The VW Diesel debate

[Russ_16v]

Lately there has been a few threads about VW diesels

i thought i would give my opinion,as i have worked for VW for the past 5 years

basically i believe 0-50mph any new VW diesel will sit with a 1*2

reason being the driveability is so immense,and the only turbo lag really is on the 170 bhp engines

here is a video of a new passat 170 bhp diesel with the DSG gearbox

http://s54.photobucket.com/albums/g108/Russ_16v/?action=view&current=MOV00581.flv


as you can see over 70 is nothing special,but under that the accelleration is what i would call quite good


here is a new golf 170 bhp diesel with a 6 speed manual box

http://s54.photobucket.com/albums/g108/Russ_16v/?action=view&current=MOV00503.flv

same situation,up the higher speeds nothing special,but instant response is pretty good,i know if i wasnt 'on cam' in the 172,one of these would sit with me


make of this what you will guys,hopefully for the one's who havent had the chance to experience the new diesels will have an idea of performance

 

[FlameR]

my missus dad has a mk5 GT TDI 150. I'm gonna have a race with her and film it, then swap cars and do the same again. then I'll post it up

 

[DrR]

This could turn out to be a mass-debate!

Only experience i've had with a modern diesel is a zafira 150bhp, was pretty good i though. Diesel just aint fun as can't cane the crap into them IMO.

 

[Russ_16v]

This could turn out to be a mass-debate!

Only experience i've had with a modern diesel is a zafira 150bhp, was pretty good i though. Diesel just aint fun as can't cane the crap into them IMO.

good point mate



FAO EVERYONE:

this is all in my own opinion from my own experiences


please do not let this turn into some big silly argument!

thank you lots of love

 

[Ally]

 

[AlexS]

This could turn out to be a mass-debate!

Whatever floats your boat mate, personally VW diesels don't really do it for me.

 

[Ally]

Modern diesels have their place in so-called performance cars, and can be fun to drive - my Ibiza being a good example. IMO it's not quite as much fun all-round to drive as my old 172 was, but that's not a reflection of the engine: more a reflection of the limitations of the Ibiza chassis compared to the Clio (Clio chassis + Ibiza engine would = superb car IMO).

However, as an everyday driving proposition, i.e. a compromise, I prefer a reasonably powerful diesel like mine. Economical and quick in real-world day-to-day driving (for me at least), but it's never going to beat the thrill factor from a well-sorted hot hatch such as a Clio 1*2 or (dare I say it) a CTR when you're going balls-out. Yes it's be great to blat around above 5k in a Clio but it just ain't practical.


Only my opinions, as I know some people will just point blank dismiss diesels for reasons only they'll ever understand

 

[Ian_182]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/280287.htm

This is my kind of tdi

 

[gaz44]

Diesels are for lazy people.

 

[MATT BLACK]

Oh dear - the V-dub brigade strike again........

Against a 172 / 172 cup / 182 the VW TDi lump would get shat on - you cannot put into context the capability the F4R engine has on track / strip. Im a big V-DUB / AUDI fan as you know but in a straight line ( my territory ) the vag would get leathered

 

[pinky]

That Noz diesel golf was immense!

 

[MillerLight]

Never driven a VW but i drive a 140 bhp mondeo for work and somtimes a 150bhp astra. desiels are great fot "city centre races" as from 10-50mph not much could keep up with me wen on and off the power. on open roads thery are dull and feel slow IMO

 

[-Leigh-]

I get to drive a 138bhp 2.0 S-line Audi A4 quite a bit at work, and it's as quick for normal driving as my car. The only time when my car is better is handling and on track. The only thing I hate about the diesels is that you run out of revs all the time, and have to change gear every 20 seconds until you're in 6th, I love the way my engine revs all the way to 7250.

 

[BigChris]

can't see how you can compare the two cars in a real world situation.

i sold my clio cup for a passat 130 tdi sport, in the real world my cup would run rings round it... but thats not to my suprise? The 130 Tdi i have is a quality car - not build for acceleration or speed. The torque is great, and you could call it a "lazy" drive, but thats due to the low revs and the fact it returns 52 mpg. I love it... but i will be going to jabba sport shortly to have it remapped to get it up to 170-180 bhp, and near as makes no difference 300 ft/lbs of torque.

As a sensational drivers car the 172s/182s are bang for buck - but for commuting, and general driving i would have my Tdi any day but thats because i "drive" it to work, it does not get "driven" like my cup

 

[edde]

Diesels are for lazy people.

Under what assumption?

 

[Ally]

can't see how you can compare the two cars in a real world situation

Depends what VAG TDI you're talking about. Compare a like-for-like class of car and not a Cup with a Passat and it's a different story. I certainly drive my Ibiza as hard as I used to drive my 172: it's bloody good fun and copes almost as well, but it's still 2nd to my Clio.

on open roads thery are dull and feel slow IMO

Again, try mine :rasp:

 

[tommyboy]

Unleaded till I die!

 

[BigChris]

fair point ally - it is a complete opposite, but then it does alter your driving habit - i no longer "cain" my car...

 

[Munson]

...i know if i wasnt 'on cam' in the 172,one of these would sit with me.

Well whilst that's very likely true, it's a bit like saying I'd leather Scutchs' P1 if he changed up at 2000rpm. The whole point of the Clio is that you have to batter it to death. Then again, the whole point of diesels is that you don't (read can't), so valid comparison I guess, but ultimately there'll never be any universal agreement. I prefer changing up at 7000rpm on V-Power 100 :approve:

 

[TomTom]

Unleaded till I die!

40p a Litre Red > Unleaded

 

[Brett]

i havnt drove a diesel properly, only my grandads metro just on the beach when i was 16 so i can't realy comment but what i wouldnt like is having to change up at 4000rpm, my girlfriends mum has a clio dci 80 and it pulls strongly but have to change up realy early which i wouldnt like but i supose you would adapt.

 

[AlexS]

Unleaded till I die!

40p a Litre Red > Unleaded

Bit risky running on red, dyes all your fuel lines etc too.

 

[Brett]

40p a Litre Red > Unleaded

Bit risky running on red, dyes all your fuel lines etc too.

you can get checked but the chances of it are extremely low in a privatly owned car but my grandads wagon has been checked and builders vans etc do. i'd personally replace the dci badges with 16V ones if i was doing it you'll be less susecptable to random stops then.

 

[Russ_16v]

...i know if i wasnt 'on cam' in the 172,one of these would sit with me.

Well whilst that's very likely true, it's a bit like saying I'd leather Scutchs' P1 if he changed up at 2000rpm. The whole point of the Clio is that you have to batter it to death. Then again, the whole point of diesels is that you don't (read can't), so valid comparison I guess, but ultimately there'll never be any universal agreement. I prefer changing up at 7000rpm on V-Power 100 :approve:

thats what i mean though matey,real world situation is you just dont get the best start every time,you drop off cam,or wheel spin,and this is the real world stuff im taking about,as my vids show up to 50 mph both cars are quite nippy,and would keep with 'faster' cars,but over that not very impressive

the point of those vids was to simply say out in the real world that diesels can be a challenge,on a nice drey day,if you launch really nicely and get everything matched right the 1*2 will win every time,or race strip,or drag strip,but we dont live on race strips or drag strips,im not saying dervs are so much faster im simply pointing out that they can be a good challenge in the right situation

 

[TomTom]

Bit risky running on red, dyes all your fuel lines etc too.

you can get checked but the chances of it are extremely low in a privatly owned car but my grandads wagon has been checked and builders vans etc do. i'd personally replace the dci badges with 16V ones if i was doing it you'll be less susecptable to random stops then.

Black plume of smoke on take offs a dead give away.

I wouldn't know anyway.

 

[Ally]

Black plume of smoke on take offs a dead give away.

Mine's a bit of a smoker...



One thing that I don't think a lot of people are getting is about when you change gear in a diesel. A lot of folk are saying it's crap having to change up at 4k revs. But, it's all relative: 4k in a diesel is like 6.5k in a petrol - in a diesel (well, mine at least) I still give it hell and change up at around the same percentage of max revs. Diesels just don't gain revs as quickly, hence you drive it the same as a petrol (actually very similar to a turbo petrol I'd guess).

All this talk about changing up at 4k revs being crap is just nonsense IMO.

 

[Ian_182]

The 535D does'nt smoke and sits at 90mph on the motorway at 2k revs

 

[AlexS]

Bit risky running on red, dyes all your fuel lines etc too.

i'd personally replace the dci badges with 16V ones if i was doing it you'll be less susecptable to random stops then.

You'd think so, a friend of mine got pulled over in his Frontera and they asked if they could dip it for red diesel.
My friend said, no problem at all, only issue is its a petrol!

 

[FlameR]

Just had a decent drive of the GFs dads mk5 golf gt tdi 150. Bags of torque in 1st and 2nd, but I still know my 172 is faster. It gives up in 3rd 4th 5th and 6th lol. A remap would sort that out though!

 

[Stanton]

to add to the arguement, ive got a GTD engine in mine, 22psi of boost - t3 turbo and 3" exhaust from the turbo back.

makes 150bhp and 180ft/lb.... try and get that from a 1.6 petrol and still get 30 mpg

little video - http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v342/are_ess/?action=view&current=MOV03240.flv

 

[Ian_182]

Thats a great effort there mate

 

[Sarah]

i wen from a 106 gti to golf gt tdi back to 172

the golf was fantastic for motorway comutes, driving to work and back on main roads, economical but it was down right boring even on back roads

the 172 is fun to drive, petrol aint that bad wen pottering

the main thing i look in a car is a car i enjoyed driving which i do in the 172 and in the 106. i raged the car abit a brought a smile to my face.

where as the golf i got easily bored of it

its all down to what you want, fun or eccominal

 

[steven.m]

Mine's a bit of a smoker...

Possibley need oil and air filter change? Common issue with a smokey diesel.

I have to Agree with Ally on most points here I think. Diesel has its place. Get it re-mapped to 200bhp/320lbs ft it would probably lose a 1*2 I think. Atleast it would be "interesting". My Astra pulls pretty well and handling isnt all that bad, but still "not as much fun" round the really tight twisty roads as my Clio was but still fun none-the-less.

Definatly better on the daily commute as I regularly average over 55mpg and also do a fair bit of long distance trips.