Is the information correct though?
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Yozzasport (PF97) Brake Experience
- Thread starter dk
- Start date
I know you Evogone yep and I know you can and do drive the car hard so don't take this the wrong way.EVOgone said:
However I'm lazy. How long do 2500's disk and pads last on track etc use? I did a pad change on the Williams as I thought that might have been the cause of my recient braking issues (fixed themselves in the end). Now the cars done the drive to the ring and laps of the ring (OK so I wasn't exactly hard after my first lap) plus the Renault sport day plus some other day I think so about 2.3k or so miles and the pads are about 1/3 to 1/2 worn the disk have no wear on them at all.
Do you think the 2500's will stand up as well with say 30hp more and 150kgs more weight?
edde said:
DS2500 were fitted to 18k old discs and they did 2 ring trips and renaultsport day and 6k of hard road abuse.
Even then i sold them as they were half used to Clart...!
You know me just wanted the best braking and happy to compromise on the dust and wear rate on DS3000 for the track..!
Ha Ha always the best for you to much dedication.EVOgone said:
I don't like cleaning the car even week (or ever few months) therfore I like pads/disk which are easy on wheels and paint.
A Mk2 why would I want a slow car though my Mk1 gets round any track faster than my Mk2 ;-). Mk3's the way forward I think just need to see about a tow bar (waits for the gasps).
Just an idea I've done 56k in the dci in 3 yrs and about 3k in the Williams and that without many track days now I'm more dedicated I recon I'm looking at adveraging 20k a year. I'm bored so here goes some edde Maths
Ds2500 lasting 10k a time that £150 or so.
If 4 pots coversion costs say an extra £250 for the calipers
But I'll last disks and pads 15k (there easier on bits unquestionably) and replacment pads are £44 so cost to replace is £105
Assuming 42k I use the car for (We'll assume stock setup disappear almoast immediatly)
Ds2500's £600
4pots £300 for calipers and brackets (lines are needed for both setups so cost here are the same). Thats £510 plus you can sell the setup for say £100 bringing the cost down to about £400.
Thats a fair saving even if they only last 13k vs 10k the saving is still £90.
Plus for me there less pad changing. I will agree my figures are possible more bias to the 4 pots but that not the intention I justed picked just over 40k as that the number infront of me (unfortunatly not my bank balence).
olin said:
Judder is more likely to be fluid breakdown...Had the same issue as you describe with std fluid.
SS lines and full fluid bleed with Pro race 2000 never had the issues even after lapping the ring then stoping 2/3mins queuing then another lap..
BenR said:
I have only got those symptoms with trashed discs or pads (min thickness) and after fluid boiling.... then driving the car again. After my fluid change even with trashed discs i have never had this but thrashed pads yes.
Yes pad deposits is common on some cars the EVO is notoriously bad for it but i personally have not come across this in the clio. If std / crap pads are used then this is usually why.
BenR said:
That is a major reason holding the car on stinking brakes. The fluid thing is straight up happened 2 or 3 times. Upgraded the fluid and never any issues (using the same pads etc), even after sitting in the ring queue for 10min after a fast lap then back on the circuit 4/5times.
Anyways you mustnt be trying hard enough..LOL
Only joking...;-)
i managed to get 5000 miles out of some PF's
downside to the summers track sessions was...
melted tire caps
melted caliper seals (desintigrated actually)
cooked wheel paint
i boiled the fluid most track days and it was not left to sit..... no vibrations in other words..... the just got REALLY hot......
I changed my drving style with some advice and it doubled the life of the fluid. and I was no slower on track
downside to the summers track sessions was...
melted tire caps
melted caliper seals (desintigrated actually)
cooked wheel paint
i boiled the fluid most track days and it was not left to sit..... no vibrations in other words..... the just got REALLY hot......
I changed my drving style with some advice and it doubled the life of the fluid. and I was no slower on track
Andy GDI said:
Need better fluid then if your are boiling it, oh and ditch the 182 wheels as they are made of lead and offer minimal cooling this is probabley a main contributor to your problems.
Vibration happen after you have boiled your fluid it has cooled down then use the car again get some medium hard braking again then due to the reduced properties of the fluid and the air the caliper force is inconsistant.
When i changed / upgraded the fluid it all went away using the same discs and pads.
Boiled fluid results in a spongey pedal thay may or may not come back to normal after being left to cool down. If it doesn't then you need to change the fluid. It can't be the cause judder as its merely pushing the pads on to the disc.
Judder is caused by overheated pads breaking down or in rare circumstances, warped discs.
Not sure how changing the fluid can cure judder other than it might have better heat transfer somehow?? all you're asking of the fluid is that it can cope with the heat the pads are creating.
Judder is caused by overheated pads breaking down or in rare circumstances, warped discs.
Not sure how changing the fluid can cure judder other than it might have better heat transfer somehow?? all you're asking of the fluid is that it can cope with the heat the pads are creating.
c__w said:
The fluid has broken down and after cooled and can not give consistant / constant force to the piston when it gets to a certain temp. Any pad transfer imperfection on the disc will cause judder. With the fluid new or upgraded then there is a constant force on the piston and then the piston is not easily pushed back / judder etc.
Its way my experiences, changing fluid soved it. I agree that pad material transfer is the main cause of judder but that most likely when you are using pads that are not upto the job.
I can only say whats has worked for me....
EVOgone said:
I suppose that theory makes sense but as you say the route cause of the judder is the pad/disc contact and the boiled fluid shows up any judder even more as there is more pedal travel vs pressure.
I run DS3000s on my 205 and the dust/deposits are harsh on the wheels too but I just accept it from this kind of "aggressive" pad. But it also means that it keeps the discs nice and clean
c__w said:I suppose that theory makes sense but as you say the route cause of the judder is the pad/disc contact and the boiled fluid shows up any judder even more as there is more pedal travel vs pressure.
I run DS3000s on my 205 and the dust/deposits are harsh on the wheels too but I just accept it from this kind of "aggressive" pad. But it also means that it keeps the discs nice and clean
Rout cause for me was the std fluid (as i changed and was fine with same discs and pads) but for others im sure its poor pads and that melted compound on the disc.
I used DS3000 pads awsome but as you say the dust trashes your wheels....!
c__w said:I suppose that theory makes sense but as you say the route cause of the judder is the pad/disc contact and the boiled fluid shows up any judder even more as there is more pedal travel vs pressure.
I run DS3000s on my 205 and the dust/deposits are harsh on the wheels too but I just accept it from this kind of "aggressive" pad. But it also means that it keeps the discs nice and clean
Weird, if you asked me without talking about an experience you had, then i would say boiled fluid would dampen the judder from pad deposition because air is more compressable. I think the better fluid solved it because it didnt boil, or didnt boil to the same extent, or maybe you just didnt sit on the brakes when they were hot
