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Help needed! 182 Trophy 173 (Video)



  182 Trophy
Hi everyone, I'm new to ClioSport, but have read several previous threads regarding 182's.

I need some advice regarding my 182 Clio Trophy, No 173/500. The main issue is a very lumpy idle, so much so that the car is physically shaking at times, particularly when the engine is cold.

I've had 173 for just over a year, and in that time I've had a lot of remedial work done to the car by a local RenaultSport privateer garage, including:
  • Full timing belt, aux belt tensioner service
  • New spark plugs, battery & alternator
  • New rear Sachs shocks
  • Both front wheel bearings replaced
The timing belt service was done around 4 months ago, and around that time the garage noted a slight misfire, I presume not related to timing obviously.

Then in the last 2 months the car was idling really poorly, not starting well at all, and clearly misfiring on throttle with surging and stalling at low revs, particularly when the engine was cold. So 2 weeks ago I took the car to a pretty well respected general diagnostic/repair garage at the end of my road, who put it on their professional code reader. They confirmed the misfire, and also stated the car threw out an error code involving, and I quote, "an electro valve, or the bypass air valve".

I rang Renault who had no idea what sensor or valve this was, but I wondered (after a quick google) whether or not it could be the idle air control valve. But on further reading, the F4R engine in the 182 doesn't have an IAC, it only has a sensor embedded in the throttle body, which does the same thing via the ECU. Just to be safe I took my original throttle body off, and gave it a thorough clean with carb cleaner.

Since then I've also fitted brand new HT leads, new ignition coil, and also bought & fitted a fully functional used throttle body off eBay. I've also removed, cleaned and refitted the MAP sensor.

As expected, the starting issues have completely gone, the car now starts first time every time. The throttle feels a lot better, with no surging at low revs. The lumpy idle is slightly better, particularly when the engine is up to temp, but first thing or when cold, the engine still judders significantly, enough to shake me when I'm sat in the car at the lights.

So I'm not sure if I should just accept that all of the issues are slightly better, or if there is anything else I can do? I should add that I am a complete novice, and this is the first time I've ever touched an engine, so consider any advice to a complete lay person!

I've uploaded a short video of the idle for reference, this is with the car at just about normal running temps, and still judders significantly.

Cheers

 

Mbeau

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 172
Set of four new genuine injectors from Renparts are around £130 posted and are always a good idea to replace if still on original ones. They seem to cause loads of idle issues.

It would be worth reading the lambda sensors on live data. I recently had a 182 that was running really rough on idle from cold. Replaced pre-cat lambda with a new one and all good! The lambda sensor often causes EML to come on, but not always.

The code the garage mentioned is probably to do with noise suppressor valve on front nearside behind the bumper. I can't remember the exact code, but they all seem to come up with it and will be nothing to do with the running issues @182Trophy173
 
  182 Trophy
@Mbeau and @Coops Mk1 thanks for the replies.

I've checked the injectors over the weekend with the very unscientific 'squirt onto cardboard' method! Actually the spray from each injector looked reasonably even. But the injectors themselves were heavily corroded, and a pain to get out, so almost certainly could do with being changed. So I think it would be sensible to get them changed.

I will definitely also change the lambda sensor, if I can figure out how to do it myself, as it looks like a fairly cheap fix.

Cheers for the advice.
 

Mbeau

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 172
Lambda sensor is 22mm spanner to remove. It is the sensor before the cat you want to change. There is one plug that can be a bit fiddly to get at and undo.

I don't reckon your method of testing the injectors is fail safe 😂 Another way of doing it is to test the ohms rating of each one. Will try and link to a guide on here for you. If they are heavily corroded I would guess they are probably original and definitely worth replacing for the cost. The do eventually seem to fail. One less thing to worry about!
 

Darren S

ClioSport Club Member
Prior to you obtaining the car, was there any evidence of cam work being done - perhaps new valves as well?

It could be that you're just seeing the legacy of mechanical changes being done that after your initial fixes, are now just to be expected? Mine is definitely more lumpy from cold with the pistons, cams and remap that I've had done - but I knew that would be the case and it settles down quickly enough anyway. I strangely have grown to like it.

I wouldn't have said that your engine sounds particularly 'odd' and as others, would have pointed to injectors as being the likely culprit. I wish I'd recorded what mine sounded like when one of the OEM injectors let go - it was on par with a really unhealthy Scooby burble.

edit - how are the tips on your exhaust pipes? Are they overly blackened?
 
  182 Trophy
@Darren S Thanks for the reply. Now you mention it, yes the exhaust tips are very black, and will blacken up very quickly after a wash and scrub. What does this suggest?

I've had a small oil leak on the car during the last year. The cam cover was taken off by my local RS garage and re-sealed at the same time of doing the big belt service. The oil leak hasn't 100% gone, but is almost none existent compared to before, but it does look like there might be a small leak still happening from somewhere. I'm still in touch with the previous owner of the car, and to my knowledge its never had any cam/piston work or remaps done.

This week the car has felt better than ever actually, in terms of starting, throttle response and pull. But that juddering idle is still present.
 

Darren S

ClioSport Club Member
@Darren S Thanks for the reply. Now you mention it, yes the exhaust tips are very black, and will blacken up very quickly after a wash and scrub. What does this suggest?

I've had a small oil leak on the car during the last year. The cam cover was taken off by my local RS garage and re-sealed at the same time of doing the big belt service. The oil leak hasn't 100% gone, but is almost none existent compared to before, but it does look like there might be a small leak still happening from somewhere. I'm still in touch with the previous owner of the car, and to my knowledge its never had any cam/piston work or remaps done.

This week the car has felt better than ever actually, in terms of starting, throttle response and pull. But that juddering idle is still present.
When mine had blackened tips, it was diagnosed as being a faulty upstream oxygen sensor - which when replaced seemed to sort out the issue.

I didn't in all fairness notice any change in smoothness of idle, or effect on MPGs (if it was over-fuelling) - but for certain, it wouldn't be doing your CAT any good if left unfixed for a long time, I would have thought?
 

whereislee

ClioSport Club Member
  182 Trophy
sounds like injectors possibly. I had injector 3 go on my car which resulted in me changing all 4 (also threw a misfire code). it was a quick 10 minute job removing the fuel rail protector. Never heard of an o2 sensor on any car causing a violent idle.
 


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