20vt 172 project

[Rob_]

Thats the other thing the ihis are producing 340bhp using that boost setup.

Thats a hell of a lot of boost!!

 

[MATT BLACK]

Must admit i did have a faulty boost pressure valve at the time of that rr tune - might have been a tad over


400 bhp is easily achievable using 1.5 bar though with a VF34 - 1.8 is a tad to much in my opinion for that turbo

 

[Floodie]

The_one: Yeh mate rash has the IHI kit running 333bhp... there is a huge thread on his woes.. he has had to do 9(yes nine) 10 hr trips back and forth to JBS... not a problem with JBS by the way, its just been a wanker of a car by the sounds of things… and 2bar?!?!?! jesus!!

Matt: 440 from a vf34?, christ Matt, you sure? maybe you are getting confused with the figure for injector size - kidding chap ... ive heard its absolute max is around 370ish then it would die fairly quickly if run for a decent amount of time… similar to the chaps saying they are getting a reliable 300 from the K04's I guess.. Could yours run at that power because of the overbore?.. But then again, I thought it didn’t matter what you had done to the internals as if the turbo cant flow to that level then that’s your limiting factor...

 

[MATT BLACK]

The VF34 can deliver more than 370 - hell check that RR print off ....and that was with spinage ( not the shlt popeye eats )

440 injectors / 440 hp lol ...... come on man what you take me for

 

[Floodie]

The VF34 can deliver more than 370 - hell check that RR print off ....and that was with spinage ( not the shlt popeye eats )

440 injectors / 440 hp lol ...... come on man what you take me for

Haha -

Yep, saw that print off - damn impressive... i'm going to PM u, can you take a look as i'm getting different views on the 34 and its p!ssing me off .. ta chap

 

[Andy_J]

You'd be as well as uprating the internals while the engine is out of a car.

 

[Rob_]

Floodie - Also heard people on seatcupra.net say that 360ish is the max for a vf34. Bill brockbank (Badger 5) has said not a chance in hell you'll get 400bhp from a vf34

Bills old 1.9 20vt engine made 360bhp running 1.3bar on a vf34

Matt - you do realise wheelspin on a rr can alter the results??

 

[Rob_]

1.5 BAR max on a VF34 - i ran 1.3 for reliability and still rr'd @ over 400 bhp and that was with slippage as we couldnt get decent traction - i estimate 430 - 440 bhp with traction

Like how you forgot to mention the gas

 

[Andy GDI]

we found our insurance wont cover the conversion from a liability issue if we are not using shafts made for the job.

Matt, we were going to do what you did until we found this out..

Omex 600 545+ loom 220+ £898 inc VAT

with decent rods and pistons and the right turbo 400+ is achievable.

never used the IHI turbo, we have only used a GT35 hybrid unit from Owen to create the last 400+ S3 we did... made over 430 on the dyno... at 1.9bar.

 

[Rob_]

A gt turbo will a vf34 wont though but sounds like matt had some gas to help along

 

[Floodie]

we found our insurance wont cover the conversion from a liability issue if we are not using shafts made for the job.

Andy - hi... it sounds from that as though you arent continuing with the conversion anymore unless ive read it wrong... Mark mentioned earlier up in this thread that you have just had the custom shafts made etc - was there still a problem even after these had been done then?... and, in reply to your txt from the weekend, no mate sorry but will keep an eye out for you... ta

Edit: Also, that gt35 unit u used is a peg above the ihi's vf34 in question really... the 34 is more comparable to the gt28 i believe

 

[MATT BLACK]

Eh ? never used gas - were did that come from ??


VF34 will make 400 bhp easy - ive built, rebuilt ( 4 times ) and raced one of these lumps for 3 years - just because a couple of vw nobs say its not achievable doesnt mean its word

The VF34 is used on the Subaru STi and scooby owners are easy getting 400 bhp

eg - http://www.xspeed.com.au/secret.php?area=subaru&secret_id=103

http://www.scoobytuner.com/tuning/?tSfID1=4&tuningID=43
max out at maximum of 390 bhp on a standard sti lump

Dropping a standard jabba sport conversion on a 1.8T engine will prob see you with 360 max if your lucky - remember my clio had a 1.9 overbore with gas flowed head, bigger injectors, large capacity intercooler + a hell of a lot more mods


Feel free to ring Wayne at chipwizards who will confirm the power - still remember him ringing me up laughing saying he had never done nearly 200mph in a clio on the rollers before

Dont make me build another to prove it

 

[Andyman]

Is there a particular choice of model of vag group car a 20v turbo engine and gearbox comes from to fit into a Clio or will any of the range do, ie Passat 20v turbo, Golf Audi etc?

 

[MATT BLACK]

The S3 lump is the one to go for APY code

 

[Andyman]

Could you use a Passat lump and box for a lower power option ?

S3 engines are pretty hard to come by compared to the Passat lump

 

[MATT BLACK]

Yeh - heads different, turbo and manifold but you can still use any 1.8T lump and then just build on it. A used K04 and manifold are pretty easy to come by if your happy with about 270 bhp. The Audi heads arent to clever but they can also be worked.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/seat-1-8t-cup...oryZ9889QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Bit pricey but an example

 

[Andyman]

Yeh - heads different, turbo and manifold but you can still use any 1.8T lump and then just build on it. A used K04 and manifold are pretty easy to come by if your happy with about 270 bhp. The Audi heads arent to clever but they can also be worked.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/seat-1-8t-cup...oryZ9889QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Bit pricey but an example

Yeah is a bit pricey that. Got quoted 600 notes for a tested 20v Leon lump, turbo and loom last year which aint too bad i thought.
Passat engines are wayyy cheaper so could be one for the future to practice on maybe

 

[nathanH]

where the pics at?!

 

[Floodie]

The thing is, Matt knows his stuff and pretty sure he wouldnt just blatantly lie about things. He even had a print out there to show it so god knows... plus, posted links to show otherwise - the car tuning world is odd sometimes eh....

 

[AstoN]

Is this power at the Fly or Wheel?

 

[Floodie]

Christ!!! Just got home from work and all hell's seemed to have broken loose here!!!!

Thread-starter-man (cant remember his name now), how are you getting on with your conversion chap?

 

[Andy_J]

The S3 lump is the one to go for APY code

thats only the old 210 though, not better going for the 225? (engine code BAM)
I have mines running at 257.5bhp & 258lb-ft with a simple re-map.

 

[MATT BLACK]

S3 runs a lower compression engine than the TT 225 lump, which is more effective when tuning / turbo charging.

If your gonna beef the bottom end up and fit a bigger turbo it wont really make any difference - if not the S3 APY lump is the daddy - a good tuner can extract 280 bhp from one of these

 

[c7borg]

Passat engines are wayyy cheaper so could be one for the future to practice on maybe

Can you use a Passat engine for a transverse setup? are there any differences between the rear wheel and front wheel drive 1.8T engines? as mentioned the rwd seem to come up considerable cheaper and the AEB I believe has the larger ports

any help appreciated

 

[robclio16v]

if i was to do this conversion what kind of work is involvedin getting the engine in? custom mounts? how hard to fit?
how much am i looking at to do a complete conversion?

 

[Mark One]

I've been told the Golf AGU engine is one of the strongest twice now.

It's got the stronger crank and big valve head.
I'll be using a K04 as 260-270 is easily enought for me. The 5 speed box from the golf is an 02J which fits - these are rumoured to take between 300-330 bhp. V-dub shafts are hollow which is a bit of a gift come fabrication time, as the clio shaft will slide inside it. Then you may need to put a sleeve on the clio shaft, then weld.
The MK1 I have been researching owned by Flan had a K04 with the standard Audi TT injectors, AGU block, EVO IC, emerald and made 279bhp / 280lb/ft @only 10psi !!

im going MK1
Cos they are a little cheekier and I don't want the 2010 tax bill

 

[MATT BLACK]

Buy a cat D S3 ( APY ) and throw the lot in a MK1 ( inc trans ) first 4wd turbo clio ?

 

[Mark One]

Buy a cat D S3 ( APY ) and throw the lot in a MK1 ( inc trans ) first 4wd turbo clio ?

If only funds would allow
My car is going to be a budget job tbh - student fail. Although I don't intend to buy cheap management as I don't think it's any good.

 

[MATT BLACK]

If you need any v-dub, Audi bits call Carl on 01254 697988

http://www.onlyvw.gbr.cc/1398/info.php?p=2&pno=0

 

[Mark One]

cheers mate. Once done saving I'll give him a call.

 

[FlansS14]

Buy a cat D S3 ( APY ) and throw the lot in a MK1 ( inc trans ) first 4wd turbo clio ?

Is on my list of new projects although i've been thinking scooby running gear as its lighter and a lower centre or gravity

need a workshop first


as stated the a4 and passat engine are cheaper but the inlet manifold is totaly wrong. you will get a better price buying the engine,box,shafts,gear linkage...ect togeter. i can get full AGU conv for arround 1K with clocks too if you wanted to use the std ecu (a bit off a mission but can be done). i'd rather use a programable ECU though tbh.

 

[FlansS14]

if i was to do this conversion what kind of work is involvedin getting the engine in? custom mounts? how hard to fit?
how much am i looking at to do a complete conversion?

no offence, but if you have to ask. Don't bother. you'll be looking at 3k for all the bits but its fitting thats the hard bit. custom stuff is expensive unless you can DIY.

Flan

 

[robclio16v]

u got a fair point there mate!! dnt worry im not offended lol i cant fabricate for s**t lol