Dropping Subframe for box removal

[Chapperz]

Hey all,

Dismantled pretty much most of my front end so far trying to get my damn gearbox out. Went with the method of only dropping one side of the subframe and im about 2inchs short of space to get the box out (its currently wedged in the gap).

Seems to me best option is to drop the other side of the sub frame but after lots of searching I'm confused about what extra needs doing to get the space i need. I'm going to carry on reading all post relating to this but if someone could help me out with an answer that would be great.

Oh and Budgie I was going to take it out the top but there's a massive cable for electrics that I just can shift, so changed tack! :dead:

 

[Budgie]

Yeah, loosen the drivers side subframe bolts to allow it to drop further. Just make sure you don't damage the rack/column when you drop it.

 

[matt91]

if you've undone the steering rack just undo the 18mm and the 16mm but leave enough thread in there to keep it up on that side. only need to drop it a few cm's and it'll come out no problem.

 

[Chapperz]

I havent undone the steering rack yet. This is where the confusion is coming in i think. At what point do i need to do this? i have loosened the drivers side bolts (front and back ones) but only about 5 turns of the spanner. How far can i push it before having to do the rack or should i have done that already??!!.....

Lots of questions ... Do i need to crack the drivers side frame like i did for the passengers side?

Almost worth the 500 quid i got quoted to take it out and put back in at this point :/

 

[matt91]

i do the steering rack before i even undo any of the subframe bolts. undo it a bit more, when you can see about 1cm or 2 of thread that should be enough to slide the box out

 

[Dan@SJM]

Uhoh. If you haven't undone the pinch bolt or the rack off the subframe there is a chance you've already pulled the column apart.

 

[Chapperz]

Okay so the guide i followed didn't mention anything about this apart from being careful which i was. Its only since reading further i've seen these comments about the rack. I am a jammy so and so though so would the advice be to just undo the pinch bolt now or as above carry on lowering the frame by loosening the drivers side bolts till i get the clearance needed?

 

[matt91]

i wouldn't chance it if i was you, i'd just undo the 16mm bolt (through the back of the subframe) and the 13mm nut on both sides.

 

[Snake182]

Get the pinch bolt undone asap as its better than risking breaking it, jack the sub frame back up aswell while you do this, putting too much strain on the column will damage it and cost you £££.

However I always undo the rack bolts on the subframe on any gearbox that requires the subframe to be dropped and leave the pinch bolt alone, I then use rope or even chunky cable ties to support
the racks weight (hanging) so that the strain is on the ties/rope not the column, then the rack is hanging in perfect position for when you jack the subrame back up and building it back together.

 

[Dan@SJM]

I've never removed a rack when doing one. I always undo the pinch bolt. Why undo 4 when you can undo 1?

 

[Chapperz]

Roger wilco will do. Going to quite easy to find i guess? Probably the only three bolts left after the amount i've taken off today!

Cheers for the help lads. Greatly appreciated.

If anyone else wants to add their 2 cents feel free

 

[Dan@SJM]

Pop the boot off and rotate the steering until the bolt is facing towards the back of the car then go between the floor pan and the subframe.

Don't forget to take the keys out after you've positioned it.

 

[MicKPM]

I also remove the gear linkage rod to stop the subframe damaging it if it drops

 

[Snake182]

I've never removed a rack when doing one. I always undo the pinch bolt. Why undo 4 when you can undo 1?

I don't remove the rack from the car, normally im working away underneath and while im there I zip them undone (most cars are 2 or 4 bolts which can be easily accessed and undone with an air gun), easier for me I suppose as that's how I have always done it,

Plus when I was an apprentice I watched a guy rip somebody's clock spring apart as the steering was turned at some point by the track rods and put the column back on in the wrong position.

So whilst im removing things from the subframe that will get pulled on when I drop it I do the rack at the same time, doesn't really slow me down, im quick anyway

 

[Chapperz]

Okay so im going to jack up the frame. get access to and undo this pinch bolt then drop the thing bit by bit till i have the room needed.

Man with a plan...

 

[welshname]

It's sods law that you'll damage the rack but rather than piss about with the steering alignment and possibly not lining it up correctly I'd just undo the 4 bolts holding the rack to the subframe. They are a pain as you can barely get any movement on a spanner on the top 2 (bottom two are easy) but it's worth it in the long run imo.

Did mine last weekend and glad I did it this way tbh.

 

[matt91]

i use a 13mm deep socket instead of a spanner, fits in just fine for me. Time for me to put my box back on the car for the third time (due to me being stupid)

 

[MartinR]

Remove both front and rear passenger side subframe bolts, loosen drivers side ones only a tiny bit.

Remove the fuses from the bay fuse box so the loom can be split and moved to the back of the engine bay above the manifold , then bring the box out the top.

If struggling for space remove the clutch assembly. But tbf there is enough room and i find it easier to take the clutch off once the box is out..

Each to their own when it comes to getting the box out tbh. I have never taken one out the bottom so can't comment or help you.

But by the sounds of it there is enough stripped now to come out the top.

 

[Chapperz]

Haha beauty. Pinch bolt out, loads of extra room. Box out and off to agency.

DIY FTW.

Now to put it back together.

Cheers for the help all.

 

[craigybaby37]

Iv proven with a good friend of mine that to do either a gearbox or clutch swap it's twice as fast to remove the entire engine and do it that way, providing you have access to an engine crane that is. Tried changing the box on a 172 dropping the subframe and turned into a 2 day job.

 

[welshname]

I actually wrote that in my project thread! With an engine crane it'd be much faster to just whip the engine and box out together rather than the box on its own.

 

[Dan@SJM]

Iv proven with a good friend of mine that to do either a gearbox or clutch swap it's twice as fast to remove the entire engine and do it that way, providing you have access to an engine crane that is. Tried changing the box on a 172 dropping the subframe and turned into a 2 day job.

I'm keen for a race I will be quicker dropping the subframe. My record for a drive in drive out gearbox change was just over 2.5 hours.

 

[MicKPM]

In a race can go either way depending on setup. I used to pull the lump but on a lift the subframe off is faster

 

[l33th3tr33]

I'm keen for a race I will be quicker dropping the subframe. My record for a drive in drive out gearbox change was just over 2.5 hours.

That's bloody good timing, me and chris (mostly chris) did it in about 5 and a half hours, without rushing. That was on the side of the road too lol

 

[matt91]

refitted my box today, took me about 3 1/2 to 4 hours on my driveway. I'm no mechanic either i just learn as i go along.

 

[MartinR]

If going for it i reckon i could get one out the top and back in within 5 hours.

 

[Chapperz]

You guys are nuts. Took me about 14 hours to get the b*****d thing out. in my defence its biggest job i`ve ever attempted previous being changing the discs

Back on should be a lot quicker now i know whats what.

Should this be an event at the next CS weekender?

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

If going for it i reckon i could get one out the top and back in within 5 hours.

i stll think i can have it out the bottom of my car quicker than you out the top

saying that, ive had my car in parts more timee than i can count, so spanners to had straight away ....

 

[MartinR]

Lol raz.

 

[Budgie]

If going for it i reckon i could get one out the top and back in within 5 hours.

My record was 3 hours 45 mins on a ramp with the box out the top. On the driveway, i reckon 5 hours is pretty much as good as it'll get.

 

[Ade T]

Anyone else struggle with the front two subframe bolts?

The clips holding the captive nut always break off then you have to faff about breaking the clip out to get a socket on it

 

[Budgie]

Anyone else struggle with the front two subframe bolts?

The clips holding the captive nut always break off then you have to faff about breaking the clip out to get a socket on it

Plenty of room to get into those.

I use a swan neck spanner though to lock it off from the top,

 

[Scrooge]

My quickest, engine, box and subframe removal was around 10minutes.






Oxy acetylene ftw!

 

[Mr R.]

My quickest, engine, box and subframe removal was around 10minutes.






Oxy acetylene ftw!

I must book mine in with you.

 

[Scrooge]

Lol

It was on Luke's old trophy that we were breaking.

 

[welshname]

That doesn't include the subframe bolt that got stuck and stopped you getting it out properly the first time round