Silver 197 losing to my vectra in manchester

[c__w]

But this is the whole point!!!!!!!!!

I wasnt pre arraged, yes the outcome might have been different if it was planned, but it wasnt, he simply states that in this instance he won!

There is no need for anyone to say 'yeah but if this happened' or 'if that happened it would be different' Thats doesnt matter!

The point is, which he states, he raced one and out dragged it, CS gets sooooo boring when every bloody road story turns into this type of thread with 100 people saying 'yeah but if this was different it wouldnt have won' etc.

I dont mean any nastiness here at all, but the whole what if sinario(sp) has got older than the hills now, why cant anyone simply say ok you beat him this time and bloody leave it is beond me

Calm down dear, because that's what it is, a "road story". I'm just hypothesising why the thread has got the posts it has i.e. I was trying to help answer your post from before where you were telling people to "get over it". It's because normally, a 4-up Vectra CDTi (chipped or otherwise) would not normally beat a lone driver in a near 200bhp hatch. However in this case it did, gold medals all round and an extra prize for posting a thread about it

These kind of "scenarios" are very subjective, that's why they always cause a big debate - I would be impressed if this thread had been a video of the Vectra catching and overtaking a 197 on a track where you can be definitely sure the driver of the 197 is trying. In these cases nobody is ever sure the other driver was on the ball because the outcome doesnt really match what should have happened so people are going to post that!

"On the road" a big car with high torque can be hustled very quickly on a b-road that's why I'm not surprised to hear the owner say on "runs" he can give other cars a scare but fast road driving isn't always down to the "driver" perse, it's more down to how much the driver will push on a public road but that's getting a bit OT now.

 

[Darren S]

I've learnt to never under-estimate oil-burners these days - ever since I was handed my arse in my PGGT by a 530d - and he was three up. He simply annihilated the Punto in a plume of black-grey smoke - lol.

For cheap £££ they can get a lot more wallop and this Vectra clearly has this. I really don't see the point in all this bickering on here. A Vectra diesel beat a 197. Just in the same way it could be a 182. Why flame the OP for it?

D.

 

[Russ_16v]

Calm down dear, because that's what it is, a "road story". I'm just hypothesising why the thread has got the posts it has i.e. I was trying to help answer your post from before where you were telling people to "get over it". It's because normally, a 4-up Vectra CDTi (chipped or otherwise) would not normally beat a lone driver in a near 200bhp hatch. However in this case it did, gold medals all round and an extra prize for posting a thread about it

These kind of "scenarios" are very subjective, that's why they always cause a big debate - I would be impressed if this thread had been a video of the Vectra catching and overtaking a 197 on a track where you can be definitely sure the driver of the 197 is trying. In these cases nobody is ever sure the other driver was on the ball because the outcome doesnt really match what should have happened so people are going to post that!

"On the road" a big car with high torque can be hustled very quickly on a b-road that's why I'm not surprised to hear the owner say on "runs" he can give other cars a scare but fast road driving isn't always down to the "driver" perse, it's more down to how much the driver will push on a public road but that's getting a bit OT now.

true mate,like i said i dont mean any nastiness towards you or anybody, im just fed up with about 5 posts being on topic and 100 being off topic how in other conditions it would have been different, which, lets be honest we all know that anyway

 

[c__w]

I've learnt to never under-estimate oil-burners these days - ever since I was handed my arse in my PGGT by a 530d - and he was three up. He simply annihilated the Punto in a plume of black-grey smoke - lol.

30d and 35ds are in another league, the quickest diesels around, you never know if that was chipped either, if they are they're as quick as an E46 M3 (in fact a 335d probably is from the factory).

 

[W17GLE]

Ask any racer, any real racer. It doesn't matter if you win by an inch or a mile; winning's winning

:rasp:

 

[superbenji88]

Your in low down force setup now you ripped your splitter off on my drive lol

 

[W17GLE]

Your in low down force setup now you ripped your splitter off on my drive lol

forgot about that i best sort it out. watch out for me in next years touring car championships lol.

this thread got far too serious.

 

[Joeh]

Lol that people are arguing about this, a 197 has less weight and more power, i cant believe people bum on about torque, dieselshave a much smaller powerband than most petrols nota bigger one, as clarkson said you get the tiniest miniscule of a power band then bang, its gone.

some people on here think torque is what makes things quick, my mates puntogrande has been mapped and has 300flb and 180bhp, my 172pulls away EVERY time. You only have to look at mapped dervs on quater miles, theyre slow as fook. Torque pulls caravans, bhp wins races people ffs.

 

[W17GLE]

Lol that people are arguing about this, a 197 has less weight and more power, i cant believe people bum on about torque, dieselshave a much smaller powerband than most petrols nota bigger one, as clarkson said you get the tiniest miniscule of a power band then bang, its gone.

some people on here think torque is what makes things quick, my mates puntogrande has been mapped and has 300flb and 180bhp, my 172pulls away EVERY time. You only have to look at mapped dervs on quater miles, theyre slow as fook. Torque pulls caravans, bhp wins races people ffs.

in standard for the power band is small but not when mapped. with out the map mine is s**t.

 

[Joeh]

LMFAO, even the lads on scoobynet are ripping this vectra bumboy now


Originally Posted by GTW

lol at this thread, we owned a 197 last night in a vectra 1.9CDTI and with 4 lads in the car.

Yeah, right, and there are fairies at the bottom of your garden too?

 

[W17GLE]

LMFAO, even the lads on scoobynet are ripping this vectra bumboy now


Originally Posted by GTW

lol at this thread, we owned a 197 last night in a vectra 1.9CDTI and with 4 lads in the car.

Yeah, right, and there are fairies at the bottom of your garden too?

lol gtw is my mate and is rexe on here. check out the thread "who owned an sti" on here

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

FLOL @ all this. so a tractor beat a 197. so what? i don't see why everyone has to try and defend the 197's honor!

 

[W17GLE]

FLOL @ all this. so a tractor beat a 197. so what? i don't see why everyone has to try and defend the 197's honor!

thank you. i was never getting at the 197 as a car just the driver as he shouldn't try to race if he's going to lose against a diesel barge.

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

thank you. i was never getting at the 197 as a car just the driver as he shouldn't try to race if he's going to lose against a diesel barge.

Precisely. Your on CS and have been for a while, Ergo: you like the RS's, but the 197 just lost this battle.

 

[Russ_16v]

Lol that people are arguing about this, a 197 has less weight and more power, i cant believe people bum on about torque, dieselshave a much smaller powerband than most petrols nota bigger one, as clarkson said you get the tiniest miniscule of a power band then bang, its gone.

some people on here think torque is what makes things quick, my mates puntogrande has been mapped and has 300flb and 180bhp, my 172pulls away EVERY time. You only have to look at mapped dervs on quater miles, theyre slow as fook. Torque pulls caravans, bhp wins races people ffs.

Look at Fabia vRS's, regularly run mid 14's on the 1/4, id say thats not very slow


And bhp on its own is pub talk, its torque and bhp combined in the right way that makes a car fast

 

[kingchrissyp]

My brother had a rover 25 diesel for a few years - 100 bhp as standard and after a remap with decat ,injectors etc was running about 150-160 bhp and when i had my Civic Type R couldn t get past until silly speeds as it weighs about the same as the Civic!
I ve now bought the car for the mrs to run about in and it s funny pulling away from cars that should really anhialate you,and leaving them in a black smoke cloud :approve:

 

[Craigus]

Look at Fabia vRS's, regularly run mid 14's on the 1/4, id say thats not very slow


And bhp on its own is pub talk, its torque and bhp combined in the right way that makes a car fast

Exactly, My vRS was mapped so it drove like a petrol, power came at about 4000 rpm instead of 1900 rpm. Was quicker than 1*2s that I had blasts with, but wasn't as fun as the 172 IMO.

 

[Naith]

if the 197's diffuser was in race mode he would of mullered you

 

[W17GLE]

if the 197's diffuser was in race mode he would of mullered you

i was in undercover police mode he probably got scared lol

 

[ed_brown95]

Got to admit that I had a go against a astra 1.9cdti and although I did it off the line after 20/30 mph it stuck with me. couldnt shake it. Think this driver must have made an error to start at the line, but to be honest i could see the vectra pulling away at like 20 or 30. especially with remap. torques make alot of difference once going!

 

[c__w]

Got to admit that I had a go against a astra 1.9cdti and although I did it off the line after 20/30 mph it stuck with me. couldnt shake it. Think this driver must have made an error to start at the line, but to be honest i could see the vectra pulling away at like 20 or 30. especially with remap. torques make alot of difference once going!

There was probably no error, just that diesel generally have pretty short 1st gears and lurch off the line, and generally don't have long 2nd or 3rd gears - it's related to the powerband so you need lots of quick changes to get it going but it's when you hit 4th and 5th they come in to their own. I've never really understood why they usually have very short low gears as the powerband is at the lower end of the revs so should be able to drive off the line with long gears. Though most of the really quick diesel BMW are autos.

 

[Brett]

He's certainly brave racing a Vectra, I never speed around them, because around St Helens there is about 6 unmarked police cars all Vectra's.

I wouldn't fancy my changes against Chris's Vectra I've seen it go. Its got rediculous torque and the RS Clio's arn't quick under 5K, even so just blasting along dual carraigeways isnt what they're designed to do, they'll pull nicely but they arn't super quick.

 

[tom.]

You only have to look at mapped dervs on quater miles, theyre slow as fook. Torque pulls caravans, bhp wins races people ffs.

Lol. Love people who havnt seen people that can drive mapped dervs on the 1/4 that dismiss them instantly.

My mates Ibiza, when at stage 1 running 170bhp and 280ft/lbs, ran a 14.7. Thats slow is it?

The same car now running 225bhp, currently has a 13.7 under its belt with a terminal of 99mph. Wont find many cars that run times that quick with only 225bhp.

As for the Vectra beating the clio. I can believe that. The clio's power is mostly at the top end of the rev range. Modern DERV engines pull all the way through.

As said, if you were to add bends into the equation, with equally talented drivers, it would be a different matter. My TDi will easily leave my mates 197 in straight lines, but come to a corner and he will leave me. Mines not standard suspension wise either, having coilovers, uprated arb's and strut braces front and rear.

Torque DOES win straight line races, IF you know how to use it to its full potential.

 

[Dave H]

I had a Transit van in front of me in Hollins tonight.He saw the RB bullet in his mirror and floored it...smoke everywhere.I was left standing.Then he came to a sharp left turn outside Castlebrook High...and on came the brake lights.No way could he have me in the twisties...l got close again.Then a car was turning into the Queen Anne pub...he had to stop.Car went and so did he...smoke everywhere again."I dare not go over 35mph" l thought.And as l turned into my drive he was gone...still 'on cam' happy in his victory.

Bless.


(Disclaimer-The above IS true and l was NOT racing)

 

[ed_brown95]

There was probably no error, just that diesel generally have pretty short 1st gears and lurch off the line, and generally don't have long 2nd or 3rd gears - it's related to the powerband so you need lots of quick changes to get it going but it's when you hit 4th and 5th they come in to their own. I've never really understood why they usually have very short low gears as the powerband is at the lower end of the revs so should be able to drive off the line with long gears. Though most of the really quick diesel BMW are autos.

I was talking about the guy in the 197 not the guy going against me. the guy in the 197 probably messed up the start. I also own a A4 2.0 TDI there is virtually no 1st gear, its a straight change to 2nd but then it takes off.

 

[Pearl_Black]

190BHP Vectra did a 197?

LOL. Someone needs to learn how to drive their car.

Come to Cannock

I find it hard to believe a cdti vetra is quicker than a 197...ive had a 172 and I can deffinatly say the 197 is much quicker. I would race a 1.9 cdti vactra with no quarms ....Vectra? what vectra Pah!

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

I find it hard to believe a cdti vetra is quicker than a 197...ive had a 172 and I can deffinatly say the 197 is much quicker. I would race a 1.9 cdti vactra with no quarms ....Vectra? what vectra Pah!

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

 

[Pearl_Black]

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

Even though the 1*2's are quicker to 60 and have superior BHP pt?

 

[Pearl_Black]

Even though the 1*2's are quicker to 60 and have superior BHP pt?

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

 

[Pearl_Black]

haha Nice one Fella

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

haha Nice one Fella

Lol - anyway....

You really think the 197 is faster than the 1*2's?

When i test drove one it was better under braking but i thought the 1*2's had a noticeable difference in a straight line.

 

[Jasey]

i thought the 1*2's had a noticeable difference in a straight line.

Don't underestimate the effect of sitting in a car that feels like it's going to fall apart has on your perceived speed .

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

Don't underestimate the effect of sitting in a car that feels like it's going to fall apart has on your perceived speed .

Flol - weight saving as we go along. iirc.

 

[Needster]

Roffle at all of this TBH.

197s are a relatively young car in comparison to 1*2s there are very few that will have a lot of miles on so won't be fully opened up (bar some of the 2006 ones I'd say). There's the weight and size difference to consider when you're comparing it to the nimble and flighty 1*2s. My 197 is considerably more responsive now than when I first got it at 9k miles, and I've heard it said that RenaultSport's are at their peak around 40k onwards. Earlier this year mine wouldn't push any further than 138 (on the Uncle's runway) - haven't tried again since then.

 

[Pearl_Black]

Lol - anyway....

You really think the 197 is faster than the 1*2's?

When i test drove one it was better under braking but i thought the 1*2's had a noticeable difference in a straight line.

lol yeah anyhow...172 yes 182 no...

My 172 wasnt nearly as quick to 100 as my 197

182 is a different story though I believe... ?

 

[JoedotwasT5phy]

Roffle at all of this TBH.

197s are a relatively young car in comparison to 1*2s there are very few that will have a lot of miles on so won't be fully opened up (bar some of the 2006 ones I'd say). There's the weight and size difference to consider when you're comparing it to the nimble and flighty 1*2s. My 197 is considerably more responsive now than when I first got it at 9k miles, and I've heard it said that RenaultSport's are at their peak around 40k onwards. Earlier this year mine wouldn't push any further than 138 (on the Uncle's runway) - haven't tried again since then.

Your one is pretty s**t thought tbh.... x

/threadnow?

 

[Needster]

You knows it, lado.

 

[realnumber 1]

I find it hard to believe a cdti vetra is quicker than a 197...ive had a 172 and I can deffinatly say the 197 is much quicker. I would race a 1.9 cdti vactra with no quarms ....Vectra? what vectra Pah!

I think he is trying to say that the 197 is quicker than the Vectra not the 172.....