ok. correct my understanding if i am wrong, but isnt the 172 ecu suppose to learn about the way the engine is running etc. so if for example you do replace the intake system with a viper or bmc cda, it will automatically adjust the fueling to suit and not allow to run lean/rich due to the twin lamda sensors on the cat?
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Viper Induction Kit
- Thread starter Sangy
- Start date
ok. correct my understanding if i am wrong, but isnt the 172 ecu suppose to learn about the way the engine is running etc. so if for example you do replace the intake system with a viper or bmc cda, it will automatically adjust the fueling to suit and not allow to run lean/rich due to the twin lamda sensors on the cat?
Im waiting for the R-sport ECU to come out instead of getting a remap done. It seems ok at the moment but the proof will come out on Saturday.
BenR - I spoke to Trevor at K-Tec aboutthe breather as wasnt sure and he says its fine, what would you have done. I was thinking of keeping the original pipe from the airbox into the engine but it didnt quite fit...
Markh - the standard ECU does have the ability to compensate for certain scenerios, but putting the Viper (or BMC CDA etc) makes it breath too well, and the ECU cannot adjust itself that much, and so you end up leanin out or overfueling, Im not sure how the RS ecu will cope with this, well see I spose (if it ever comes out
) but a remap is the only decent way to make sure that @WOT you aint gonna do harm to the engine.On another noteI was going to spend saturday just fiddling about trying to get the viper repositioned correctly, but now Ive been asked to do some infrastructure testing @work
- so I guess Ill be pulling it all apart at work (now where did I put that dremel?)
only because the breather system design is very effective on the 172 and taking out its main source of vacuum by not having the breather attatch to the link pipe. WOnt cause anything major, but it would rather have it in, i run the breahter in mine....and it wont stink either...
Piper X only did it cause its easier than get samco to make up a pipe witha attatchent on its elbow.....
At wide open throttle - foot to the floor, the ECU runs in open loop and bases the fueling on static maps built into its memory - this is why a remap is a good thing as they base it on the mods on the car. On idle and driving the ECU runs in closed loop and adjusts fueling based on for example the upstream lambda sensor reading the oxygen content in the exhaust. P.S. if any one is interested I have an induction hose kit for sale with breather pipe fitment suitable for various induction kits.
has anyone gotta pic of their viper fitted in a mk1 172? if they could post it on here or mail it to me mailto:mattarundale@hotmail.com">mattarundale@hotmail.com it would be much appreciated, cheers
Matt
Yeah, both myself and chris have had ours RRd when we had them remapped at London Superchips/Power Engineering.
Here are the bhp and torque graphs from mine, solid line is the after remap.
http://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Bhp-Graph-16.gifhttp://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Bhp-Graph-16.gif
http://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Torque-Graph-16.gifhttp://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Torque-Graph-16.gif
Here we go guys, my car with its new look
http://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Viper-Feed-Pipe-small.jpg
http://www.roamer-it.co.uk/cliosport/Viper-Feed-Pipe-Close-small.jpg
Thats one lovely looking job,
Is it assumed that the Viper is the best option when it comes to induction kits for clios then? I only have a 1.2 so any power gain would be greatly appreciated, Mainly want the sound though!
Have seen messages ref: remapping following fitment? what does this mean? whats involved? how much? cheers
Good job Roamer!!!!
Noel, you could spend £250 on a viper and ok, fair enough it might give you say 5bhp gain, but then youll have 80bhp........................woooo!!! If you want to do it, then fair enough, but im just gonna wait til im older (and my insurance clears up!!!!) and get a faster car.
for a 1.2 16v +VIPER+REMAP+EXHAUST i very much doubt youll get more than 85bhp (i maybe wrong, mines going on the rollers on Saturday, so ill let you know what i get, tom got 76.3bhp on a std engine, ive got a piperx +bbox so im hoping itll be up on tom, but knowing my luck itll be under 75bhp!!!!!)
Sangy, I dont know where you live, but Id recommend London SuperChips/Power Engineering in Uxbridge, Im gonna go down on friday for a bit of a run, get a power run in and see that mines still on target, if its out Ill get Dave @L.S. to touch the fueling slightly...... Come on down!
Oh, and for your first remap session, youre probably lookin at about £300-350 all in, that includes the Superchip costs + RR sessions.
Tom
ClioSport Club Member
EV (s)
The module is a small key, and this is programmed to your car (access number or serial number or summat) and its that that allows a superchips place to access your ecu, without it you would have to pay the full superchips price again (obviously not desirable)
On the subject of mapping a 1.2 16v, well I dont know... have a look at the superchips site and see if they list it.
Interesting stuff!
I spoke to Nick Hill @ Hillpower about these R-Sport ECUs and it seems he used to deal with them when they were Radbourne Racing. Apparantly the ECUs are far from being ready since at present they yield less bhp than a std 172 - you actually lose power! So, a fair bit of development still to do methinks, although I understand that they arent really aimed at road-going cars anyway and might be more for motorsport use.
I also spoke to a very helpful Dave @ BB Tuning who informed me that their ECU mod for the 172 was currently on hold. Why? Well, theyve seen plenty of ECU mods which lose power. Theyve also not had any issues with aftermarket air filters causing lean running engines and the proof of the pudding is their own 172, fitted with their own air filter kit (based on a Green Cotton filter). Which begs the question, how are you guys detecting lean running - with a air/fuel ratio meter and lambda sensor, or by measuring CO on the rolling road?
BB Tuning also seem to have had a fair few 172s fitted with Pipercross Vectors which were seriously down on power. Very strange!
So many conflicting reports - its hard to know what to do!!
Roamer, Ive got to wait for March as am having a Dastek Unichip put on by Owen Developments in Oxfordshire and they are busy tuning race cars at the moment. Is an expensive option but no point getting second rate stuff!
http://www.powerstation.org.uk/Resources/BROCHURE_Dastek_Unichip.jpghttp://www.powerstation.org.uk/Resources/BROCHURE_Dastek_Unichip.jpg
