2 Weeks ago i took ownership of Number 31 Clio Trophy i traded in my VX220 2.2NA and am amazed how well it handles. Before deciding to buy it i tried the full fat sport and the cup but neither of these can match the sheer grip and handling ability of the Trophy. So why dont we all be proud of what Renault has produced rather than finding fault with what is an AMAZING CAR i sold my VX with a fear that no normal car would satisfy me but this does. So lets salute renault for 3 Great Cars But the Trophy is the Pick of the Bunch.
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2 Weeks ago i took ownership of Number 31 Clio Trophy i traded in my VX220 2.2NA and am amazed how well it handles. Before deciding to buy it i tried the full fat sport and the cup but neither of these can match the sheer grip and handling ability of the Trophy. So why dont we all be proud of what Renault has produced rather than finding fault with what is an AMAZING CAR i sold my VX with a fear that no normal car would satisfy me but this does. So lets salute renault for 3 Great Cars But the Trophy is the Pick of the Bunch.
people would rather air con, and all the gadgets than a decent drivers car
I just think renaults past "versions" of the 172/182 are now pissing people off and some people are having a go saying it is just a run out model, which it isnt. Had renault not done the Cup version of the 182 (not the cup bits!!!) and called this a cup instead there would not have been as much animosity towards the trophy. 1 special edition too many me thinks.
well, credit where credit is due.
I dont think they are trying to recreate anything....pushing the boundaries for a stock standard showroom car, with 3 year warrenty and acceptable service life.......there is alot to account and compramise for.
Increasing power and making a better chassis is logarithmic, you cant carry on gaining 20bhp here, and 20bhp there for nxt to no major change.
i think i should solve the question once and for all.....somebody hand me a trophy and a williams, each totally showroom std.........ill provide the track and the answer
Quote: Originally posted by 182_blue on 09 July 2005
yeh i think the 182 is better than a williams anyway, so no need to try to create another legend, a 182 will beat a williams around a track
You wait till the trophy gets to being 12 years old and see how well it perfoms then, or how much breaks.
Ben - iknow where there is a Williams with a new engine, and mostly new everything else, good luck getting hold of it to rag it, and if you do i pity you in the few hours after the owner finds out
probably as much as the williams does, but that has nothing to do with being a williams tho does it ??, but i bet the trophy will be less rusty than the williams will have beenQuote: Originally posted by Lunner on 09 July 2005
You wait till the trophy gets to being 12 years old and see how well it perfoms then, or how much breaks.
Ben - iknow where there is a Williams with a new engine, and mostly new everything else, good luck getting hold of it to rag it, and if you do i pity you in the few hours after the owner finds out
GW Clio 200
Lets put it this way, this is a cliosport forums so a large proportion of the people who visit and use these forums have Renaultsport models. We have 5 in the range that have been brought out over the last 4-5 years. We have a multitude of diverse cars to choose from ( compared to other car manufacturers ) and we are squabbling over who has this, what car can do that. It is exactly what this forum is about, as long as it stays within the confines of reasonable argument.
Think of the poor Peugeot fanboys who have only had the 206GTI and GTI180 to choose from. There cars are continually slammed for being cr@p, and most of them completely and utterly envious of the write up and praise given to the Renaultsport Clio range.
I have owned the 172Cup 182 and next week the Trophy. All of them have there pros and cons, and those pros and cons alter to each individuals needs and tastes. So what is good for you may not be the Cup of tea for others. There is absaloutely no point in squabbling over such issues.
The opinions and thoughts of the people of this forum are welcome and should all be given consideration. After all thats the whole point of a forum.
If someone is slating the Trophy they are entitled to do so. Getting into a futile arguments is not going to change anything.
Keep the debates going... but lose the hostility towards an opinion you object too!! that will keep threads more entertaining and give them longevity
182 & LY Clio 220 ed
I do think if they could have made some form of engine "tweek" to increase power then it would have been a better car for people to accept, because it has the same power, suspension modifications and a limited number (touch wood its not the same as the Williams scam!) people dont see enough of a difference in the figures than there probably is.
When there was only the MK I 172, MK II 172 and 172 cup there were all the "mines better than yours because..." arguments, its futile and each to their own, its the ability to think independantly that makes us human.
Each to their own, and who cares as long as Renault keep making brilliant little hot hatches!!
Quote: Originally posted by richy on 09 July 2005
Quote: Originally posted by Steve106GTI on 09 July 2005people would rather air con, and all the gadgets than a decent drivers car
[/QUOTE]yet u have a 106gti not a rallye? lol lol that was my comment from the other trophy thread!
lollol
I think the big thing is Renault claim and owners claim its so much better bet many people cannot understand why when so little has changed (some on be honest its not like the 1.8 to Williams changes is it). Now without question it is superb and better than the rest of the range but personally I think few people belive it can be that much better for so little.
Regards the Williams Vs 182 I think to be fair to both cars they should be given the same weight so remove all the heavy airbags etc from the 182 after all if the 182 looses in whatever model it is its a lot safer car with a lot more weight to carry round also since ABS is now a requirment to be legal and maybe RS would prefere the car to be withough this should also posibly be removed.
I do think the trophy would be the quicker car but obviously youd need a good range of drivers in both cars not just Ben who is a supeb driver by all accounts to set lap times and enjoyment factors in both cars.
Id be interested to see the outcome Ive yet to drive a trophy but Id imagine it to swing in lap times in favour of the 182 rarther than the Williams.
kinda contradicts what he says lolQuote: Originally posted by dave182 on 09 July 2005
lol that was my comment from the other trophy thread! lollolQuote: Originally posted by richy on 09 July 2005
yet u have a 106gti not a rallye? lolQuote: Originally posted by Steve106GTI on 09 July 2005
people would rather air con, and all the gadgets than a decent drivers car
Is it possible for such small changes on newer cars give the same sort of changes that the huge changes the Williams did from the valver setup?
Im not having a go at the trophy Id imagine its superb Im just intergued.
I know its not a truly fair test but how far off is a 172 with coilovers like a 182 trophy or has the trophy dampers relay show there extra costs off well?
Amusing thing is that the press praises Renault for their continuing and quite frankly stunning development of the RS Clio. Considering only one engine has been used for the past few years the difference in cars available to us is quite amazing.
There is a car for everyone and most budgets, surely thats a good thing? The Trophy may appear to be the same but from all accounts the damper changes transform it yet again (and lets not forget standard Recaros). It wouldnt have been easy for Renault to squeeze more out of it and minimise costs, and lets not forget its miles ahead in power terms compared to anything in its class (and quite a few cars above it) anyway.
The obsession with power is quite interesting as Im sure improved handling and better brakes would actually be more beneficial to the majority of us. Renault seem to have found the optimum performance considering the size, weight and cost of the car. Lets not forget that they have things such as finances and sales figures to work with as well, boosting the Clio into Megane 225 territory wouldnt do any favours for the RenaultSport brand at all.
If you really look into it, or understood chassis geometry in its entirety, which is a multitude more complex than engines, you would see that there has been no small amount of changes. The williams has a wider track, some different damping and springing, very minorly different scrub radius, altered SAI because they are using the same top pickup.
Compare that with the changes on the trophy which would be, wider front and rear track, altered scrub radius/caster offset/SAI, ligher wheels, lowered 30mm in terms of actual ground clearance, stiffer springing and damping, stiffer damper bodies with larger reservior to reduce overheating through hysteresis, beefier steering hubs yadda yadda yadda.
Buts its not about how many components you change, but rather how well as a system you get everything to work. What do i mean by that? Well you ask how far off is a 172 on coilovers? well, depends.........the majority of coilovers available to road users for under a grand are, well....sh*t. Secondly their damping and springing are calcualted along the lines of 30% stiffer and harder. Thirdly, people playing with their dampers tend to adjust them in poor manners because they dont know better, and its not their fault really.....dampers which are rebound adjustable have no effect on damping properties, but rather how fast the shock recovers. Wind it up and it takes longer for the shock to extend again, giving the impression that the car has less roll. Which is bad because the shocks can run out of travel for the force of the spring compression, loose damping ability and be practically useless on anything but smooth tarmac.
at the end of the day, its faster...whether most people can realisitcally drive up to the level to notice it is another thing, there is a reason why test drivers are rather good at their job lol.
williams 2 turbo
is that last post in english, got my dictonary out and everything but , nah, dont understand a bloody word!
Trophy may be a better drivers car but everyone is entitled to their own opinion of it.
I wouldnt have one as i dont like the colour, if thats being picky, then picky it is! I dont want to be seeing my car everyday and thinking. i dont actually like the look of it! Plus i dont think the wheel colour goes too well.
BUT THATS JUST MY OPINION!
