172/182 buyers guide
First thing is have a read of the frequent/changes in production etc as listed on this thread
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=187984
If you want more info on anything written here best do a search as I’ve tried not go into to much depth for fear of it becoming to large.
Ok things to look out for or check.
Exterior
Check for the normal scratches dents etc also check the sills of the car for bending whilst not a huge issue it doesn’t look good and shows poor signs of the car being jacked/possible accident damage.
One thing to check if the presence of a sticker on the drivers door which tell you the oval plate details of the car If this is missing then it can show the cars been re sprayed and the sticker not replaced etc. The vin though are also available from the passenger side of the car down the bottom of the windscreen viewable form the outside and also under the bonnet. (see this link for more info)Clio codes (for the dialogues) and what the oval plate says about your car
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=112411
If the car isn't a 182 Cup or 172 Cup check the front xenon washer jet balls are there and work they are a common failure point and whilst there are a few fixes no one is perfect.
You have the choice of either
New washer jet i.e. bumper off and replace - may well fail again
Just swap the washer jet ball its less effort than taking the bumper off- may fail again in fact its more likely.
Superglue the ball back in place- Make sure you get it in the right spot else you'll need to buy a new one this if done right is a good method though.
Unplug the jets - its easy to do just unplug the lines from behind the jets and no leaks just remember to bung up the pipes- There supposed to be connected all the time legally.
Check for accident damage its a hot hatch and more so in the case of the 172 Cup they do get crashed and sometimes bodged repairs so check for any areas of rust
They shouldn't rust at all really as the protects is very good only possible place is the chassis frame under the car if you jack on them it can peal the under seal off over time.
Check in the boot under the carpet for any deformation
Check If you are looking at a 172 Cup or a 182 Cup or a 182 with the cup spoiler pack then check at the front of the car under the bumper for a small black plastic spoiler there no cheap new (£130ish) and break a lot. They should be fitted though but often there damaged or not fitted new and owners don't care or don't know there missing them.
Check under the front of the car for the under bonnet cover its a big plastic cover under the engine its only thin plastic it helps keeps the underside of the engine clean and catches any oil drips.
One thing if the car your looking at has sat nav then the DVD disks aren’t cheap also in the case of the 182 the spoiler pack couldn't (shouldn't have) been fitted since the bigger rear spoiler caught to much on the sat nav aerial to much however some have been added later on but this may explain why it has sat nav and only the rear spoiler not splitter as it was added after build
Check the rear lights faulty rear light of any type isusually down to a poor earthing connected/water getting in them so dry the unit and fix and check the earthing point on the left hand side of the car in the boot down below the upper seat belt point for a good connection its under the side covr.
Mechanics
Check the engine doesn’t move much (only way to explain how much they should move is to compare with other 172/182's) however loads of engine movement should show up on a test drive.
If your looking at a 182 normal car then check for a engine cover it doesn’t make much different the 172 Cup didn't have them etc to save cost and weight its there to help make the engine bay look tidier and reduce noise a bit but it does very little owners often remove it to see the engine more, easier access to parts and under the excuse of weight saving.
The exhaust on the 172 and 182 aren’t great the 172 biggest issue is the fact the back box is to heavy and so within about 3 years it breaks the weld to the front pipe most p[people then change for an aftermarket exhaust as stock is about the same price. It can be fixed if you take it to a garage etc they’ll see what the issue is and could weld up the exhaust with a stiffener or weld and extra bracket to hold the back box in place better. The 182 isn't the same system (since it take the place where the spare wheel well is but it can suffer from the same rattles from the mid section etc.
If your looking at a 182 one thing to remember is there two type (Trophy excepted)
There the 182 (with the cup spoiler and suspension packs) this has climate leather seats (well part) and xenon’s etc. This is sometimes called the full fat on here its not anything official just the name the forum often uses.
Then there’s the 182 Cup this has both suspension and spoiler/splitter packs as standard but doesn't have the leather seats xenon’s or climate (air con instead).
The presence of Cup was symbolised by the darker coloured wheels but since some cars had the wheels swapped at dealers and aftermarket swaps and since the wheels bar the colour where the same then its impossible to be certain by looking at the wheels if it has the pack then only way to be sure is to turn the front wheels and measure the hub bolt spacing from the centre of one bolt to the other.
60mm means you have the cup suspension pack
54mm means you don't have the cup suspension pack
Drive shaft gaiters can fail like any car and since there such a pain to properly chnage for proper Renaul ones often best getting a whole new shaft which ins't cheap Abs rings can come loose (east to chnage realy) and cause ABS warning lights a new ring can be bought but many dealers cannot find the part number/price but they are there.
Check the washer jets work they do get blocked.
Due to certain magazines write ups many people refuse to by non cupped cars and IMO regardless of what I was doing even if I were changing the suspension I'd get a car with the cup pack for the resale. Most cars have the suspension pack though.
Check the oil level though also if you have the engine cover removed check the head area for oil the seal isn't great often and since the repair is 7.1 hour and necessitates a new cam belt its not worth fixing just to stop a little oil leak however since the oil level sensor isn't that good and since the sensor tell you when your low with oil without having to open the bonnet many owners actually check the level and it can run low.
If your after a car with more HP remember that whilst there tuning bits out there they are not cheap £1.5k will see you about 190~195hp. So claims of a remap and induction kit for 200hp are false.
Check the stearing to full lock often the strut tops under the bonnet for the strut catch on the body the Renault offical fix it to grind some of the material form the bodty the other fix is to leave it or to stick some washer under the strut tops as per the Clio V6 has to lift the top as such.
Interior
The biggest thing can be rattles/squeaks etc some cars are worse than others you can try and fix the noises stripping the dash top off and taping it all down etc but really depends how bad it is.
The seats should be in god condition wear on the side bolsters can be down to how the owners gets in the car etc.
Check the steering wheel for damage/wear depending on use etc they do wear and the finger grips bits can come away /fray etc they can be stuck down etc but cannot be bought separate a proper new wheel is £350 or so no one bothers getting a new one. One thing that can damage them is the wearing of hand cream and wedding rings.
Anther thing which can be damaged by the wearing of a ring etc is the gear knob they are quite cheap and easy to replace really if you are bothered.
Check the condition of the gearbox gaiter there only cheap but when the dog bone mount wears etc they can break the clips if stretched to far needing a new one.
Check the seat belt handles all work fixes arn't to diffuclt or expensive but somehting to check.
Under the cigarette ash tray (pull it out) you'll see a little cover over a diagnostic port if you have access to a proper code reader then you could plug in here and check for any fault codes into showing up on the dashboard warning lights but those that do are usually insignificant anyway.
Check the foot wells for the front and rear seats for water the front seats are down to a blocked valve/air con filter etc the rears are foten down the rear seat bar the holes let water although faulty rear window seals are common.
Check all the electrics work windows particularly and the climate control works it there a buzzing sound when its on it could well just be the little fan in the console on the roof which blows air over the interior temp sensor for the climate easy/cheap to change though. The system isn't great making cold air but if it is poor often re-gas fixes it.
When starting the car ideally turn the key so all the light come on then wait for them to go off before starting the car check the warning light etc go out the SERV light doesn't indicate servicing just that the car has a fault which needs sorting.
Check under the passenger seat for presence of a CD changer if the CD changer cable is there then there was one fitted and someone removed it at some time. Some cars didn't have them as standard though.
172 phase 1 had them as standard
172 phase 2 early models wee standard later models you had to pay for it approx when the cars came with stability/cruise control it came as as option instead.
182 had then as an option only.
The cable isn't cheap at near £90 but the changers since there easy to remove are much cheaper you can often get a changer for £60.
The airbag warning light can come on the most common issue is the wiring under the seats going wrong the fix is detailed here
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=108607
Driving
The handling should be very good it one of the things that got it a good reputation so anything unto wards should raise suspicion one thing maybe the cars rear end twitchiness the rear dampers can leak/fail quite quickly there only £100 or so for two new ones and a few minutes to fit.
Check the car stops and steers straight as the brakes are superb on the car tracking can be an issue it just might need adjusting. In the case of a 182 the wheels used can cause the brake fluid to boil off as the wheels don't let the brakes cool off so in the case of a 182 if the brakes feel like they need bleeding they probably do.
Check for any clicking etc noises its difficult to say what exactly but comparing cars is the best idea.
When driving the car at a fair few rpm lift off the throttle and check for engine shake it its really bad then the engine will knock itself out of gear. Its caused by the engine mounts wearing/moving the usually one is the dog bone one which is quite cheap and quick to replace. IMO stick with the stock one do not up rate it. Other mount can wear though including the top mount (driver side) and the battery mount and the 4th gearbox to sub frame one. There not that badly priced for new ones and fitment is not to difficult either.
Also as a note the gearbox isn't the best ever to use it shouldn't crunch or grind etc just the feel is nothing like say a VAG etc.
The clutch is very heavy and has a high bite point its normal though again best compare with other 172/182 cars but yes they are heavy and high with a small bite point. Also the clutch release bearing can wear a lot stick the car into neutral and with your foot down you'll hear it wine it will last though many have wines for ages before they are sold on etc so life span is unclear and sicne a chnage of them is a 7 hour job (and you should change the clutch at the same time as the cars stripped down loads to get to it).
PAs can be a bit noisy the 182 is better due to pipes being chnaged. Pipes cna leak etc so check level etc plus the fuild does need to be changed oftne a chnage of fluid helps wonder.s
When you start the car from cold you'll notice the idle isn't great this is due to the mapping its not to bad but as I've said earlier best compare to other cars. They can have trouble idling with dirty throttle bodies faulty sensors etc best way to describe what’s normal is it doesn’t sound perfect but on the rev counter its stable. If it sounds like a tractor or doesn't start well then that’s not right it should start straight off as such.
Things to check when driving
Temp gauge goes up to the middle and doesn’t move if ,it goes up and down then shows a faulty temp sensor its a common issue only cheap to change need to check the loom isn't frade as well though.
When cold the car has a lower red line about 6k leave it to warm up and it goes to 7.2k.
Service history
See this link for what details Renault UK required at a minimum for normal cars under normal driving condition cars used on short trips and different circumstances were given shorter service rules but few people ever take note of this (sometimes at there cost)
HOWEVER do remember this is the minimum rule IMO the servicing should be done more regularly ever 6k change the oil at minimum.
Some dealers did incorrectly advice owners that the 18k/2 year was how often the car needed servicing so if the service history shows this remember that it wasn't what was recommended by Renault Uk warranty rules and if you are looking at a car with warranty that Renault Uk might not look favourably and ask for a percentage contribution if correct servicing had been done on time. Also remember the stamp means nothing really fakes stamps have been used before now and will be in future maybe try contact the dealership ask if they really did service the car.
Check the AUX belt has been changed ever 36k though or else change it its not cheap as its 2.7 hour labour if you have a car with air con or 5 minutes if your lucky and have a normal 172 Cup. The servicing used to allow the belt to stay as with the cam belt to 72k hence why many dealers think its Ok to leave ti that long however there were so many failures that the service rules were changed down to 36k at a maximum. When they do fail they make a right mess they 99.9% of the time take out the cam belt so your looking at £1k at best to fix it since it will have wrecked valves new cam belt is needed etc.
Price
Best check against other prices on auto trader (remember this is only what people are asking not getting so maybe try ring them see how well there selling but remember not everyone will be totally honest) and Parkers etc
Extra things to check
Two keys are present and both work (at £120 or so minimum for a replacement its worth checking)
Check the locking wheel nut keys (there should be two) are present and correct and ideally check they work.
In the case of 182's and 172 Cups that the bottles of tyre foam inflator are present (only cheap but worth a few quid discount)
Import 172 don't have (as stanard) locking wheel nuts (one per wheel), Window etching, alarm fitted as standard/embbed into the reciever.
First thing is have a read of the frequent/changes in production etc as listed on this thread
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=187984
If you want more info on anything written here best do a search as I’ve tried not go into to much depth for fear of it becoming to large.
Ok things to look out for or check.
Exterior
Check for the normal scratches dents etc also check the sills of the car for bending whilst not a huge issue it doesn’t look good and shows poor signs of the car being jacked/possible accident damage.
One thing to check if the presence of a sticker on the drivers door which tell you the oval plate details of the car If this is missing then it can show the cars been re sprayed and the sticker not replaced etc. The vin though are also available from the passenger side of the car down the bottom of the windscreen viewable form the outside and also under the bonnet. (see this link for more info)Clio codes (for the dialogues) and what the oval plate says about your car
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=112411
If the car isn't a 182 Cup or 172 Cup check the front xenon washer jet balls are there and work they are a common failure point and whilst there are a few fixes no one is perfect.
You have the choice of either
New washer jet i.e. bumper off and replace - may well fail again
Just swap the washer jet ball its less effort than taking the bumper off- may fail again in fact its more likely.
Superglue the ball back in place- Make sure you get it in the right spot else you'll need to buy a new one this if done right is a good method though.
Unplug the jets - its easy to do just unplug the lines from behind the jets and no leaks just remember to bung up the pipes- There supposed to be connected all the time legally.
Check for accident damage its a hot hatch and more so in the case of the 172 Cup they do get crashed and sometimes bodged repairs so check for any areas of rust
They shouldn't rust at all really as the protects is very good only possible place is the chassis frame under the car if you jack on them it can peal the under seal off over time.
Check in the boot under the carpet for any deformation
Check If you are looking at a 172 Cup or a 182 Cup or a 182 with the cup spoiler pack then check at the front of the car under the bumper for a small black plastic spoiler there no cheap new (£130ish) and break a lot. They should be fitted though but often there damaged or not fitted new and owners don't care or don't know there missing them.
Check under the front of the car for the under bonnet cover its a big plastic cover under the engine its only thin plastic it helps keeps the underside of the engine clean and catches any oil drips.
One thing if the car your looking at has sat nav then the DVD disks aren’t cheap also in the case of the 182 the spoiler pack couldn't (shouldn't have) been fitted since the bigger rear spoiler caught to much on the sat nav aerial to much however some have been added later on but this may explain why it has sat nav and only the rear spoiler not splitter as it was added after build
Check the rear lights faulty rear light of any type isusually down to a poor earthing connected/water getting in them so dry the unit and fix and check the earthing point on the left hand side of the car in the boot down below the upper seat belt point for a good connection its under the side covr.
Mechanics
Check the engine doesn’t move much (only way to explain how much they should move is to compare with other 172/182's) however loads of engine movement should show up on a test drive.
If your looking at a 182 normal car then check for a engine cover it doesn’t make much different the 172 Cup didn't have them etc to save cost and weight its there to help make the engine bay look tidier and reduce noise a bit but it does very little owners often remove it to see the engine more, easier access to parts and under the excuse of weight saving.
The exhaust on the 172 and 182 aren’t great the 172 biggest issue is the fact the back box is to heavy and so within about 3 years it breaks the weld to the front pipe most p[people then change for an aftermarket exhaust as stock is about the same price. It can be fixed if you take it to a garage etc they’ll see what the issue is and could weld up the exhaust with a stiffener or weld and extra bracket to hold the back box in place better. The 182 isn't the same system (since it take the place where the spare wheel well is but it can suffer from the same rattles from the mid section etc.
If your looking at a 182 one thing to remember is there two type (Trophy excepted)
There the 182 (with the cup spoiler and suspension packs) this has climate leather seats (well part) and xenon’s etc. This is sometimes called the full fat on here its not anything official just the name the forum often uses.
Then there’s the 182 Cup this has both suspension and spoiler/splitter packs as standard but doesn't have the leather seats xenon’s or climate (air con instead).
The presence of Cup was symbolised by the darker coloured wheels but since some cars had the wheels swapped at dealers and aftermarket swaps and since the wheels bar the colour where the same then its impossible to be certain by looking at the wheels if it has the pack then only way to be sure is to turn the front wheels and measure the hub bolt spacing from the centre of one bolt to the other.
60mm means you have the cup suspension pack
54mm means you don't have the cup suspension pack
Drive shaft gaiters can fail like any car and since there such a pain to properly chnage for proper Renaul ones often best getting a whole new shaft which ins't cheap Abs rings can come loose (east to chnage realy) and cause ABS warning lights a new ring can be bought but many dealers cannot find the part number/price but they are there.
Check the washer jets work they do get blocked.
Due to certain magazines write ups many people refuse to by non cupped cars and IMO regardless of what I was doing even if I were changing the suspension I'd get a car with the cup pack for the resale. Most cars have the suspension pack though.
Check the oil level though also if you have the engine cover removed check the head area for oil the seal isn't great often and since the repair is 7.1 hour and necessitates a new cam belt its not worth fixing just to stop a little oil leak however since the oil level sensor isn't that good and since the sensor tell you when your low with oil without having to open the bonnet many owners actually check the level and it can run low.
If your after a car with more HP remember that whilst there tuning bits out there they are not cheap £1.5k will see you about 190~195hp. So claims of a remap and induction kit for 200hp are false.
Check the stearing to full lock often the strut tops under the bonnet for the strut catch on the body the Renault offical fix it to grind some of the material form the bodty the other fix is to leave it or to stick some washer under the strut tops as per the Clio V6 has to lift the top as such.
Interior
The biggest thing can be rattles/squeaks etc some cars are worse than others you can try and fix the noises stripping the dash top off and taping it all down etc but really depends how bad it is.
The seats should be in god condition wear on the side bolsters can be down to how the owners gets in the car etc.
Check the steering wheel for damage/wear depending on use etc they do wear and the finger grips bits can come away /fray etc they can be stuck down etc but cannot be bought separate a proper new wheel is £350 or so no one bothers getting a new one. One thing that can damage them is the wearing of hand cream and wedding rings.
Anther thing which can be damaged by the wearing of a ring etc is the gear knob they are quite cheap and easy to replace really if you are bothered.
Check the condition of the gearbox gaiter there only cheap but when the dog bone mount wears etc they can break the clips if stretched to far needing a new one.
Check the seat belt handles all work fixes arn't to diffuclt or expensive but somehting to check.
Under the cigarette ash tray (pull it out) you'll see a little cover over a diagnostic port if you have access to a proper code reader then you could plug in here and check for any fault codes into showing up on the dashboard warning lights but those that do are usually insignificant anyway.
Check the foot wells for the front and rear seats for water the front seats are down to a blocked valve/air con filter etc the rears are foten down the rear seat bar the holes let water although faulty rear window seals are common.
Check all the electrics work windows particularly and the climate control works it there a buzzing sound when its on it could well just be the little fan in the console on the roof which blows air over the interior temp sensor for the climate easy/cheap to change though. The system isn't great making cold air but if it is poor often re-gas fixes it.
When starting the car ideally turn the key so all the light come on then wait for them to go off before starting the car check the warning light etc go out the SERV light doesn't indicate servicing just that the car has a fault which needs sorting.
Check under the passenger seat for presence of a CD changer if the CD changer cable is there then there was one fitted and someone removed it at some time. Some cars didn't have them as standard though.
172 phase 1 had them as standard
172 phase 2 early models wee standard later models you had to pay for it approx when the cars came with stability/cruise control it came as as option instead.
182 had then as an option only.
The cable isn't cheap at near £90 but the changers since there easy to remove are much cheaper you can often get a changer for £60.
The airbag warning light can come on the most common issue is the wiring under the seats going wrong the fix is detailed here
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=108607
Driving
The handling should be very good it one of the things that got it a good reputation so anything unto wards should raise suspicion one thing maybe the cars rear end twitchiness the rear dampers can leak/fail quite quickly there only £100 or so for two new ones and a few minutes to fit.
Check the car stops and steers straight as the brakes are superb on the car tracking can be an issue it just might need adjusting. In the case of a 182 the wheels used can cause the brake fluid to boil off as the wheels don't let the brakes cool off so in the case of a 182 if the brakes feel like they need bleeding they probably do.
Check for any clicking etc noises its difficult to say what exactly but comparing cars is the best idea.
When driving the car at a fair few rpm lift off the throttle and check for engine shake it its really bad then the engine will knock itself out of gear. Its caused by the engine mounts wearing/moving the usually one is the dog bone one which is quite cheap and quick to replace. IMO stick with the stock one do not up rate it. Other mount can wear though including the top mount (driver side) and the battery mount and the 4th gearbox to sub frame one. There not that badly priced for new ones and fitment is not to difficult either.
Also as a note the gearbox isn't the best ever to use it shouldn't crunch or grind etc just the feel is nothing like say a VAG etc.
The clutch is very heavy and has a high bite point its normal though again best compare with other 172/182 cars but yes they are heavy and high with a small bite point. Also the clutch release bearing can wear a lot stick the car into neutral and with your foot down you'll hear it wine it will last though many have wines for ages before they are sold on etc so life span is unclear and sicne a chnage of them is a 7 hour job (and you should change the clutch at the same time as the cars stripped down loads to get to it).
PAs can be a bit noisy the 182 is better due to pipes being chnaged. Pipes cna leak etc so check level etc plus the fuild does need to be changed oftne a chnage of fluid helps wonder.s
When you start the car from cold you'll notice the idle isn't great this is due to the mapping its not to bad but as I've said earlier best compare to other cars. They can have trouble idling with dirty throttle bodies faulty sensors etc best way to describe what’s normal is it doesn’t sound perfect but on the rev counter its stable. If it sounds like a tractor or doesn't start well then that’s not right it should start straight off as such.
Things to check when driving
Temp gauge goes up to the middle and doesn’t move if ,it goes up and down then shows a faulty temp sensor its a common issue only cheap to change need to check the loom isn't frade as well though.
When cold the car has a lower red line about 6k leave it to warm up and it goes to 7.2k.
Service history
See this link for what details Renault UK required at a minimum for normal cars under normal driving condition cars used on short trips and different circumstances were given shorter service rules but few people ever take note of this (sometimes at there cost)
HOWEVER do remember this is the minimum rule IMO the servicing should be done more regularly ever 6k change the oil at minimum.
Some dealers did incorrectly advice owners that the 18k/2 year was how often the car needed servicing so if the service history shows this remember that it wasn't what was recommended by Renault Uk warranty rules and if you are looking at a car with warranty that Renault Uk might not look favourably and ask for a percentage contribution if correct servicing had been done on time. Also remember the stamp means nothing really fakes stamps have been used before now and will be in future maybe try contact the dealership ask if they really did service the car.
Check the AUX belt has been changed ever 36k though or else change it its not cheap as its 2.7 hour labour if you have a car with air con or 5 minutes if your lucky and have a normal 172 Cup. The servicing used to allow the belt to stay as with the cam belt to 72k hence why many dealers think its Ok to leave ti that long however there were so many failures that the service rules were changed down to 36k at a maximum. When they do fail they make a right mess they 99.9% of the time take out the cam belt so your looking at £1k at best to fix it since it will have wrecked valves new cam belt is needed etc.
Price
Best check against other prices on auto trader (remember this is only what people are asking not getting so maybe try ring them see how well there selling but remember not everyone will be totally honest) and Parkers etc
Extra things to check
Two keys are present and both work (at £120 or so minimum for a replacement its worth checking)
Check the locking wheel nut keys (there should be two) are present and correct and ideally check they work.
In the case of 182's and 172 Cups that the bottles of tyre foam inflator are present (only cheap but worth a few quid discount)
Import 172 don't have (as stanard) locking wheel nuts (one per wheel), Window etching, alarm fitted as standard/embbed into the reciever.
