182cup & 172 racecar
It's just nice to do the same speeds without the engine screaming it's nut's off, well imo anyway.
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LSD - talk to me
- Thread starter Cup_Phil
- Start date
It's just nice to do the same speeds without the engine screaming it's nut's off, well imo anyway.
Ohh yes mate I didn't really think of it in that way
Just noticed this thread phil, for fitting the diff to your box go see MTM transmissions in north Hykeham, they rebuilt my box
Ooooooh I could probably carry it to them lol
They are standard renault parts, from a diesel box IIRC
Interesting :approve:
I have the gripper diff in my track car with an adapted standard ratio CW.
I was thinking of going for the 5.2 final drive but thought it bunched all the gears a bit close together.
Perhaps the 4.54 final drive with the 0.89 5th gear might be the best of both worlds.
I cant comment without knowing more about your car and what you use it for etc, on my turbo for example I know that a lower FD would just make me slower by making me change gear a lot more, but I have a monster spread of torque compared to an N/A engine, but it does go to show what an individual choice it needs to be, as even two N/A engines will still have different requirements.
182cup & 172 racecar
Its a megan 5th gear..
James Ashton has got it I believe, drop him a PM. (username: bigash)
182cup & 172 racecar
Yes james should have the part no, as he's just had his done.
Think there are twa parts to buy.
If not martin at agencey transmissions has them in stock.
Think there are twa parts to buy.
If not martin at agencey transmissions has them in stock.
Anything charged,certainly doesn't need a shorter 5th IMO. My one where I was hitting 130ish in the NA car, I'm hitting over 150 in the supercharged one.
NorthloopCup
ClioSport Moderator
That is very impressive dan!! Imo the shorter 5th is only really needed for n/a cars as they need all the help they can get to keep them buzzing along.
Around 170 flat out in my turbo, but it needs a lot of space to get upto it, just about cracks 150 on track on the big straights. Thats on ph1 gearing and 205 tyres.
The ph2 gearing is perfect for around 150, I got just over 150 out of our old rs2+197 cams 172 but it took about 4 miles and was pulling over 7500rpm IIRC
NorthloopCup
ClioSport Moderator
The Astra used to pull 174 on the limiter in 5th with around 2miles required to get there. That's from a standing start as well. Did it twice and bid it f**k after that! Lol
NorthloopCup
ClioSport Moderator
Thats interesting to read as well chip. My new engine *should* be around the 220-230hp region so it'll be interesting to see what it pulls flat out. I'll be going to 8k ish as well, although I must be honest the interest or desire to go that fast has dwindled somewhat nowadays.
Yeah its not something I'd do often, puts a massive amount of thermal strain on the engine holding it flat out in fifth like that.
Its about 22mph per Krpm on the turbo, so 170 is about 7700rpm where the power has really died off (although must be heat related as if it died off as much on the road as it did on the rollers it couldnt even pull that, so the extra airflow in the intercooler etc must really help), and it takes a proper age to get to it. 150 though it still pulls quite hard at.
I'd have thought on some of the longer sections at the ring you will see 7500rpm/150mph if you are making that sort of power.
I really need to get mine on the rollers. It never seems to die off,'I think the power graph will be very similar to that of my 197 rs2'd one.
Yeah I think so too with the way the boost just builds bit by bit as the revs increase to counteract any drop in VE.
Should be a really flat torque curve I would think.
It'll step at 3k and again at 5 but will be fairly flat I expect.
Interesting update to this. The M Factory diff is coming in under £700 and apparently is a straight fit without any machining required!
NorthloopCup
ClioSport Moderator
I'd be interested to see how they fit the crownwheel then.
Aye. Unless it comes with one?
Do they ask you if you have a ph1 or ph2 box when you order?
if not how can they supply the right teeth. And even if they do, crownwheel and pinion are best treated as a matched pair as they do wear together.
I suspect whoever gave you the information is simply wrong for this particular fitment even though it would be true of say a vauxhall box (just like gripper and quaiffe)
Also if it does include a helical crownwheel (very expensive to make!) why the hell isn't it much dearer than other mfactory diffs which all just bolt on the standard crownwheel?
I'm very confident whoever you spoke to is just clueless.
try and get some more details, it would be nice if I was wrong but it seems unlikely sadly.
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I believe from speaking to avanti a few years ago, that the crown wheel is 'sweat' fitted, so I guess that's what they mean by it's not needing machining, just a lot of heat lol.
Essentially the same as the quaiffe then, the only really difficult bit is getting it off the original Renault diff. It's then just a case of heating the crownwheel to fit, with a simple slot for a ball bearing as an extra fail safe.
So 700 for the mfactory and then you need to pay someone to remove the standard crownwheel and fit it to the diff. Or 900 for the quaiffe including that.
Still a small saving to be had as won't cost 200 to get done I'm sure. But for such a small difference I'd sooner stick with the easy to sell on quaiffe with an English based lifetime warranty tbh.
Yeah I'm with you there Chip.
It's £680 ish incl. vat but then gearbox needs stripping and rebuilding, and the crownwheel will need removing and heat fitting to the new diff. So probably still looking at £1100
My other concern is that if I do that I'll have to just pick a gearbox company and hope they do a good job - whereas if I stick the gearbox in the boot and take it to Agency - leave it with them for a week and they can send the crownwheel off to quaife. Then I know quaife & agency have a reputation of getting everything right on Clios. Worth a couple of trips to birmingham in my eyes. And like you say a rebuilt cup gearbox with quaife LSD won't lose much money.
Right... stick to plan A then lol
It's £680 ish incl. vat but then gearbox needs stripping and rebuilding, and the crownwheel will need removing and heat fitting to the new diff. So probably still looking at £1100
My other concern is that if I do that I'll have to just pick a gearbox company and hope they do a good job - whereas if I stick the gearbox in the boot and take it to Agency - leave it with them for a week and they can send the crownwheel off to quaife. Then I know quaife & agency have a reputation of getting everything right on Clios. Worth a couple of trips to birmingham in my eyes. And like you say a rebuilt cup gearbox with quaife LSD won't lose much money.
Right... stick to plan A then lol
I think andyrg was selling a noisey cup box for peanuts.
If you got that and pulled it apart you'd have a crownwheel and pinion then so you could give me the diff with crownwheel on and I could give it to my mate to take on his next trip to quaiffe. Then when it's sorted I can drop the new diff off to you. (It's not much of a detour when I'm working in London for me to go via his place)
That way you don't have to get agency to strip your box then post the diff to quaiffe for you then have your box sat around in bits waiting for the diff to come back etc, which is something I think they will be keen to avoid tbh.
If you got that and pulled it apart you'd have a crownwheel and pinion then so you could give me the diff with crownwheel on and I could give it to my mate to take on his next trip to quaiffe. Then when it's sorted I can drop the new diff off to you. (It's not much of a detour when I'm working in London for me to go via his place)
That way you don't have to get agency to strip your box then post the diff to quaiffe for you then have your box sat around in bits waiting for the diff to come back etc, which is something I think they will be keen to avoid tbh.
Hrmm that's a pretty good idea - as then I can take the new LSD with crownwheel over to Agency and have them rebuild it into my box while I do a bit of shopping.
I'm sure I've read Tony say they will do a rebuild while you wait sort of thing somewhere.
I'm sure I've read Tony say they will do a rebuild while you wait sort of thing somewhere.
Ive had a few boxes done and always given them a couple of days between dropping and collection, but yes I believe its possible to do it in a day if you arrange with them. but obviously only if the diff is ready in advance.
Damn - missed out on andy's cup box. Think I best start trawling t'bay lol
Any phase 2 box will be fine as a donor for the crownwheel and pinion, and even if its got crunchy synchros etc its highly unlikely to have any damage to the CWP still IME, so you can buy pretty much any old toss for what you want to do. Doesnt matter if its a speed box or not either, so you can also use a 182 one.
Cool cheers mate - put up a wanted thread, hopefully someone has a whiney one they want rid of.
If cupman doesn't buy Andy's I'll run up to newcastle and grab that
If cupman doesn't buy Andy's I'll run up to newcastle and grab that
