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few problems just had my car itb'd



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andybutlers

ClioSport Club Member
  Focus rs, Audi, Clio
my cars a phase two and is a ripper paul haha.. my 205 was def alot quicker than nicks and quicker than my cup. Apparently nicks clio is 30bhp more now and yet my slower car is still pulling away it doesnt work out
 
It's great to see you're making such an effort to get this sorted Matt! Don't know why you seem to be getting so much of a flaming. Hope its sorted easily :)

Hi chap, its all aprt of the plan to get it running spot on!

Don;t think theres too much flaming, alot of people on here are very helpful, and some just don;t seem to know what they're on about lol!

Matt
 
You're going to have a hell of a job setting the timing with a DTI, the cams fall out when you remove the cover...

I'm sure the VVT actuator should click, have you tried measuring it's resistance?
 
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Adey.

ClioSport Club Member
You're saying that the difference between fly and wheel is the trans losses, and is completely seperate to the map?

Makes sense to me.

Yeah, the more power you have the bigger the losses but the map makes no difference to this flywheel @ the wheel figure wether it be a good or poor map
 
  lift number 1 @ btm
I have to say, I'm very interested to know what is actually going on with this car..

My engine has 422's and no vvt, but I'm sure the cams are specifically non vvt. They also need verniers to time correctly.

As far as I know the 428's should use the oem specs.
 
You're going to have a hell of a job setting the timing with a DTI, the cams fall out when you remove the cover...

I'm sure the VVT actuator should click, have you tried measuring it's resistance?

Havent tried measuring its resistance, but it is drawing current according to our scope. No audible click, will use the steth tomorrow...
 
I have to say, I'm very interested to know what is actually going on with this car..

My engine has 422's and no vvt, but I'm sure the cams are specifically non vvt. They also need verniers to time correctly.

As far as I know the 428's should use the oem specs.

In that case, Danny has timed the enginewith his renault tools to be as per OEM, and we have lost 50bhp... arghhh! lol
 
Yeah, the more power you have the bigger the losses but the map makes no difference to this flywheel @ the wheel figure wether it be a good or poor map

Plus if you look at thre torque curve on the graph (or any of my graphs) you will note that I can indeed, map an engine (6 years of doing so which among the masters isnt alot, but its alot more than most!!)

But yes, the flywheel power is worked out by the dyno, using principles such as SAE80DIN to give a percentage loss. A crap map or a good map will give the same differences between the two...

Only the really good mappers can reduce the transmisiion losses with a laptop, thats usually done inbetween fitting cams to RX-7s, and gasflowing the pistons lol :p

Matt
 
Havent tried measuring its resistance, but it is drawing current according to our scope. No audible click, will use the steth tomorrow...

I think it'd be tempted to pull it out.

from the manual:
The camshaft phase shifter (1) is located on the inlet camshaft. Its role
is to alter the timing pattern. It is controlled (to operate or not) by the
injection computer via a solenoid valve (2) on the cylinder head cover.

The solenoid valve is closed at rest. It authorises
the passage of oil to control the phase shifter in
line with the operation of the engine:
- if the engine speed is between 1,800 and
6,500 rpm,
- if the throttle potentiometer is not at no-load.
WARNING: if the solenoid valve is jammed in the
open position this will result in an unstable idle
and the pressure in the manifold at idle will be
too high.
NOTE: to replace the solenoid valve seal, refer to
the procedure descried in section 11 "Top and
front of engine".
 
  lift number 1 @ btm
In that case, Danny has timed the enginewith his renault tools to be as per OEM, and we have lost 50bhp... arghhh! lol

That's what I mean. It doesn't make sense!

I'm meaning the 422's need verniers, I think the 428's should be fine on normal pulleys.

Hopefully Cat can shed some light.
 
That's what I mean. It doesn't make sense!

I'm meaning the 422's need verniers, I think the 428's should be fine on normal pulleys.

Hopefully Cat can shed some light.

Thanks for the input, roll on Monday! I too am intrqigued by this little french two litre four pot!
 
  williams and trophy
Yeah, the more power you have the bigger the losses but the map makes no difference to this flywheel @ the wheel figure wether it be a good or poor map

so a car going in with 250 bhp at the wheels...and coming out at 270 makes no diff to the actual flywheel figures??


i see. the map miraculously just gets rid of transmission losses.??
 

Cro

  Meg'd r27
Im almost certain too that the vvt actuator should click. I'm almost certain as well that if these are 428s they should be timed up as per OEM.

Are they DEFINATELY 428s?
 
  lift number 1 @ btm
so a car going in with 250 bhp at the wheels...and coming out at 270 makes no diff to the actual flywheel figures??


i see. the map miraculously just gets rid of transmission losses.??

I think you are both making the same point.

As in the ratio won't change. for more power you will have more losses, but it will still be the same scale.
 
Im almost certain too that the vvt actuator should click. I'm almost certain as well that if these are 428s they should be timed up as per OEM.

Are they DEFINATELY 428s?

yes defo 428's , they only cost £498 back in 2007 as well , lol
DSC01087.jpg
 
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Really? What else is going on there?
I'm actually interested.

That was what they were both trying to say though.

going of topic a bit here, but this kind of points you in the right direction:

http://www.max-boost.co.uk/max-boos...wer - engine dynos and rolling road dynos.htm

One more thing to think about, you've no doubt seen a RR printout showing power at wheels, coastdown and by adding the 2 together a calculation of flywheel power. Look the coastdown curve, does it look like a percentage of anything?
 
Hi chaps,

Well we've bneen a bit manic as we have a drift car and a kit car to finish building for japfest this weekend. Nick, I did get a missed call from you, best thing is to ring the office (01373 30 30 33) during working hours!!

I've spoken to GMC and they have confirmed stock timing for these cams, so I'm going to try a few things out now we have confirmed cam timing and compression are A-OK.

Roll on 200bhp :)
 
  53 Clio's & counting
will be interested to see what you find out Matt :)

seems so weird it had more power when the timing was out
 
No worries mate, we just literally had the MOT bay arrive today, so its a bit mad at the mo. Danny popped in again and he too was scratching his head (and hes the renault master!) I'm sure he wil be online to post up his thoughts...
 
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