FAO Mk1 F4R'd owners...Fault thread inside.

[Bluebeard]

I thought we could put all our questions/faults/solutions in one thread as i'm sure you'll appreciate, looking through jords, whiteleys and now pats thread is a little hard work as there are about a billion pages....

I'll start.

When my car is hot, its a pig to start. The starter motor is sticking. I've only just noticed the problem as i'm using it as a daily to try and iron out the faults before it goes anywhere near a track. Basically, once its been driven a bit and its all nice and hot, the starter motor is very very slow. If I leave it to cool down then stick it in gear and rock it or bash the s**t out of the starter, it fires up first time. After that its perfect. Until it gets hot again, then it becomes really slow and then leave it to cool down overnight and its jammed again in the morning.

Anyone else had this? Or got an idea to prevent it??

Cheers.

 

[jay s]

fit the heatshild ?

 

[couzens]

wouldnt be the starter motor at fault would it? also with regards to my/your williams engine hesitation fault have u changed the rocker cover gaskit on yours?

 

[Paddy_g46]

Heatshield....I forgot to fit mine aswell until Andrew pointed it out to me!

Oh and good shout on the Mk1 F4R fault thread!

 

[Bluebeard]

Heatshield?? I wasn't aware there was one. I will have a look tomorrow, its pissing down again now. I've got wet once today, thats enough! Its tucked up in work with its 3rd coat of EGP curing overnight.

I wouldn't have removed it from the engine before we fitted it as it literally came out the 172 and went straight into the valver. Although i suppose if the previous owner of the 172 took it off then i'd never have noticed it.

If I get it 'heat shielded' now, will the problem rectify itself? By that I mean have I buggered up the starter for good?

 

[Paddy_g46]

Heatshield?? I wasn't aware there was one. I will have a look tomorrow, its pissing down again now. I've got wet once today, thats enough! Its tucked up in work with its 3rd coat of EGP curing overnight.

I wouldn't have removed it from the engine before we fitted it as it literally came out the 172 and went straight into the valver. Although i suppose if the previous owner of the 172 took it off then i'd never have noticed it.

If I get it 'heat shielded' now, will the problem rectify itself? By that I mean have I buggered up the starter for good?

You may get away with it, it sounds like each time you are "seizing" it then it is freeing up after only to get too hot again and stick. I would say get a heatshield in there and see what happens!

Also if you are not sure if you have 1 fitted, look down the back where the motor is, can you see the starter cable completely or is it partially covered?

 

[Bluebeard]

I'll tell you tomorrow, its at work and i'm on my sofa...

 

[Bluebeard]

Its got a heatshield.

I'm still not convinced its the same one we're talking about though?? Anyone got any pictures??

The ones I have are the standard valver bulkhead heatshield, the little one around the starter and the big one infront of the manifold and behind the block.

Any helpmuch appreciated!

(A very tired Dan. x)

 

[Paddy_g46]

Its got a heatshield.

I'm still not convinced its the same one we're talking about though?? Anyone got any pictures??

The ones I have are the standard valver bulkhead heatshield, the little one around the starter and the big one infront of the manifold and behind the block.

Any helpmuch appreciated!

(A very tired Dan. x)

The big 1 in front of the manifold and behind the block?! :S I dont think I have that 1 lol.

In that case I would say, whip the motor out and have a butchers. If the motor is playing up just stick another 1 in there for what the hassle is worth!

 

[Bluebeard]

Hello chaps, me again!

Right, making some good progress now, mostly thanks to you lot!

But I have this same problem now and its next on the hit list. When I start the car from cold, it idles proper rough. It stinks of fuel and if I lightly dab the throttle it tries to stall. If I manage to rev it up it seems to clear itself out. Once its running for 60 seconds ish, its sweet as a nut and will be sweet as a nut for the rest of the day. Until it gets cold overnight again and we go back to square one.

Now I do have mickey mouse 1.2 Fuel pump in it at the minute as i'm waiting for my Walboro 255 pump to arrive. Could this be it?

Any help, much appreciated.

 

[f0xy]

Possibly, as it could be working at a lower pressure - so technically the fuel will take longer to get a good supply to the engine... You want 3bar or higher ideally.

If not id hook up an OBD port and check for faults - Coilpack/other sensors can cause missfiring/chugging...

 

[couzens]

is there anything you dont know jord?

 

[f0xy]

Well I think ive nearly had every possible problem in the book so far lol - Ive not had this like daniel does but ive been getting dodgy fuel starvation at times on track with a 172 pump....... Im not 100% sure if the lower spec models use a lower pressure pump, I doubt they would use one that could provide for a 2.0l anyway..

 

[Paddy_g46]

Havnt really got an answer for you but 1 of my cars used to do this exact same thing, was worse on cold mornings, after 100 metres of kangarooing it was spot on until the engine got cold again!

I always suspected the Lambda, which would get hot very quickly and maybe "cure" the issue.

 

[Matteh]

my starter does that too!

I don't have the heatshield on - I bought a new one from Reno but it won't fit with the exhaust wrapped

anyways, mines perfect when cold, but occasionally when it's hot, the solenoid will just click and nothing will happen .
I've got a brand new battery on it too, which helped a bit... New starter too (though not from reno)

Hitting the starter has little effect, but rocking the car with the starter engaged will *always* 'free' it up and it will turn over and fire up perfectly

makes me rage :dapprove:



chugging when cold... lambda/coolant temp sensor/air temp sensor? are you using the early ph1 pressure regulator on the rail?


p.s. high 5 for the F4R Mk1 thread!

 

[Whiteley]

I dont see how you all have so many problems. I put mine in in August last year and it's been fine since!

 

[Bluebeard]

I dont see how you all have so many problems. I put mine in in August last year and it's been fine since!

Mine is fine, everything I have fitted has been spot on. Its just the shitty old valver bits that are falling apart!

(The gearbox bolt falling out is not included in this statement...)

 

[Rob]

Ironically this thread makes me want to buy a mk1, bung it on the drive/in the spare garage, and bung and engine in it, unfortunately I don't have any keen friends, and none of you knowledgeable lot are local...

Daniel, YHPM incoming.

 

[Matteh]

Patrick and I are just up the road


Whiteley, mines done over 30K now... so not tooo bad

 

[sideways danny]

Hello chaps, me again!

Right, making some good progress now, mostly thanks to you lot!

But I have this same problem now and its next on the hit list. When I start the car from cold, it idles proper rough. It stinks of fuel and if I lightly dab the throttle it tries to stall. If I manage to rev it up it seems to clear itself out. Once its running for 60 seconds ish, its sweet as a nut and will be sweet as a nut for the rest of the day. Until it gets cold overnight again and we go back to square one.

Now I do have mickey mouse 1.2 Fuel pump in it at the minute as i'm waiting for my Walboro 255 pump to arrive. Could this be it?

Any help, much appreciated.

Sounds like its very rich at cold start. I would get yourself a new temp sensor

 

[Matteh]

air or coolant?

 

[Bluebeard]

air or coolant?

What this man said!

 

[Rob]

Patrick and I are just up the road


Whiteley, mines done over 30K now... so not tooo bad

Let's be friends.

 

[Paddy_g46]

Ironically this thread makes me want to buy a mk1, bung it on the drive/in the spare garage, and bung and engine in it, unfortunately I don't have any keen friends, and none of you knowledgeable lot are local...

Daniel, YHPM incoming.

DO IT! Mk1's are a Great learning curve

Patrick and I are just up the road


Whiteley, mines done over 30K now... so not tooo bad

Let's be friends.

"forum friends!" (inbetweeners reference) I'm sure I could spare the odd weekend to get you going! I think to this date I hold the record for F7P to F4R conversion, wednesday morning to friday afternoon

(credit due to all the guys who went before me and basically wrote a guide! lol)

 

[Bluebeard]

I think to this date I hold the record for F7P to F4R conversion, wednesday morning to friday afternoon

With an engine compartment fire on the wednesday irrc?

 

[Laine_16v]

Now i fall into this category....

I uprated mine I just need to find a way to hold the shield to the starter, will use stainless cable ties i think.

 

[Savi]

How have you wired up the OBD plug?

Great thread, will come in handy once i've rebuilt mine again

 

[Rob]

Oh god, I think I'm going to buy one... Buy the shell before xmas, get it all ready, find the engine after... I'm about to move into a house with an empty garage too...

I'll be contacting you Patrick (you're done for it now)

What I want more than anything is the learning curve tbh.

 

[Savi]

I've got a valver shell

 

[Rob]

....how much do they go for?

One question though, all of these who've gone and done it themselves, how did you time it up etc? Take it somewhere or buy the tools??

 

[Paddy_g46]

Now i fall into this category....

I uprated mine I just need to find a way to hold the shield to the starter, will use stainless cable ties i think.

Does the heatshield go on the front of the starter or between the starter and the block?! I have mine between the starter and the block, is mine wrong? lol

 

[sideways danny]

air or coolant?

What this man said!

coolant

 

[f0xy]

Does the heatshield go on the front of the starter or between the starter and the block?! I have mine between the starter and the block, is mine wrong? lol

Should be in the space between the manifold and the starter

 

[Paddy_g46]

Should be in the space between the manifold and the starter

I think mine is on wrong then! :S So it should be mostly visible when fitted?

 

[Paddy_g46]

I think mine is on wrong then! :S So it should be mostly visible when fitted?

bump

 

[f0xy]

Have you got a pic of yours fitted?

 

[Bluebeard]

Hello chaps, me again!

Right, making some good progress now, mostly thanks to you lot!

But I have this same problem now and its next on the hit list. When I start the car from cold, it idles proper rough. It stinks of fuel and if I lightly dab the throttle it tries to stall. If I manage to rev it up it seems to clear itself out. Once its running for 60 seconds ish, its sweet as a nut and will be sweet as a nut for the rest of the day. Until it gets cold overnight again and we go back to square one.

Now I do have mickey mouse 1.2 Fuel pump in it at the minute as i'm waiting for my Walboro 255 pump to arrive. Could this be it?

Any help, much appreciated.

All sorted!! Got a fuel pump and holder off ebay (Its like brand new!) and it runs as good as new!

 

[Bluebeard]

Me again...

The fcuking chugging from cold has started again. The new fuel pump 'seemed' to have cured it for all of about 2 weeks and now its doing it again.

Any ideas??

 

[f0xy]

Got a hose connected from the inlet manifold to the fuel pressure regulator?

 

[Bluebeard]

Yes.

Off the front, just by the throttle body?

It only does it for about 2 mins, then its perfect.