Helix 4 paddle clutch - Help!!!

[Cupman29]

Was just about to fit the clutch again and notices where the clutch and pressure plate are in contact it is only touching about 30% of the friction area. Is this normal or is something wrong with it?

Wear is even across the flywheel side of the clutch.

Cheers

 

[sprintcup]

That doesn't look correct to me, have you had the flywheel lightened or the face machined and how doe's it look bolted up, I'd contact Helix first and ask, I'd also put a machined straight edge across the padels to check the are flat along with the flywheel as the old clutch may have worn the flywheel a few thou.

Regards Russ......

 

[Cupman29]

This is on the pressure plate side. The flywheel side is getting even contact.

I can see where the clutch plate is touching the pressure plate. Both plates look flat when off and were torqued to 20nm as specified in the instructions.

I've fitted it again and I'll see how it goes but still think it ain't right.

 

[sprintcup]

This is on the pressure plate side. The flywheel side is getting even contact.

I can see where the clutch plate is touching the pressure plate. Both plates look flat when off and were torqued to 20nm as specified in the instructions.

I've fitted it again and I'll see how it goes but still think it ain't right.

Ahh sorry didn't read it correctly, I'd still give them a call and see if they could diagnose the problem from the photo .

Regards Russ......

 

[Fred@BTM]

stupid question, it is on the right way round i assume? (i know its obvious!)

 

[Dan519]

stupid question, it is on the right way round i assume? (i know its obvious!)

looks like it if that is the pressure pkate side shown, however it does look like something is pushing the centre.

how tight are the splines on the main shaft to the clutch plate

 

[sprintcup]

I was gunna ask this but thought he'd have noticed as they are marked up flywheel side etc, I had an AP lug drive clutch on the Pug and this ran with small rebates in the PTS flywheel for correct clearance but assume this is just an OE replacement paddle.

Regards Russ............

 

[Cupman29]

I tried fitting it the other way and the cover would not go over it so presume it will only go on one way round. The splines are not tight and it slips on easy when lined up ok.

I'm going to give it all a good check over with a clock gauge tomorrow night to see if there is a run out somewhere. The flywheel side looks like it is making good contact but this might be deflecting the clutch plate or something that is causing the poor contact on the other side. Just. Talking to myself now! lol

 

[sprintcup]

Just a quick reply, you can get these paddles re-tipped, I used to give my old paddle to SkipBrown as this is what will wear first, this way I used to get 2 seasons out of one assembley as these are not ideal on a rd car, used to cost about £60-00 cheaper than going direct that's if they sell them seperate, did it come with a release bearing as the one with the AP unit was bigger over it's diameter but narrower looking end on, hope you sort it.

Regards Russ...........

 

[Cupman29]

Cheers for your input Russ. Came with a release bearing but will look into others that can be used.

The car won't be used on the road as it is a track car and eventually a race car if I don't take a sledge hammer to it! Lol

 

[Cupman29]

Had a good look around all the potential causes of this issue and think I have found something.

The flyweel is perfectly flat and evenly worn. When checked with the clock gauge there was only 0.07mm run out.

The paddle plate is perfectly flat also other than the slightly worn outer edge. It measures 6.75mm from face to face and 6.65mm at the outer edge.

Now, the cover plate is not flat but neither is the spare OE cover plate I have. When I placed a straight edge across the plate and checked the gap from outer to inner edge, there is a 0.5mm gap and you can see where the contact has been.

When I checked the OE plate the same way, there was a 0.25mm gap or run with even wear.

As far as I can see my choices are:

1) skim the face of the Helix cover plate but is ther meant to be some run out from outer to inner edges?
2) use the OE cover plate I have but will this work as good as a good helix unit would at the power level I want to go for?
3) buy a new cover plate from helix and put this down to a lesson learnt.

Appreciate any input again!

Steven

 

[mikekean]

I know this is one hell of a thread revival but has anyone else had this issue with helix paddle clutches? I've had 3 do this to me now and i'm beginning to think these clutches are utter dog s**t. I'm pretty confident that a pressure plate should not go concave and they definitely aren't concave when new out the box.

Cheers

Mike

 

[Cupman29]

I think they are not heat stable and warp under extreme heat. Once this happens, the pressure plate can be machined flat and it doesn't do it again.

It's a pig to machine but can be done.

 

[Laine_16v]

Mine has been perfect with abuse at 400bhp / 360ft lb

 

[Cupman29]

Mine has been perfect with abuse at 400bhp / 360ft lb

Have you inspected the pressure plate since fitting?

Maybe some are better than others.

 

[mikekean]

Have you inspected the pressure plate since fitting?

Maybe some are better than others.

I think my 3 would say different unless I've just been really unlucky! The clutch does see around 40 hard starts a year though most of those within a two day period with 10 minutes of absolute abuse each time on hot rally tyres, but I'm only running 195hp and I don't dump the clutch other than the starts so still think there a pile of rubbish for competition use. We have to remember it might run 400hp all day long on the road but put that car in an endurance race or a rally, would it last..

 

[Laine_16v]

Hi guys,i finally got round to removng my engine, i have inspected the clutch apart from it *just* starting to nibble at the rivets (dammit more expense) the clutch has worn perfectly even. The pressure plate is also fin i know it doesnt really nelpmyou guys, but heres some pictures for comparison.

 

[RS Charlie]

FWIW I plan to use my Helix 4 paddle with a stock clutch cover in my RS Turbo (a 220mm cover). Unlike a Clio clutch a stock item will only take 150BHP before it starts to slip. I understand that with the hybrid setup people are running 250ish BHP with no slipping issues.

It will also be far nicer to drive . I know I dread driving the RST with the clutch and no one will move the car for me if they have attempted to move it before.