A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - update 07.04.2012

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Literally a perfect trophy, wouldnt have it any different. Dont know what you could improve on! How is the exhaust?

Cheers mate.

Chip ill drop him a call! Ill see what James says first as the car is already with him!

James

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Cheers mate.

Chip ill drop him a call! Ill see what James says first as the car is already with him!

James

James is a good guy to sort out a nice handling road going and occasional trackday clio, but Im sure he would concede himself that Mark Fish is on another level for a circuit car, so it depends what you want from it.

 

[.Andy.]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Truely awesome trophy, James.

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

James is a good guy to sort out a nice handling road going and occasional trackday clio, but Im sure he would concede himself that Mark Fish is on another level for a circuit car, so it depends what you want from it.

To be perfectly honest chip the car currently handles better and is quick enough for my driving ability to ever reach its limits. Ill get James to set ip up to what he believes is right and then if it doesnt suffice ill give Mark a call.

Thanks Andy. Its all the awkward niggly bits to sort now!

Im undecided what colour to paint the cage! Keep it titanium with red trophy logos or get it powdercoated capsicum with silver trophy logos?! HELP!

 

[markhinton]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Im undecided what colour to paint the cage! Keep it titanium with red trophy logos or get it powdercoated capsicum with silver trophy logos?! HELP!

Red with no logos

 

[Keith185]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Would say discreet titanium but Red would look awesome

 

[Jekyll]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Red. Done.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

To be perfectly honest chip the car currently handles better and is quick enough for my driving ability to ever reach its limits. Ill get James to set ip up to what he believes is right and then if it doesnt suffice ill give Mark a call.

Yeah they handle so well as standard anyway you cant go too far wrong with even basic upgrades.

Hope the mapping (and cam timing IIRC from what James was saying?) goes well mate

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

OK its going red!!

Cheers Chip, ill put the graph up when its been done. it wont be as powerful as some others as it has a sports catalyst in it. Im hoping for 190ish (touch wood!) Just watch it make less than std now lol! As for the suspension im really happy with it as it is so im looking forward to what it could be!

Thanks for everyones input

James

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Me and Mike from MWM built and mapped an engine for Porkies clio recently, he has a sports cat, it made 212bhp despite that!
So hopefully although it will of course lower your output, it wont do so by too much

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Me and Mike from MWM built and mapped an engine for Porkies clio recently, he has a sports cat, it made 212bhp despite that!
So hopefully although it will of course lower your output, it wont do so by too much

Jesus Christ! 212bhp is god going, is there a link to the spec?

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Dont think the spec is listed in detail anywhere, but was on throttle bodies, we gave it a mild increase in cam duration and lift and a mild increase in compression.

So not a standard engine anymore, but just showing that the sports cats can flow more than some people would expect.

 

[Cup_Phil]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Sports cat on mine now with the ITB's and it feels much better than it did with the decat on

 

[R-Sport.]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Great car now james.... AWSOME

let me know when your trading it back to me

S

 

[Chris205]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Great car now james.... AWSOME

let me know when your trading it back to me

S

By the sounds of it James was telling me for the time & money invested in it, it wont ever get sold, he's either keeping it or his 'action woman' of a girlfriend is getting it lol

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Great car now james.... AWSOME

let me know when your trading it back to me

S

Haha that day may come Steve ill keep it in mind

You should pop down on the 2nd/ 3rd to see how its getting on at James's if your not too busy?

 

[dezmondo]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Haha that day may come Steve ill keep it in mind

You should pop down on the 2nd/ 3rd to see how its getting on at James's if your not too busy?

Give me a call too when the day comes James!!

Looking awesome and the spec is becoming dreamier by the day!!

 

[SharkyUK]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

...his 'action woman' of a girlfriend is getting it lol

This thread is no place for what goes on in his personal life... but she sounds a lucky girl... and the Trophy gets awesomer (!) by the day.

 

[julzh]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Any news on how successful the remap has been?

 

[Chris205]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

It's all gone sour in the trophy camp

 

[julzh]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

It's all gone sour in the trophy camp

Why? RS2 and Orb not compatible?

 

[Chris205]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Why? RS2 and Orb not compatible?

Not really for me to say, lets just say there's been a couple of set backs but once these niggling problems are out of the way then this thing will be awesome.

Just as a note its no direct products fault just an underlying fault that had never reared its ugly head until now

 

[julzh]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Not really for me to say, lets just say there's been a couple of set backs but once these niggling problems are out of the way then this thing will be awesome.

Just as a note its no direct products fault just an underlying fault that had never reared its ugly head until now

No problem, i've been following with interest as I have that exhaust and one of the reasons I have not gone for the inlet so far is that the cat on the orb is an integral part not separate and I was told the inlet has to be used in conjunction with a decat. It is in my interest that this works and the problems are ironed out

 

[Cup_Phil]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Not really for me to say, lets just say there's been a couple of set backs but once these niggling problems are out of the way then this thing will be awesome.

Just as a note its no direct products fault just an underlying fault that had never reared its ugly head until now

Oh no

I saw him the other day in Lincoln - I was out giving the cup a thrash
Hope it's nothing major

 

[bozothenutter]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

No problem, i've been following with interest as I have that exhaust and one of the reasons I have not gone for the inlet so far is that the cat on the orb is an integral part not separate and I was told the inlet has to be used in conjunction with a decat. It is in my interest that this works and the problems are ironed out

Rs2 can be used with a cat no problem..look at my thread (169 whp) in projects, or any of the other Rs2 threads.

 

[2 live]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

cars looking awesome mate. have been thinking of upgrading the sachs on mine rather than get them refurbed. seems the AST's are the ones to go for??. dont really know the best set ups for the 182s yet the rear end on mine is a bit errr....lively the wioteline arb stop this and plant it a bit more??

as for the rs2 not being able to be used with a cat....lol...so its useless for a roadcar??? well a legal one... that doesnt make sense imho

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Rs2 can be used with a cat no problem..look at my thread (169 whp) in projects, or any of the other Rs2 threads.

Agreed, no problem at all to use an RS2 with a cat, although obviously like using a set of cams with a cat or a turbo with a cat you are going to get less gains than you would with a decat if you start trying to flow more air than the particular cat you are using is really good for.


Where has all this talk of it not working with a car come from though? Cant see the origin of that rumour?

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Thanks alot chris lol!!!

Right after getting the car mapped and the timing set the car was dyno'd and just wasnt making the power. it made a maximum of around 170bhp and 125ft/lb

To cut a long story short we have come to the conclusion that the valves arent seating correctly on one cylinder and it is off to Mick @ Diamond motors to get the head rebuilt next Monday. Just to add the group n timing is awesome and I cannot recommend Mike and James enough, they were all so accommodating considering the problem and once the problem is rectified I will definitely be reusing them should it need mapping again.

Ill hopefully have some better news in the next couple of weeks! I guess its chin up and get it done now because ive come to far to not finish it lol!

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Oh and just to add I may also be completing the head build with supertec valves and engine dynamics cams, depending on price differences!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

JamesT87, that makes far more sense than all this nonsense about cat's that some people were going on about!

Let me know if you want help getting the supertec valves, as I bought them direct from my contact at supertech in the states for Porkies engine and saved him roughly 1/3rd off if I got them from a uk supplier, and they arrived in under 3 days.
I could forward you the emails arranging it all if you want, so you have the correct contacts and part numbers etc. Save you some time googling.

Valves not seating correctly would tend to effect it more in the lower part of the rev range where the compression stroke and power stroke timebases are both longer, so I guess that would explain why the torque has dropped more than the horsepower has, so seems a reasonable diagnosis, another option for less compression on one cylinder would be the typical Fail4R pistons breaking up, lets hope its not that in this case though!

 

[julzh]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

as for the rs2 not being able to be used with a cat....lol...so its useless for a roadcar??? well a legal one... that doesnt make sense imho

Use your tiny mate, a decat will make a car illegal but that doesn't stop them being sold/used.

The "rumour" came from the horses mouth during a lift Tom gave me back to the workshop to pick up my car back in 2010. I may be mistaken but I was given the impression the Orbisoud would have to go if I wanted the inlet. Clearly this is not the case but it also seems to compromise performance so personally I think I would still get rid of if I went for the inlet.
Like I said earlier i would like very much for it to work efficiently with a cat.

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

JamesT87, that makes far more sense than all this nonsense about cat's that some people were going on about!

Let me know if you want help getting the supertec valves, as I bought them direct from my contact at supertech in the states for Porkies engine and saved him roughly 1/3rd off if I got them from a uk supplier, and they arrived in under 3 days.
I could forward you the emails arranging it all if you want, so you have the correct contacts and part numbers etc. Save you some time googling.

Valves not seating correctly would tend to effect it more in the lower part of the rev range where the compression stroke and power stroke timebases are both longer, so I guess that would explain why the torque has dropped more than the horsepower has, so seems a reasonable diagnosis, another option for less compression on one cylinder would be the typical Fail4R pistons breaking up, lets hope its not that in this case though!

Chip that would be great! obviously I dont want to order the valves if there not the route cause but as soon as Mick gets it apart ill know more.

The main reason we think its the valves is because upon doing the leakdown test one cylinder had inconsistent readings.

Hopefully we can sort it, it just feels like I have had nothing but problems with it!

One the plus side I bought myself a new toolset and changed the ball joints and track rod ends with no issues!!

James

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Cool, just let me know then mate.

Ive just done track rod ends and track rods on our RS2 172, and it feels SO much better now.

Still some slight play in either the rack or UJ though, but the poor thing has done 140K in fairness and a lot of them recently have been round various tracks, must have done about a dozen trackdays in it now, even though its meant to be the mrs daily driver, as Ive been too busy to finish some of our trackday cars so we have been using that instead, lol

If its all apart anyway, the valves are good insurance IMHO, even if your look fine, as its a relatively common thing for them to fail, and by the sounds of your luck its bound to happen to you if its going to happen to anyone, lol

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Can you PM me the cost of them Chip and as soon as I hear from Mick ill put the order through!

Have you heard anything bad about these engine dynamics cams chip?

140k is a lot of use! my engine would appear to have lasted 82k lol! I couldnt believe how much difference it made replacing them it feels great now it really does!

Touch wood once this is done I can actually use it on track haha!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Inlets were 157 dollars
Exhausts were 207 dollars
Postage was 79 dollars
Total: 443 dollars

Think there was about 30 quid import tax as well.

Based on the current exchange rate that would be: 310 quid in total delivered, rather than 484 quid from Ktec, lol


Ive used the engine dynamics cams mate, for example have a look at porkies video of his clio keeping up with a 240R supercharged exige cup around snetterton last weekend, thats what me and Mike fitted in that when we built him an engine recently.

Nice upgrade for a road car, not massively lairy, still drives like factory, but just got that little bit of extra top end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvneFOUM0kM&list=UUUl0FVqkGMnQm2Gln3n4r_g&index=1&feature=plcp

 

[James23]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

I like the engine bay - looks like the rs2 was meant to be there, set of kv85 magnecors and red coolant hoses would set it off imo.
May just be the camera but the paint looks a bit orange peely on a few of the pics?

 

[SharkyUK]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Thanks alot chris lol!!!

Right after getting the car mapped and the timing set the car was dyno'd and just wasnt making the power. it made a maximum of around 170bhp and 125ft/lb

Chin up, mate... this is exactly what I found after having the ITB conversion done! Mine pulled only 158bhp. Knackered valves, seating, scarred and pitted head, it was a mess. But luckily Matt / TDF sorted it all out eventually but it added an awful lot of pennies to the overall bill. I'm still having trouble with quite low compression (around 11 bar per cylinder) but the Trophy is currently good for 200 horses and 165 lbft so it's not all bad.

Stick with it - you've got an awesome Trophy! I just think we got a bad batch.

 

[2 live]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Use your tiny mate, a decat will make a car illegal but that doesn't stop them being sold/used.

The "rumour" came from the horses mouth during a lift Tom gave me back to the workshop to pick up my car back in 2010. I may be mistaken but I was given the impression the Orbisoud would have to go if I wanted the inlet. Clearly this is not the case but it also seems to compromise performance so personally I think I would still get rid of if I went for the inlet.
Like I said earlier i would like very much for it to work efficiently with a cat.

use my what????

no it doesnt stop them being sold.......drugs are illegal, doesnt stop them being sold either. your point is??? read my post properly...i am saying an inlet that doesnt work with a cat is BS.

 

[JamesT87]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

Cheers mate i think you just have to play the end game like you say. Its so odd because it drives absolutely spot on it really does but it just doesnt make the power! was yours on 1 cylinder mate or accross a few?

James

Chin up, mate... this is exactly what I found after having the ITB conversion done! Mine pulled only 158bhp. Knackered valves, seating, scarred and pitted head, it was a mess. But luckily Matt / TDF sorted it all out eventually but it added an awful lot of pennies to the overall bill. I'm still having trouble with quite low compression (around 11 bar per cylinder) but the Trophy is currently good for 200 horses and 165 lbft so it's not all bad.

Stick with it - you've got an awesome Trophy! I just think we got a bad batch.

 

[Stefan.]

Re: A few new additions to Trophy 147/500 - RS2 Fitted

too much money and aggro for the power imo :quiet: