172 inlet manifold PTFE gasket

[caister]

Don't know about heat in the inlet, for thickness of the inlet gasket (the one on ebay) You have heat transport through materials and through radiation / air.

Using thick enough material to overcome heat transport would be most effective. I guess 1-2 mm is enough. (but the company selling might have made calculations on this) Then again, you could use some bolts from material that has low heat-transfer specification too

The company on ebay made no calculations at all with this. It's the worst thing ever, I'm returning mine. http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=294427&highlight=ptfe

I think they should be 2mm. agreed 3mm is probs a little thick, but 1mm is just not enough to get good insulation surely.

those GDI V6 PTFE gaskets look to be 2mm

2mm would definately increase the insulation performance but I think the increase in perforamnce between 1mm and 2mm will be nothing compared to the initial performance increase from having a 1mm gasket over the stock solution.

 

[mini-valver]

Can you make them for a K4M?

 

[Mark One]

The company on ebay made no calculations at all with this. It's the worst thing ever, I'm returning mine. http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=294427&highlight=ptfe

I think they should be 2mm. agreed 3mm is probs a little thick, but 1mm is just not enough to get good insulation surely.

those GDI V6 PTFE gaskets look to be 2mm

2mm would definately increase the insulation performance but I think the increase in perforamnce between 1mm and 2mm will be nothing compared to the initial performance increase from having a 1mm gasket over the stock solution.

But surely if your gonna do it,
do it the best you can!

 

[caister]

But surely if your gonna do it,
do it the best you can!

Yeah agreed im just concerned that the 2mm ones might start to make fitting an issue.

 

[hill_power_clio]

GDI who made the v6 ones also said that anything over std thickness on the 172 gaskets may cause issues so wouldn't 1mm be the nearest to this?

Which engine is the K4M? Sorry if thats a daft question!

 

[mini-valver]

K4M is the 1.6. I'll be running a custom plenum setup so thickness isn't an issue. 2mm would be fine......

 

[Mark One]

GDI who made the v6 ones also said that anything over std thickness on the 172 gaskets may cause issues so wouldn't 1mm be the nearest to this?

Which engine is the K4M? Sorry if thats a daft question!

Looking at it I can't work out where the issues would come from. But i don't claim to be an expert on the F4R

 

[hill_power_clio]

Surely there is enough play room for 1mm not to make a difference on this?
We need to come to a decent decision over 1mm or 2mm.
2mm will offer better performance but its not much good if it doesn't fit!!

Mini valver - with regards to the K4M. If you can get enough people interested then of course we can knock up one for you too but one-off jobs aren't worth the hassle to get them made up in CAD and exported to the lazer, its too much work tbh. But of course get say 10 people gathered and we will look into it. I will need a sample gasket or a part no from Renault so we can match the OE part. Lets not clog up the 172 thread with K4M talk though - by all means PM me if you want to discuss this further. Cheers

 

[Jay Payne]

is i said before id be deffo interested in a f4r one (that is proven to fit)

 

[hill_power_clio]

UPDATE....

I need someone, if there is anyone, who is willing to trial fit this gasket on behalf of cliosport.

The trial item wont be made of PTFE but will be made of plastic to keep down costs - its literally just to see what size we can get away with using. Obviously the thicker the better for max heat reduction though this does mean the material is more expensive. DONT run the car with the gasket on, its literally just to see what will fit. As the std 172 gasket is metal you can re-use the one that you have on the car so there are no costs to the 'guinea pig' its just using their time to ensure the best results for everyone else.

Trial items should be 1mm, 1.6-2mm (dependant on offcuts) and 3.2mm. 3.2mm is the thickness of the material used in the Hondata gaskets (obviously proven to work well) so we will try and match as close as possible to this should the fitment work.

I need someone who has a decent amount of posts so people will take their word (not trying to sound funny!) and have enough mechanical knowledge to trial fit this without any additional implications.

Volunteers or nominations please lol......

 

[mattjk]

Hmm.. Interesting!If you lived nearer or local i'd gladly do it with you, but your probably better off finding soundone round the notts area... Good luck!!

 

[Jay Payne]

might be able to help with trial fitment, depends when/how soon your talking

 

[hill_power_clio]

Well they will be machined in wales so no where near Nottingham!

It would ideally be a case of send them out to someone willing and get their opinion on max thickness we can get away with. Would look to get them a discounted/free final PTFE gasket as a thank you and also the recognition of helping their fellow members on cliosport is just priceless!

Would be talking non ptfe plastic gaskets for trial fitment ready by next week, give or take a few days either way at a guess.

Thanks

 

[Fred@BTM]

you can send it to me and i'll test fit it no bother

1mm is still pretty thick, the std gasket is about 0.3mm thick

 

[hill_power_clio]

Fred thats great and people obviously value your opinion so will be a good feedback for the product.

We will see how you get on with the different sizes and take it from there.

PM me your postal address and as soon as its cut I'll get it over to you.

Many Thanks!

 

[LegoHead]

I would just go by the thickness of the original gasket and not any thicker. The main flat part doesn't look like it is compressable and will have a carefully chosen thickness.

if you increase the thickness of the gasket I would be tempted to machine the plenum to allow this.

 

[mattjk]

I would just go by the thickness of the original gasket and not any thicker. The main flat part doesn't look like it is compressable and will have a carefully chosen thickness.

if you increase the thickness of the gasket I would be tempted to machine the plenum to allow this.

Good idea but not practical for me or joe public really...

 

[hill_power_clio]

We will be getting samples of 1mm, 2mm and 3mm trial gaskets out to Fred to try hopefully this weekend or latest early next week. I agree it will probably end up being 1mm, perhaps less but the thicker the better for performance so we can see what we can get away with.

We want to keep this as an easy fit direct swap part - i.e. nothing more to do than change the gaskets over otherwise it limits the amount of people who can benefit.

I/Fred will be in touch with an update/feedback I'm sure after the trials have taken place.

Thanks to all interested and watch this space!

 

[mini-valver]

I'd really be interested in a 1.6 one mate if you could make one. I can source an inlet manifold to send to you as a template if that helps?

 

[hill_power_clio]

Like I said to be honest mate the amount of time involved in making one from a manifold its not worth the hassle... if its just a one off for yourself dude then just buy some PTFE off ebay and get jiggy with a scalpel. Gather some interest, say 5+, though nearer to 10 would be better and cheaper for you and get me an OE gasket (or part no.) to work from and we might be able to do something.

When having things lazer cut you should consider the std pricings at about this...

Artwork @ £25.00 - per CAD drawing/download
Set-up @ £15.00 - per batch
Lazer maching @ £60 an hour

Plus PTFE material, postage, paypal fees, etc. it soon adds up, for the sake of one gasket.

 

[mattjk]

Where can you buy PTFE sheet from? Looked on ebay not alot on there really

 

[mattjk]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2mm-PTFE-Shee...eZWD1VQQtrksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem

This any good?

 

[mark.k@GDI]

should be ok from what you can see. 2mm will be too thick for a 172/182 though. when you bolt up to your head the plenum wont line up ok. you will need .5/.6 max

 

[mattjk]

.5/.6 aint gunna do much though isit?

Once the cars all fixed up, i may pick up a sheet of 1mm & 2mm thick stuff and try them out, or am I just wasting my time with 2mm?

 

[AmDaMan]

has anyone here actually fitted one of these?

I'll hopefully be recieving my RS Tuner soon which should be able to tell you the manifold air temp, so can test this out.

 

[mattjk]

has anyone here actually fitted one of these?

I'll hopefully be recieving my RS Tuner soon which should be able to tell you the manifold air temp, so can test this out.

The air temp sensors in the plenum so I dont know if it would be effective but maybe will help marginally

 

[hill_power_clio]

We have sent Fred samples of 1mm, 2mm and 3mm thick plastic 172 gaskets to trial fit on the 172. He has rec'd them and has already expressed how good the quality of the lazer cut is.

PTFE sheet off ebay not a lot agreed but check the properties to make sure its of a decent grade and make sure you have a steady hand to cut with - lukcily with lazer cutting you don't have this problem!

After the trial fit we will see what we can indeed get away with though we all estimate it will be 1mm sheet. We are just waiting for the trial to be complete and then they will be available shortly after. I can't see there being a fitting problem between .5 or .6 to 1mm - surely the renault breather setup isn't that precise that this much room will make a difference?

Once we have a defnite answer we will be able to knock these out.

Obviously thinner the material the less the costs of the gaskets to you all.

Again will update upon trial response.... thanks

 

[Fred@BTM]

i'll post pics and stuff of the trial pieces, i'm amazed by the quaility!

 

[Jay Payne]

are u going to post in here fred?

 

[Fred@BTM]

i'll probably start a new thread mate

 

[mattjk]

Looking forward to it! I will wait a while then

 

[hill_power_clio]

Haha glad you like Fred! Got some pics across from the cutters todays of the clio 16v inlet manifold and throttle body gaskets we are working on - and of course quality looks superb.

You won't get anything closer than these to the OE spec!

Look fwd to viewing your thoughts Fred - let us know how you get on.

ATB everyone

 

[Mark One]

Are these new gaskets matched to the inlet or the same size as the OE one.

You can put me down for one if the price is right.
Mark

 

[hill_power_clio]

As said on many occasions they are a direct match the OE one. How can you match to an inlet manifold when they are all different sizes - i.e. RS to std etc

 

[hill_power_clio]

Hi All;

Just to let you know this isn't forgotten about - Fred is trial fitting the different thicknesses to see what we can get away with. As soon as he has given us the go-ahead with a thickness these will be available.

Thanks

 

[Jay Payne]

looking forward to hearing more about these

 

[caister]

Funnily enough i just come on here to bump this thread and see how its developing

 

[hill_power_clio]

haha - great minds mate!

Literally when we have a thickness decided they will be readily available.
Good to see we have the interest and not just wasting our time!

Just so you know the couple of 16v ones we have sold on the cliowilliams forum have been rec'd with upmost praise for the quality which is good to hear!

 

[caister]

i'm looking forward to it as i may have to treat myself and get matched inlets at the same time!!!

 

[Mark One]

Saw a picture of an F4R with the plenum removed the other day.....now i know why these need to be 1mm/2mm tops.
Look foreward to hearing about them