Omex vs GEN90 vs EC-1

[Cup_Phil]

Following on from my ITB/Omex thread I have a choice to make

I'm fitting Jenveys next month and they come with an omex600 and loom

I'm not keen on the thought of having a dashboard lit up like a christmas tree, and I'm not keen on having the standard loom and ecu just sat there doing virtually nothing

Can anyone tell me exactly what the standard ecu is required for?
I'm assuming fuel pump, speedo, rev counter etc...
What is the UCH used for? Lights/indicators/windows? etc..?

From what I can gather I have a few options

1) Run the OMEX600 spliced into the TDC wiring on the renault loom and leave the standard ECU controlling the fuel pump and standard dashboard

2) Sell the OMEX600 and run a GEN90 or EC-1. Am I right in thinking both of these use the standard renault loom and ecu connector - and both of them can fully control the dash and warning lights etc...?

3) Ditch the standard renault ecu and wiring - wire the fuel pump into the ignition switch and fit a race technology dash2 for my dials


With regards to the Gen90 and EC-1 - if I went that way is the mapping software freely available for anyone to map them or do you get tied into going to KTR or TDF for the mapping?


Sorry it's a lot of questions but thanks for any replies

 

[bomber]

Hi Phil

GEN90 is the only plug and play unit. TDF EC1 will require splicing into the original loom or starting from scratch with a new loom, Omex do now offer an off the shelf loom for the clio, or were at least designing one a few months back.

personally, id rip it all apart and starting with new ecu, dash and remove the original engine loom, this wont be cheap but will be reliable.

EC1 can be mapped at TDF or RSTuning, Gen90 at ktec or RStuning (i believe RSTuning can) TDF can map the Gen90 but ktec put a password on it from what ive heard you cant then go elsewhere

 

[Fred@BTM]

You're in Lincoln? So RS tuning is closest to you really, speak to them, they can do anything

TDF and RST can map the Gen90 no problem

 

[Cup_Phil]

You see I'm leaning heavily towards using the Omex600 - I know it's old tech but it does a good job and as I've said before my mate here in Lincoln is a fantastic mapper and used to supply Omex so know's his s**t

The Race Technology Dash2 has an Omex600 interface cable and the dash+cable is £700+vat which isn't a lot
Then I could ditch the entire engine loom and the dash loom and run the Omex600 with the Dash2 for display and logging

What I can't get my head around is what else I'll loose
Presumably if I rip out the ECU and UCH I've got no indicators, alarm, central locking, lights, fog lights, brake lights etc.. etc..

And I'm starting to see £££££'s if I have to get a custom interior loom made up and then switches for everything on the dash etc...
Ideally I'd like to bin the renault ECU and engine loom off but keep the standard indicator and light stalks etc..

Hrmmmmmm
I kinda rushed into the Jenveys on a whim and now I'm not too sure what to do with everything else lol

 

[Dean.]

From my limited knowledge I'd go with a gen90

 

[Cup_Phil]

You're in Lincoln? So RS tuning is closest to you really, speak to them, they can do anything

TDF and RST can map the Gen90 no problem

I think it's a trust thing - I know RST have a great reputation and the Gen90 seems like a good ecu - but I've always used my mate at G&G Motorsport for everything car wise. Some of the maps I've seen him "fix" from other mappers makes me shudder
Plus I'd get mates rates

Whereas if I have to go to RST for the mapping it's gonna cost a lot more - and that's on top of the £700 extra I'd have to spend to swap my omex600 for a gen90

 

[Fred@BTM]

speak to the suppliers? Ring k-tec, ring TDF etc etc, it may not be as expensive as you think

 

[Fred@BTM]

RST do the EC-1 too

 

[Cup_Phil]

I think I'd get a Gen90 over an EC-1 purely from the point of view that it just plugs straight into the wiring loom that's already on the car and controls the dash etc...
EC-1 I'd have to get the CAN interface and get it all setup to work which is a bit more money I don't want to spend lol

I'll drop RS Tuning an email and ask for a price for the Gen90 fitted and mapped.
What happens with the TPS when you swap for jenveys as I'm assuming the standard one is part of the FBW system which i'll be ditching so the standard renault loom will need to be modded?

 

[Fred@BTM]

but the Gen90 costs more in the first place, so it will work out in the same ballpark roughly speaking

 

[Dean.]

^but without a spliced loom

 

[Fred@BTM]

nothing wrong with a spliced loom though?

£1K for the GEN90 + mapping, so call it £1300
EC-1 fitted and mapped is the same (if not a bit less) money

 

[Cup_Phil]

The gen90 could be unplugged and sold with the Jenveys at some point in the future without having to replace the loom.

It's a "neater" setup IMHO

 

[Dean.]

Unspliced loom > spliced loom

 

[Fred@BTM]

true, but its not exactly hard to swap out the loom!

 

[Fred@BTM]

Unspliced loom > spliced loom

why?

 

[Dean.]

Because then you don't have a cut up loom that could be avoided lol.. Neater.

Are you saying you would prefer to have a cut up loom than one that hasn't been cut up?

 

[Fred@BTM]

back at you

 

[Dean.]

Does look nice, I like tdf, Matt mapped my megane a few months ago. But if it was me I would go for gen90 still.

 

[Cup_Phil]

I think the only reason I keep leaning towards the OMEX is the software is free - anyone can map it - and it's very proven hardware

The Gen90 and EC-1 are relatively new and they're still locking down who can map it
When you have one of the top mappers in the UK across the road from you with a rolling road - it's kinda nice to be able to just pop across with any problems or for any tweeks to the map

It's just a shame you can't get rid of the standard ecu with the omex and keep the dashboard working

 

[Fred@BTM]

oh the Gen90 is fantastic, i just don't find your statement of a "spliced loom is naff" valid :rasp:

 

[Dean.]

I didn't say it was naff, but would just rather unslpliced if it was me

 

[Fred@BTM]

someone will be along to correct me shortly, but the Gen90 is a GEMS unit with a renault connector (in simple terms), and they've been using the same setup on evo's etc for ages, so i would assume anyone who can maps GEMS with a few bits of info here and there can map the Gen90

probably a bit more complicated than that, but you get the idea

 

[john182rs]

I personally would say the Gen90, i have one and its fine. OK yes i know the costs are high for them but unless you plan on keeping the car till it dies a sudden and horrible death then get the Omex.
If your planning on keeping it for a few years then selling it for some thing else, get a gen90 then in x amount of years time, reduce it back to standard without having some one to de-splice your omex costing you even more money. You can take it off, plug in your old one and job done.

 

[Cup_Phil]

I don't think the car will ever be going back to standard - it has a welded in cage and I've cut all the brackets out for carpet/seats etc.. LOL

I'll be keeping it as a track car for 5 years and then it will probably be scrapped

 

[Fred@BTM]

what you worrying about then? get on with it!

 

[Dan519]

Got to say, I think you're over thinking it a fair amount. just fit what you have (and thats from someone that sells alternatives)

If you didn't have an ECU I'd push a GEN90 for most of the reasons you've said already, it's an incredibly powerful bit of kit. BUT.....you already have a 600 which can do the vast majority of what you want

 

[Cup_Phil]

Yeah it's just all the warning lights on the dash and the renault ecu/wiring loom sitting there doing nothing - makes my OCD twitch

 

[chrispy.clio]

From my own personal experience second hand wiring looms can be a bit temperamental. 99% of the problems I have had with my ITB's have been to do with my loom been somewhat nackered!

Renault loom was a bit of a mess but it was mainly my fault. So for me it was easier to
Remove every last wire from my car and rewire it from scratch and build a new engine loom for my OMEX.

I would just fit your ITB's, OMEX ecu and loom and see how you get on. Pm me if you want a brand new OMEX 600 loom building.

 

[john182rs]

ya know all the lights in the middle of your dash, get some black electrical tape and cover them. Put the other thing in a box and put it in the attic = job done.

 

[Rhys Beal]

I used to run a DTA S80 pro and I am lead to believe they are easy enough to map?

Not considered a DTA ecu? Or are they very similar to the OMEX?

 

[Silent_Scone]

back at you

Wiring from this mother is getting here tomorrow

 

[Cup_Phil]

ya know all the lights in the middle of your dash, get some black electrical tape and cover them. Put the other thing in a box and put it in the attic = job done.

Which other thing? lol

 

[mark123]

I think your reasoning on using the OMEX is sound.

Having your mapper on the doorstep is very handy. I think I will go with OMEX (or some other platform "anyone" can map) for that reason.

The tech may be old but it's about the same age as your car so the two should be well suited, plus people have been running them on OMEX for years as you say.

It would be interesting to know the answers to your questions below:

Can anyone tell me exactly what the standard ecu is required for?
I'm assuming fuel pump, speedo, rev counter etc...
What is the UCH used for? Lights/indicators/windows? etc..?

 

[NorthloopCup]

Gen90 is GEMS software based for anyone who wants to know. Found out off a guy who has a lot of dealings with GEMS.

 

[Cup_Phil]

Just watched a rather lovely set of videos on K-Tecs site that go through the full ITB installation and setting up the Gen90
Must admit the Gen90 does look nice and I love the fact that they give you an adaptor so the new TPS connects into the renault loom too

But I think i'll stick with the Omex for now.

I think I'm gonna take Chrispy's advice and run it for a season next year. If I'm happy with how it performs I'll start ripping all the standard wiring out next autumn and put a stack dash in

 

[slindborg]

Anyone got a wiring diagram for the OEM dash, just to see if a little circuit could be made up to replace the OEM PCM functions that supply the dash (I assume its just the rev counter and EML (oh and shift light) ?

I hate these PCM suppliers that lock down the calibration software... their product might be 'great' (there is only so many ways to skin the cat of running and engine) but if the calibration software means you can only goto a few places for the work then its a big big big massive fail imho.

 

[Jonny1*2]

Just watched a rather lovely set of videos on K-Tecs site that go through the full ITB installation and setting up the Gen90
Must admit the Gen90 does look nice and I love the fact that they give you an adaptor so the new TPS connects into the renault loom too

But I think i'll stick with the Omex for now.

I think I'm gonna take Chrispy's advice and run it for a season next year. If I'm happy with how it performs I'll start ripping all the standard wiring out next autumn and put a stack dash in

vids? where is that? I'd stick with what you have mate. Oh and fyi, I was watching a omex 600 on ebay last week and it went for over £500, which I thought was a bit rich.

 

[Dan519]

I was watching a omex 600 on ebay last week and it went for over £500, which I thought was a bit rich.

omex 500's go for over £400 regularly, and they've not been made for nearly 10 years. Standalone ECU's barely devalue.

 

[Silent_Scone]

Theres some 600s listed new for the ECU alone for £600