can be a bit stiff, but should still be able to move it by hand without too many dramas.

 

[Jakeeaton127]

i tried again last night and the shifter on the box seems to be unhappy. It won’t go into any gears still, obviously no box oil but i didn’t think that would be the issue. I’m going to try again tonight when i have more time. Anyone have an idea why?