Jay said:Is the 197 going to be at Renaultsport / Oulton Park trackday?
Also if I see 197 bhp and the figures that go down on paper next to it aren't as impressive as a car with 172 bhp written next to it, what am I to think? Do I think:
(a) I know I'll go and spend £16k on something that costs THREE THOUSAND POUNDS more and doesn't perform as well?
or
(b) I have a brain - I'll go for the 172 bhp variant...
I'm sorry but Renault: wake up and remember that it's not just car fanatics and members of Cliosport that will buy this car!
clios arent really about handling or speed to me, there about a fun feeling of grabbing a cool little car by the balls and being connected to the road, the 172cup does that for me more than any other car ive driven.. even on s**t tyres. it puts a grin on your face and your mates what more do you want ? one of my friends has an impreza and he`s never embarassed to be in the passenger seat of the cup always grin together. as long as the new 197 can do this thats fine, but if its over sealed from the world outside and too refined and heavy then it will never do it, unfortunatley thats the nature of a more grown up car.
silly little car, serious performance car when modded the cup a one off imo
[quote=TheJesusI'll be getting a 197 or a Megane for my next Renault...
Im not buying one.Have you seen the review of the R27 and the new cooper S works in evo this month.
The mini is faster in every aspect
Unfair test.
Im not buying one.Have you seen the review of the R27 and the new cooper S works in evo this month.
The mini is faster in every aspect
Im not buying one.Have you seen the review of the R27 and the new cooper S works in evo this month.
The mini is faster in every aspect
I do rate evo magazine but that sounds like a load of rubbish to me.
I have just sold a mini cooper s with extra engine work done to it so it was quicker than the works version. The 197 f1 which I have just bought would tear that mini apart around a track. Reasons for this.......
1- The Brakes ---- Try braking in the mini like you can in the r27 and you will die.... simple as that... the renault brakes are in a different league to that mini and most other cars on the market.
2- Tyres ---- run flats as standard on the mini -- If there has been any rain in the last 24 hours you can expect to die at any time.. those bmw runflats are heavy, lumpy s**tters -as are there alloys.
3- Price --- jcw mini with aircon, cd, cruise, recaro interior ---- you are looking at £20k plus ....... clio r27 - £14k
So there is a £6k-£10 price difference depending on options.... and you then would have to spend another couple of grand changing the minis brakes, alloys and tyres if you wanted to have a chance of it beating the clio. The seats in the clio really help you when your going fast - they put the mini ones to shame. If you want the bmw recaro seats it will cost you £1500 and your side airbags wont work any more.
I drove my mini fast for three years- great car - but its expensive, and there is no way the works version is quicker than the clio on track or road conditions. I changed my coopers brakes and tyres for better ones and the clio still destroys it around the bends.
So sorry evo - but as someone who has paid for and driven both cars extensively- the mini is not a quicker car. It is more refined without doubt - but it should be for the money. Driving the r27 makes me realise exactly where bmw held back on the mini - the r27 seems to have been built with the track in mind - the cooper s is built with the intention of selling it to as many people as possible.
Price of the new mini,£17540 clio as tested £17250
And dont bore me either with super one off deals from motorpoint because they can all be got cheaper
ian
1.30.80 for the mini and 1.31.70 for the clio
1.30.80 for the mini and 1.31.70 for the clio
172 Cup - 1:27 :approve:
:rasp:
Your wrong mate.
Im not going to bore people too much much
Price of the new mini,£17540 clio as tested £17250
And dont bore me either with super one off deals from motorpoint because they can all be got cheaper
Around the west circuit the mini was faster
1.30.80 for the mini and 1.31.70 for the clio
The mini was slower to 60 because of the need for another gearchange but then beat the clio to 100 by nearly a second
It also has a higher top speed of 145mph against the clio's poor 134mph
Evo say the mini wins becayuse its more fun,more of the time.It also moves around quicker,engages and involves more.It is also noticably quicker in a straight line which makes it there everyday hero
ian
You can buy a clio r27 in any dealer for 14-15k tops -- they havnt been anywhere near £17k for months.
A cooper s works for 17.5 does not include air con, xenons, tints, cruise control, speed limiter, recaro interior all this will push the price up to over 20k .... The clio will come with all of this for under 15k. dont argue with me on this- I have been right tbrough the spec on the new mini works with several dealerships over the last few months.
Who cares about the top speeds - over 130mph its not relevant. There is no way that mini is quicker round a corner than the clio -- and there is no way it stops like the clio...... I know that because I have driven a mini for 50 thousand miles .... the mini is nicer to drive on a motorway ... thats it.
The figures you have just quoted me do not prove the mini is faster.... you cant prove that - its impossible ... the clio is faster in my hands than the mini was and thats all I can go on.
172 Cup - 1:27 :approve:
:rasp:
That was on the old circuit,but i would love to see the cup against some of todays stuff
A lot better how,its only going to move it by 1mph...lol
You can buy a clio r27 in any dealer for 14-15k tops -- they havnt been anywhere near £17k for months.
A cooper s works for 17.5 does not include air con, xenons, tints, cruise control, speed limiter, recaro interior all this will push the price up to over 20k .... The clio will come with all of this for under 15k. dont argue with me on this- I have been right tbrough the spec on the new mini works with several dealerships over the last few months.
Who cares about the top speeds - over 130mph its not relevant. There is no way that mini is quicker round a corner than the clio -- and there is no way it stops like the clio...... I know that because I have driven a mini for 50 thousand miles .... the mini is nicer to drive on a motorway ... thats it.
The figures you have just quoted me do not prove the mini is faster.... you cant prove that - its impossible ... the clio is faster in my hands than the mini was and thats all I can go on.
I was'nt saying anything about trim levels,i was just saying that out of the box the mini was quicker.
You drove the old mini so you dont know...lol
So i gave you quicker times for the mini for 0-100 and round a track but you cant see its faster.Why not
Get your head out of the sand mate,the clio is such a let down its unreal.
The 0-60 times arent even beating the 2002 172 FF that i used to own.
All renault have done is put some fancy seats and stickers in a slow car and sold it to the masses as the next best thing.
ian
That was on the old circuit,but i would love to see the cup against some of todays stuff
Nah it wasn't...it included the Bank corner which was the new addition.
Evo say the mini wins becayuse its more fun,more of the time.It also moves around quicker,engages and involves more.It is also noticably quicker in a straight line which makes it there everyday hero
ian
Well if you drive it with the standard tyres and brakes it certainly moves around alot and it certainly is involving.... I would prefer to call it a death trap myself.
Heres another thing that puts the clio a head in my book -- The driving aids on the mini were shocking - you couldnt pull away from a junction without it killing all the power to the wheels and leaving you stuck in the middle of the road. I could not drive the mini with asc ect switched on and most owners will tell you the same ... especially with the runflats on - wheel spin in every gear, traction control killed the power in every gear.
The renault suffers from none of this- the driving aids seem to actually work with the driver not against you.
Why are they not comparing the megane to the mini anyway- surely they are closer matched in terms of price? Both turbos and lsd as well
Get your head out of the sand mate, its a far superior car to a 172! So what if its no faster? There is more to a car than straight line acceleration (though you wouldn't think so if you read ClioSport!!). It handles better, stops better and is far better built.
I was'nt saying anything about trim levels,i was just saying that out of the box the mini was quicker.
You drove the old mini so you dont know...lol
So i gave you quicker times for the mini for 0-100 and round a track but you cant see its faster.Why not
Get your head out of the sand mate,the clio is such a let down its unreal.
The 0-60 times arent even beating the 2002 172 FF that i used to own.
All renault have done is put some fancy seats and stickers in a slow car and sold it to the masses as the next best thing.
ian
I was on the verge of buying the new mini -- I took it out for several test drives and also drove my mates over a weekend...... If anything it had got worse..... go look on mini 2 forums and see what they think about it -- everything has been softened up on the new model ........
I dont care what performance figures you have ---- the brakes, tyres, seats, suspension are all better on the clio .... and its quicker to 60 .... and if you drive it in the power band it is extremely fast. Thge mini may well have slightly more perfrormance, but unless you spend another 3k on it you wont be able to use it.