Please help with Engine Issue - 182 2004

[Jontt]

Before and after of crankcase - dang that looks sexy!
Made a slight balls up. When I rotated the crank the pistons took some solvent down the bore with them and have wiped the bores clean of oil. The bores look too clean, I know they are supposed to have some kind oil protection. Shall I give the bores a light coating of engine oil Dan? Is that what you meant before? Thx

 

[Jontt]

Righto - ordered all of the engine parts that I need, including the belt kits and gaskets sets etc. The final price was....errrr... yes lets not talk about that...

I notice that the gasket set comes with the valve stem seals, is there any reason why I shouldn't replace them? I may as well.

OK just need to clean up the last few bits now before the parts arrive.

Ooooooo exciting! Nerve racking!

 

[Jontt]

Evening all - hot one today!

Little stuck at the mo. Head is off the car, and I am trying to remove the crank bolt to remove the crank pulley to remove the old cambelt.

So I need a way to lock the crank. Nothing obvious springs to mind, so I guess this is where the special tools start to come into play? I guess the special Renault tools lock the flywheel in some way.

If so, do we know any members that have a Renault cambelt tool set that I could rent out please?

Thanks

EDIT - I assume the set includes tools to lock the crank and the cams separately.

 

[Jontt]

OK after reading the service manual I think the following are required:
- Mot. 799-01 (I think this is a tool to turn cam pulleys)
- Mot. 1054 TDC Crank Pin
- Mot. 1496 Flat tool for rear of cams
- Mot. 1509 & 1509-01 Cam pulley locks

Sound right?

 

[Dan@SJM]

Yup oil the bores just to keep them fresh.

Yes they're the tools you need.

 

[Jontt]

Thx Dan - I'll get on it.

I put a couple of marks in the cylinder head face, will they be ok do we think? Please say yes.

 

[Jontt]

Ah just realised I missed a tool off the list - Mot.1505 tool for checking belt tension, does anyone know about this tool, what it looks like etc? Thx

 

[Dan@SJM]

Tension is checked on the tensioner, don't worry about it

 

[Jontt]

Awesome! Valve remover and lapper gear just arrived... here we go... GULP

 

[Jontt]

Valves all out with no problems. The inlets didn't feel bent, possibly some of them had a slight bit more resistance while sliding from the guides but nothing very noticable.

Cleaning up the exhaust valves which I am re-using, as show below with a dirty and cleaned valve. Also I shall re-lap them into the head seats:

 

[Dan@SJM]

Yes, I'd relap them as you've removed them, why not kind of thing.

 

[Jontt]

Great will do - 8 lovely fresh exhaust valves. Will re-lap and polish tomorrow. And clean up the head a little more. Now got to cocentrate of sourcing Renault tools.

 

[Jontt]

Hey guys & Dan@SJM

Just a couple of things that have been bugging me that I want to get straight in my mind:

1) to remove the crank pulley bolt is it best to rely on the crank TDC locking pin to lock the crank? Or re-install old cambelt and lock the cam pulleys? Not sure which is the safest way to lock the crank to remove crank bolt. Terrified about snapping Crank TDC locking pin inside engine while un-doing crank bolt! Service manual does not make this clear.

2) when fitting/sealing the cam covers, both the service manual and Andy@Engine Dynamics say to use sealer on just ONE side of the gasket. I don't get this, surely sealant should go both sides of the gasket? Otherwise surely one side will be gasket direct on metal which I wouldn't have thought would be oil-tight?
thx

 

[Jontt]

First valve re-lapped. Man that took ages. Plus side is that it looks completely baller compared to normal valve:

 

[Dan@SJM]

Hey guys & Dan@SJM

Just a couple of things that have been bugging me that I want to get straight in my mind:

1) to remove the crank pulley bolt is it best to rely on the crank TDC locking pin to lock the crank? Or re-install old cambelt and lock the cam pulleys? Not sure which is the safest way to lock the crank to remove crank bolt. Terrified about snapping Crank TDC locking pin inside engine while un-doing crank bolt! Service manual does not make this clear.

2) when fitting/sealing the cam covers, both the service manual and Andy@Engine Dynamics say to use sealer on just ONE side of the gasket. I don't get this, surely sealant should go both sides of the gasket? Otherwise surely one side will be gasket direct on metal which I wouldn't have thought would be oil-tight?
thx

1. Aslong as you have the genuine pin, it'll be fine.

2. There is no gasket, just sealant.

 

[Jontt]

Duh! Oh yeh sorry got confused. It's the heat.

Great! All is going well. Finished lapping all 8 exhaust valves. Took 5 hours! They look more or less new, no pitting or anything. Very happy.

Now we wait for new inlet valves and all the other guff to arrive.

 

[Jontt]

Duh! Oh yeh sorry got confused. It's the heat.

Great! All is going well. Finished lapping all 8 exhaust valves. Took 5 hours! They look more or less new, no pitting or anything. Very happy.

Now we wait for new inlet valves and all the other guff to arrive.

 

[Jontt]

Duh! Oh yeh sorry got confused. It's the heat.

Great! All is going well. Finished lapping all 8 exhaust valves. Took 5 hours! They look more or less new, no pitting or anything. Very happy.

Now we wait for new inlet valves and all the other guff to arrive.

 

[Jontt]

Yay love computers

 

[Jontt]

Today in pictures:
- parts arrived
- fitted new valve stems seals
- re-fitted the refreshed exhaust valves

 

[Jontt]

Hey guys - stuck again lol

Looking ahead to cylinder head bolt tightening Service Manual says "tighten to 2 daN.m", I get that bit, I assume is means tighten to 20Nm. Or is it 200Nm? It's 200 isn't it?

But after that it says "then carry out angular tightening of 165º +-6º", I have no idea what that means? Why does it say to tighten to an angle? Surely you tighten to a torque, not to an angle?

Confused 😧

 

[bloke]

tighten, let gasket compress, tighten again to same figure and then tighten to angle.

 

[karol_SVK]

2 da Nm= 20 Nm.
Fix me if I am wrong, but 2 da + 165 degrees is a lot of torque

 

[Jontt]

tighten, let gasket compress, tighten again to same figure and then tighten to angle.

Ok. "tighten to angle" means litteraly that yes? turn the bolt clockwise through 165º angle?

Also, do that procedure for each bolt, then move on to next bolt? Or do all bolts for each stage?

thx

 

[Jontt]

Ta da! Head assembly finished. Mega proud of that. Gotta get my head around the head bolt tightening before going any further.

 

[Jontt]

Bah - another question:

Service manual says to "reprime" hydraulic stops with diesel before re-fitting to head. Why is this please? I'm not sure I can get a container of diesel, can I reprime with a container of engine oil maybe?

thx

 

[Jontt]

OK managed to get crank pulley bolt off. In the end I jammed a screwdriver into flywheel to stop crank and that did trick.

Just realised that I forgot to buy replacement crank bolt as was suggested earlier in this thread. Doh! Service manual says not to re-use bolt if length>49.1mm. It measures 53mm. I can't believe it has stretched by 4mm! Crazy.

OK so need to source a new bolt by the looks of it.

Also, can't help but notice that the toothed crank timing belt sprocket/pulley is not toothed to the crankshaft.... so it can rotate freely on the crank.... thats just asking for trouble surely...

 

[Dan@SJM]

Don't reuse them anymore, apparently there was a TSB saying they must be replaced now, I do it every time. Personally I've never reprimed lifters, just wound it over on the starter with no plugs for a few seconds.

Yes that's a thing of these engines, you rotate the belt without the cams etc to equalise the tension, so nothing is keyed, and there are no timing marks.

As for head torque, it usually works out to be about 70nm, but I do 20nm, then 20nm again, and then 165deg

 

[Jontt]

Cheers Dan

OK, just waiting for a my Renault tools and some other tools to arrive, and then the head will go on and look at get the timing belt on.

 

[Jontt]

Head back on block :smile: Took bloody ages, couldn't get it to sit right.

 

[Jontt]

As well as Crank bolt Service Manual says to change cam pulley bolts also. Do you guys do that or re-use old bolts?

 

[Jontt]

Hmm, well, I snapped all of my 3/8" drives trying to tighten the head bolts.

The socket required is a E14 female torque, but no one seems to manufacture them in 1/2" drive.

Unsure how to proceed.

EDIT - oh, found one.

 

[Jontt]

Hey guys. Looking ahead at fitting cams.

Manual says fit cams with right hand end grooves level. That is fine, but how to I ensure that the cams are not out by 180º rotation? Do you know what I mean?

It says to "offset cams down", but I don't know what that means. I've got nothing on the cams to reference to up or down.

 

[Ol’ Tarby]

Isn't the slot in the end of the cams off centre? Or have I made that up?

 

[Jontt]

Oh yeh! Sorry, didn't notice that! Thanks

Lets push on.

 

[Dan@SJM]

As well as Crank bolt Service Manual says to change cam pulley bolts also. Do you guys do that or re-use old bolts?

No. Never. You'll have all the correct fixings if you purchased the genuine head gasket set. If not, the fixings are nearly £30 on their own.

A decent 3/8th socket will do the head bolts, I only ever use 3/8th other than for hub nuts.

 

[Jontt]

You never re-use the cam pulley bolts? Does that include the thread that is in the end of the exhaust cam? Not sure if it is removable.

 

[Jontt]

No worries - I'll change it all for new stuff - doesn't seem much point of going this far and not changing small bits like this. Thx

 

[Jontt]

OK head finally torqued. After shredding 5 chinese 3/8" drives, I borrowed a Snappon 3/8" from Kwikfit mate and it worked perfectly. Shows the difference in quality tools.

OK that's my first angular torquing session over and done with. Head torqued. Can't say I enjoyed it. Was an ugly procedure. Some bolts felt tighter than others and made more sound so now I'm paranoid that a mistake happened. But I def followed procedure so it should all be correct. Please work lol.

 

[Jontt]

Got a big post next so going to skip to post #121 so it appears on a new page. PTO