How do you get rid of a 182 body roll

[zakprice]

i did a track day in my 182 and like the title says i want to try and get rid of some of the body roll. Does a whitetline rear arb do this?

I have got eibach sport lines and PS3 tyres, thanks.

Zak

 

[182jwilliams]

Rarb decent coilovers some track tyres r888, rsr, ad08/048 etc. If you have enough get new bushes. Try some camber aswell, coilovers will help though. I've heard soft side walls and soft springs are the main thing, I have cooksports with rsr and last time I was on track I was getting a lot of body roll. Im running -2.3 camber now. I'm sure someone will come along and correct me if I'm wrong

 

[bozothenutter]

Basically only stiffer springs or anti roll bar will give less roll , at a cost ofcourse. NorthloopCup on here has made a rollcentre correction kit...the thinking mans solution....

 

[Steven103]

Bozo's got the gist of it in one line.

As a point of interest sticky tyres will actually significantly increase body roll since you're putting more lateral g through the car. The main thing to grasp is that body roll is only bad for "dynamic" camber angle (so the camber angle when the car is cornering, as opposed to in a straight line or stationary) and doesn't really have much to do with anything else.

Stiffer springs (i.e. a decent quality set of coilover dampers) will go a long way to reducing body roll and sorting out this "dynamic camber angle" doo-daa.

A rear anti roll bar is mainly used to improve the front/rear balance of weight xfer (hence oversteer/understeer) and many people will recommend it as a really worthwhile modification. Due to the type of suspension used on the rear of a Clio the fact that a RARB reduces body roll is not very important at all.


So yeah. Manage the dynamic camber angle & weight xfer = fast. Stiff springs are the only cost-effective way to improve the dynamic camber angle. RARB is a very easy & cost effective way to improve weight xfer.

Other weight xfer stuff, e.g. spacers, stripping the interior, lowering the C of G all have other complications/considerations.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Or in lay mans terms, spend £2500 on the right things and your laughing. That's for brand new stuff of course and includes fitting and setup of geo in that price.

 

[zakprice]

ah right, so i was thinking a set of ktec coilovers and a whiteline arb?

 

[NorthloopCup]

ah right, so i was thinking a set of ktec coilovers and a whiteline arb?

I don't think the ktec coilovers are designed with track use in mind tbh mate. You'd possibly be better off buying gaz coilovers if your on a budget. Other than that your looking at about 1k for premium coilovers (kw's bilsteins Ast sportline 1's)

Whats your purpose for the car? Track car or occasional track action?

A lot of people rave about the whiteline arb so you should be fine.

 

[zakprice]

NorthloopCup i do a maybe 5 track days a year. I did one at Oulton Park on tuesday and it had good turn in. just had a lot of lift off overs tear and body roll. Which was making me nervous to corner faster.

My sport line springs are good and a lot better than standard. I want to see what i can do that will fix my problem of body roll, to make me chuck it in at higher speed and have a solid car.

 

[NorthloopCup]

@NorthloopCup i do a maybe 5 track days a year. I did one at Oulton Park on tuesday and it had good turn in. just had a lot of lift off overs tear and body roll. Which was making me nervous to corner faster.

My sport line springs are good and a lot better than standard. I want to see what i can do that will fix my problem of body roll, to make me chuck it in at higher speed and have a solid car.

Sounds to me like you need a set of bilsteins or kw's then mate really. If your suffering oversteer now and rear arb is the last thing you need as well. What tyres you running?

 

[TheEvilGiraffe]

TBQFH.. It sounds like some driver training might be needed.

Stiffer it is, the more susceptible to LOOS it will be to some extent..

Why are you lifting off mid corner anyway ? A little bit of oversteer is fine because you might want to tuck the front end in a little... grabbing armfuls of lock is not.

What tyres and what hot pressures were you running ?

 

[bozothenutter]

I always thought the liftoff oversteer was the point if these clios.
It is soo easy to controll...it builds confidence.
Going stiffer will probably make it more snappy.

 

[zakprice]

Pilot sort 3 tyres. and was running 30 psi hot pressures

 

[zakprice]

i have done 10 years of karting so i know how to drive i think . i was thinking a set ofbilsteins then.

 

[Adamm.]

Bilsteins still have a bit of roll tbh, if its a road car though the bilsteins are brilliant. Its not all about being mega stiff.

 

[TheEvilGiraffe]

i have done 10 years of karting so i know how to drive i think . i was thinking a set ofbilsteins then.

Every day is a school day .. Even someone like Tony Hunter will tell you we've all got something to learn.

 

[zakprice]

TheEvilGiraffe yes that is true.

 

[Cub.]

As Adamm. rightly points out, Bilsteins will still have roll when pushed hard. Here is mine, with Bilstein B14s, Whiteline ARB and a cage. Still rolling slightly. But...i've found my Bilsteins are the perfect balance between track and road. I'd go with ASTs if it was track only tbh.

 

[Steven103]

Flame red looks so good when it's cared for!

 

[Cupman29]

Here's mine at the hairpin at knockhill on kw v2's. Body roll still there but vastly improved over cup setup.

 

[...]

i have done 10 years of karting so i know how to drive i think . i was thinking a set ofbilsteins then.

if you have done 10 years of karting and no car circuit work you will have a problem your not maybe aware of.
it will also make bodyroll worse.
Karting tends to draw track drivers into taking way too much cornerspeed in ,if you have decent turn in then it will give alot,of bodyroll due to increased weight transfer.

Bodyroll needs 3 things looking into

arb stiffness
spring rates
sidewall stiffness of the tyre.

you need to find a balance between spring/arb stiffness and tyre grip at both turn in and mid corner .

dont forget the only suspention in a kart chassis is chassis and axle flex , these are massively stiff compared to roadcar springs and have huge controllable effect s they wind up and release.

karting is affected massively by corner release as there is no weight trnsfer in the sme way you have in a car as you have little to no bodyroll ,huge grip levels and thus carry huge realtive corner speeds .

karters tend to like the following in their car setups as a result

strong front end
happy with loose rear but not too much
flat cornering with little bodyroll.

hope that helps as the transition between the 2 disaplines is easier when you get to grips with the dynamics in your head

 

[warwickstingray]

Makes a change from people moaning about understeer because they drive from turn in to exit with the throttle planted.

 

[zakprice]

harvsurrey you are right. karting is all about good turn in and a light rear to slide around. I know i can't get rid of all of the body roll, just want to try and minimise the roll. Cars are completely different to karts and no one can say they are the same. I will do small changes might start with a ARB and see how that helps and change bits one bit at a time

 

[...]

stiffer springs and anti roll bars are the first thing , but how soft are your sidewalls , a set of 888's or yoko 48's would substantially help

 

[Ph1 Tom]

AST sportline 1. Nice enough on the road and a bit more 'trackday' than the B14s. The B14 are very good though.

With the RARB I thought I noticed a difference after fitting it, but I definitely didn't notice a difference after removing it!

The biggest improvements I've noticed in mine are:-

Proper diff, I've got a Quaife but Gripper do one too.
Decent coilovers
Roll centre correction kit

Those 3 will give you better turn in, less roll, less understeer and better traction. The downside is about £3000...