Using a smaller turbo from a 1.2TCE in a 182?

[The Fatty]

I'm looking to add a little more bhp & torque to my 182 but for little money (don't see the point in pouring £4K into it as in the end, its only a clio)!

Was thinking that maybe the low boost turbo from a 1.2/1.4TCE engine could add 20 or so bhp? Possible?

Also as its really low boost, would it be possible to keep the stock ECU? I like my cruise control etc...

 

[Knuckles]

Little money and power gains don't go together with these cars sadly.

For the effort and cost involved you may as we'll go the whole hog.



...or buy one already built.

 

[The Fatty]

you cant keep the cruise control going the 'whole hog' though can you? I just want to get to many 210bhp, not looking for huge increases...

 

[Mr Plums]

you cant keep the cruise control going the 'whole hog' though can you?

Mine is with clioturbo at the moment, im sure andy said ill still have my cruise control with the adaptronic ecu, not 100%, but im not too fussed tbh, im more looking forward to the 280ish hp.

 

[Adey.]

yep the way the adaptronic is wired in lets you retain cruise as the stock is ecu is left in to control the fbw tb, good setup

 

[Knuckles]

you cant keep the cruise control going the 'whole hog' though can you? I just want to get to many 210bhp, not looking for huge increases...

I didn't even realise this was you, you need your avatar back.

As far as I gather you can retain the cruise control.

 

[The Fatty]

oh really? I didn't know about this ECU! So I get to keep the 'full fat' and get the gains... sounds good! @MrTom, what sort of price is yours costing? I expect its still in the region of 4K+ which is still a dead stop in my mind atm..?

 

[robhoops]

I wonder how much it would cost for a small turbo, it would be interesting to see

 

[Jaff.]

Makes no difference how big the turbo is. The same fundamentals need to be changed
Exhaust
Intake pipes
Inter cooler
Mapping
Etc.

 

[The Fatty]

Makes no difference how big the turbo is. The same fundamentals need to be changed
Exhaust
Intake pipes
Inter cooler
Mapping
Etc.

but the cost of the 1.2 TCE turbo is like £500, and if it was only low boost and working off the stock ecu, it might make things a lot cheaper than 4k?

 

[Ed.200]

Can get cheap turbos off ebay, still the making it work side is where the cost is, the turbo is just another part. Still need a different exhaust manifold, pipework and mapping to get it to run correctly (or safely)

O and nice to see you back around mate :wink:

 

[robhoops]

Makes no difference how big the turbo is. The same fundamentals need to be changed
Exhaust
Intake pipes
Inter cooler
Mapping
Etc.

Fair enough, I suppose as said, if you are going to do it, best going the "whole hog"

 

[George182]

I have the 'whole hog' and I have cruise control.

 

[Jaff.]

but the cost of the 1.2 TCE turbo is like £500, and if it was only low boost and working off the stock ecu, it might make things a lot cheaper than 4k?

You can get a gt28rs for about £700 and still go low boost. As said, the turbo is just a part. Making it work is what costs.
You could do it pretty cheap if you did it yourself

 

[Willo40]

I really appreciate the theory of running round in a 182 with 250+bhp, but surely it make more sense to look at a RS Megane or something else that already has a turbo fitted, for the cost of a turbo and what the clio is worth you are into decent Mazda 3 MPS territory?
I really do understand its good to have something different, but 4k for a turbo set up on a clio seems like madness to me, just my opinion of course....

Willo

 

[Knuckles]

I really appreciate the theory of running round in a 182 with 250+bhp, but surely it make more sense to look at a RS Megane or something else that already has a turbo fitted, for the cost of a turbo and what the clio is worth you are into decent Mazda 3 MPS territory?
I really do understand its good to have something different, but 4k for a turbo set up on a clio seems like madness to me, just my opinion of course....

Willo

I believe this to the point of paying someone to do it. I.e. If you don't have the skills and require a company to do it for you. That is a waste of money IMO.

But, buying one in which someone has reliably done the work or paid for someone to do the work is all good.

I was speaking to someone with an ep3 type r, the previous owner apparently spent £35k modifying it which I think is madness. This lad bought the car for under £10k.

The mods were a full carbon front end; wings, bumper, bonnet, adjustable splitter. Some form of bucket seat, suspension and a supercharger.

All fun and games buying it for sub £10k but f**k spending that much on it.

 

[George182]

From a purely financial perspective, of course its a waste of money.

 

[Mr Plums]

We are going on holiday next year for 2 weeks which is costing almost 5k, my turbo conversion is costing less than 4k, if i had to choose between the two i would 10000000% choose to pay for the conversion!

I dont even want to go on holiday its the missus 😧 almost 5k for two weeks ffs 😧

Ill be enjoying the clio for a lot longer than that, plus itl be worth slightly more than the average standard one when i come to sell it, i know i will never make my money back which was never my intention(its not an investment its for pure enjoyment) but at least ill get a bit back, and ill be having much more fun for much longer than two weeks in Egypt.

Its only a waste of money if you think its a waste of money, people spend 3k plus year after year on cigs, i dont smoke, now imo thats a waste of money.

 

[Ade182]

I have the 'whole hog' and I have cruise control.

Do you find your cruise control 'surges' though?

Usually when going uphill mine seems to think "25% more power required!" so gives it that and due to the extra power it overshoots the required speed so then backs right off, then does it again, and again, wash rinse repeat. Gets sorta annoying! Off to Andy's new fettling shop on Tuesday so will speak to him about it.

Regarding the waste of money argument - it's purely down to the individual. I went for it as I had £5k to spend on either a Focus ST (which could have been a dog) or put it into a reliable Clio that walks through every MOT and wants for nothing to get a similar (yet more raw/fun) result. Also to be unique - as far as I am aware I've got the only boosted 182 in Lancashire! Also, it's only money - you can't take it with you!

 

[Jaff.]

Do you find your cruise control 'surges' though?

Usually when going uphill mine seems to think "25% more power required!" so gives it that and due to the extra power it overshoots the required speed so then backs right off, then does it again, and again, wash rinse repeat. Gets sorta annoying! Off to Andy's new fettling shop on Tuesday so will speak to him about it.

Regarding the waste of money argument - it's purely down to the individual. I went for it as I had £5k to spend on either a Focus ST (which could have been a dog) or put it into a reliable Clio that walks through every MOT and wants for nothing to get a similar (yet more raw/fun) result. Also to be unique - as far as I am aware I've got the only boosted 182 in Lancashire! Also, it's only money - you can't take it with you! :wink:

i imagine the surging is you coming on boost...?

having been in georges i know how fierce it can be

 

[Mr Plums]

Off to Andy's new fettling shop on Tuesday so will speak to him about it.

What you going for mate?

 

[Bobby.]

I was always under the impression that the std ecu can't cope with mapping in boost, weather it be low or high boost. Their for your still going to need to go stand alone ecu which is the most expensive part.

Basically theirs no cheap way about it really.

 

[George182]

Do you find your cruise control 'surges' though?

Usually when going uphill mine seems to think "25% more power required!" so gives it that and due to the extra power it overshoots the required speed so then backs right off, then does it again, and again, wash rinse repeat. Gets sorta annoying! Off to Andy's new fettling shop on Tuesday so will speak to him about it.

Regarding the waste of money argument - it's purely down to the individual. I went for it as I had £5k to spend on either a Focus ST (which could have been a dog) or put it into a reliable Clio that walks through every MOT and wants for nothing to get a similar (yet more raw/fun) result. Also to be unique - as far as I am aware I've got the only boosted 182 in Lancashire! Also, it's only money - you can't take it with you!

It does surge at higher RPM) but at sub 3250 (ish) it works perfectly for me.

i imagine the surging is you coming on boost...?

having been in georges i know how fierce it can be

It does shift doesn't it [emoji85]

 

[Jaff.]

nah! slow mate! wasted £4k

#shudaboughtafastercarinthefirstplace

 

[George182]

nah! slow mate! wasted £4k

#shudaboughtafastercarinthefirstplace

Well, that would have been boring now wouldn't it.

 

[Ade182]

What you going for mate?

Just a few VERY minor niggles rectifying that my OCD can no longer cope with (fuel/temp dials slightly out, boost pipe re-route etc) ) plus an oil change and a good once over by Andy to make sure everythings OK so far. Something doesn't feel quite right with it at the moment, just feels rough and tired! Possibly suspension related but my local indie say the suspension is nice and tight. Certainly nothing with the engine/turbo as it's getting more lairy now the outside air temperature is dropping!

Local indie aren't used to RS Clio's though so what might seem to them to have little/no play might infact be a lot of play for a RS Clio! I believe the bushes are quite hard as standard compared to other makes/models! It's piece of mind more than anything else. :smile:

 

[Ade182]

i imagine the surging is you coming on boost...?

having been in georges i know how fierce it can be

It's usually at motorway speeds when going uphill so the car senses a drop in speed and tries to compensate with input that would maintain the speed on a stock engine. But it's only going to try to compensate thinking it has the 150~bhp or so power produced at that rpm, when infact my engine will wind up the turbo and give nearer 200bhp at that same rpm. I think it's just a trade off of running boost tbh.

It does surge at higher RPM) but at sub 3250 (ish) it works perfectly for me.

I'm usually 80MPH/4K RPM on the motorway so thats probably the case. I imagine my turbo spools earlier than yours too with it being a smaller unit so I'd notice it lower down the rev range than you would.

 

[EvoFq3o0]

Sorry Ade mate, I'm in Lancashire too
Like everyone has said it's only a waste of money if it's something you don't really want! My Cruise control doesn't seem to work, it did before it went it!!

....But boost!!!

 

[Ade182]

Sorry Ade mate, I'm in Lancashire too :wink:
Like everyone has said it's only a waste of money if it's something you don't really want! My Cruise control doesn't seem to work, it did before it went it!!

....But boost!!!

You should move out of Lancashire... :tongueclosed:
Back to topic - As previously mentioned the stock Clio ECU isn't capable of controlling/mapping boost so you need standalone engine management.
Andy/Scoff cleverly wire the Adaptronic to the stock Renault ECU which controls all the dash/cruise control/luxuries and the Adaptronic runs the engine/fuelling/boost. Last time I checked clioturbo it was circa £1k for the wiring and mapping of the Adaptronic so cheap is out of the window before you even look at buying any mechanical bits.

 

[The Fatty]

what about a supercharger? Standard ecu able to be mapped to that? As it is linear?

 

[Willo40]

Sorry guys, I am not knocking anyone for doing it, I spent 5k on a family holiday this year, so I can see where you are coming from, you must have an understanding family, if I said to my little lad and the missus, we aren't going away this year cause I want to spend 5k on the car I would be single now.......lol.

But seriously I can imagine 250+ bhp in a clio is a riot, Christ mine feels ok as it is......

Willo

 

[Drew!]

what about a supercharger? Standard ecu able to be mapped to that? As it is linear?

A supercharger is still a form of forced induction so the inlet manifold is pressurised and not a atmospheric pressure as it would be in a NA setup, the stock ECU does not have the capability to monitor manifold pressure as a reference point for it's fueling map therefore it cannot control the fuelling correctly.

The only way is to run a fully standalone ECU or as it seems most do use something like the Adaptronic in a piggy back configuration.

 

[Mr Plums]

I spent 5k on a family holiday this year, so I can see where you are coming from, you must have an understanding family, if I said to my little lad and the missus, we aren't going away this year cause I want to spend 5k on the car I would be single now.......lol.

Willo

I would be single too if i did that lol.

 

[Cub.]

I'm not sure where to start on this thread if I'm honest.

My opinion on modifying any car, including clios, is you either do it with the 'whole hog' in mind, or you just stick to cosmetic / minor changes. The middle ground is "waste of money" land in my opinion. You also need to go in with the mindset if you modify it extensively it is a keeper. Unless you don't mind selling on / breaking for a loss.

I've modified mine extensively for a purpose, to smash around track. Some may say for the money you can get a 'fast car' straight out of the factory. Been there done that, and the cars I had weren't that much faster or more fun if I am honest.

For the money, a heavily modified clio will be up there on track with a lot of very, very expensive metal.

Anyone who prioritises modifying a car over children's or family needs is a complete bell piece in my opinion. The trick, is to fund both :smile:

In answer to the OP, supercharger will need standalone ECU unless you like buying things and only using half their potential.

 

[Mr Plums]

Anyone who prioritises modifying a car over children's or family needs is a complete bell piece in my opinion. The trick, is to fund both :smile:

+1

 

[The Fatty]

A supercharger is still a form of forced induction so the inlet manifold is pressurised and not a atmospheric pressure as it would be in a NA setup, the stock ECU does not have the capability to monitor manifold pressure as a reference point for it's fueling map therefore it cannot control the fuelling correctly.

The only way is to run a fully standalone ECU or as it seems most do use something like the Adaptronic in a piggy back configuration.

In answer to the OP, supercharger will need standalone ECU unless you like buying things and only using half their potential.

thanks, I didn't realise the stock ecu was so 'lame' for lack of a better word!