Speaker Question

[Martin_172]

got my new rear speakers today, 13cm Pioneer E-Motion 3-way coaxial's (just to give a bit of rear fill when ive got rear passengers) and just got a little question about them.

the treble from them sounds brilliant but there is hardly any bass (compaired to the standard renault front speakers) is this normal or have i wired them the wrong way round or somthing? (ive heard this can cause this or does it cause them to have no bass at all if they are the wrong way arround?

 

[MikeDX]

I don't know the answer mate, but I would like to ask how you found fitting the fear speakers.. was it easy enough? I have a set of pioneer 100W 6x9s and wonder if they would fit.. also are you using the standard renault bodge wiring?

 

[fungusman]

Mike, you will not be able to fit 6x9's in the reveals, they will have to go in the parcel shelf, i found that extending the cable run into the boot worked fine.

As for the bass thing, i take it, it is adjusted correctly on the headunit?

If there is a lack of bass it might be that the speaekers are designed for treble and not bass...

If you want to get a lot of bass just chuck a sub in the back. And it will sound mint.

Sorry for the lame reply.. its got nowt to do with the speakers being wired up wrong, if you do that you just get a strange oppasite sound thing.

 

[Martin_172]

Mike yep it was easy enough, just got it bodged with electrical tape to the renault wiring for now untill i get some spade connectors hopefully tomorrow.

fungusman, yep the headunit is setup properly for them i spent a while getting it right, when i swaped the wires round the other way it sounded no different to be honest!

 

[bmh.01]

I've got Infinity 5012CS in my front/rear and i'd say there as good if not better at bass reproduction than the Renault originals, though I had a quick listen to those Pioneers in Halfrauds and i'd say they sounded pretty much the same so could be the speakers. Though also the rear speaker locations in a Clio seem to be angled (to me anyway) more towards bass than treble as they always seem to sound quite muddy compared to the fronts.
One thing to test is to try them in the front and see if they sound any different.

Though as said above if you want proper bass then get a sub in there, I wouldn't live without mine now.

 

[Martin_172]

yeah a subs coming as soon as i get an amp to power my front components, not looking for bass from my rears as they are only 13cm just wanted them for a bit of rear treble, i just sat in the back and they sound better, just sound a bit muffled in the front so think thats whats confusing me.

plus you forget how s**t the rear speakers are as soon as u change them so when you listen to the new ones you think they dont sound much different! lol

 

[fungusman]

yep. thats another thing to rememer, just cos speakers are a good make doesnt necessarily mean they are good.

Go for speakers that are good quality.

Also remember that a little 13cm speaker isnt going to kick out loads of bass anyway.

 

[Martin_172]

yeah thats true about the makes.

i know a little 13cm speaker cant move enough air to give good bass but just needed some rear fill for when ive got passengers, bass wont be a problem when the sub goes in though so the speakers will be fine, got them brand new from ebay for £30 anyway so not bad

 

[fungusman]

Yeah does the job, with a sub doesnt matter what you have if they can handle treble and the wattage from the headunit

 

[cliokiz]

The reason you don't get a great deal of bass is because the speakers are not contained within an enclosure unlike the speakers in the front doors of your car. The door pods will give really good acoustic performance as with most newer cars these days, and they are quite close to your legs/feet so you can feel the bass quite well when you're sitting in the driver or passenger seat.

I suspect the rear speakers are just hanging from a plastic panel in the back and facing upwards (i'm not too sure as i drive a MK1 clio), so there is no pressure behind the speaker cone and not much air is shifted.

I recommend that you get some really good 2 way 6x9's in the back and run them off the head unit. Ideally, you should have a head unit that has seperate front/rear outputs and a seperate subwoofer output, so you can have mid/high frequencies coming out of the smaller speakers, and your low frequencies coming from a subwoofer in the back.

This is the setup i have in my MK1 clio and it sounds absolutely amazing - you can keep on turning the volume up until it hurts your ears with almost no distortion whatsoever.

Hope this helps. Feel free to PM if you need further details

 

[The Hoff]

6x9's are absolutely poop! No audiophile would even consider them

 

[16v_jon]

your new ones have bigger magnets they need more power to move them (creating more bass) which your headunit cannot supply . they need to be amped to get the best out of them

 

[RuFF21]

But If your going to buy an amp, spend the extra money a buy a nice sub

3 12w0 JL Audios will do

 

[chiefsilverback]

6x9's are absolutely poop! No audiophile would even consider them

I still maintain that audiophile and in-car cannot be joined in any 'positive' way.

You are sitting inside an odd shaped metal box which in the case of something like a Clio is cheaply assembled with minimal sound proofing. You don't even sit properly in the stereophonic sound field!

I've installed Infinity Reference 6" x 9"s on a stealth shelf and Infinity Kappa components in my Trophy and the improvement of the OE system is so huge it's unbelievable.

The boot in it's own right acts as an enclosure for the speaker on the rear shelf and you can proof this by folding the seats down and hearing the difference!

For people to instantly pan 6"x9"s is wrong because for most people they are fine.

 

[cliokiz]

I've heard some rubbish 6x9's but i have 3-Way JBL 6x9's on my parcel shelf running off a powerful amp just delivering mid/high frequencies, and they are stupidly loud and the quality of them is amazing. My car was parked up in a car park and the boot was open and i had the system on pretty loud. We were standing quite a long way away from the car but people still had to shout at each other to overcome the volume.

6x9's are far from 'poop'. For a car they are fine.

 

[Martin_172]

i dont want 6x9's in the rear, i only want speakers in the standard location (not cutting the parcel shelf) to have faded down low just to add a bit of fill for the rear passengers, so no point in amping them. i was thinking about the fact that they arn't in an enclosure could be causing the problem, anything i can do to help this?

like i said i dont really care about bass from these as im getting a sub soon but was just curious to the lack of bass from them.

cheers
martin

 

[chiefsilverback]

I'm assuming all Clios have similar interiors and I know in the Trophy the rears are mounted on flimsy plastic so they sounded atrocious!

I got a stealth shelf so to get over cutting the OE shelf!

 

[hydeyho]

ffs 6x9s are a complete waste of money in any setup and has been discussed, at length, on numerous threads in the past (if you want a technical explanation about how sh1t they are go on talkaudio). Being loud isn't always a good thing, I'm loud but it doesn't mean that I sound any good lol. They ruin the soundstage and are simply not needed and wastes part of the budget that can be spent on front components, sub and amp. They try to be a jack of all trades and fail at everything.

As far as the original question, I'd agree with 16v_jon's explanation, your h/u will not have the power output to match your new speakers. The enclosure shouldn't be a problem as they are actually in an enclosure (ie the rear quarter). If you don't like them then get rid of them as you simply don't need rear speakers!

 

[Martin_172]

nope its not that i dont like them, the mid/high sound from them is brilliant, which is all im looking for from them because if you get it right when setting it up, they dont ruin the soundstage in the front and it doesnt sound as bad in the back. plus the speakers are still new so wont be worn in yet

 

[scubaman44]

I've just been in the same position with uprated speakers. I own a valver and uprated front, door and rear speakers with sony/kenwood speakers. The fronts sounded really nice but more expensive rears had no bass really. That was with a old kenwood head unit. Its now been changed to new pioneer one and sounds so much better as more adjustment can be made to mid/bass etc. As said earlier by fungusman head unit is only 4x50 watts!