300bhp N/A

[bastardized]

Has anyone managed to get near 300bhp N/A.
Cat Cams have a new kit http://www.k-tecracing.com/show_product.asp?id=4804&appid=2
which should help plus 84mm high comp pistons.

Any input welcome.

Regards Seb

 

[tom172cup]

If you are wanting that sort of power stay away from ktec.
And take your budget and Triple it lol

 

[dann2707]

Is this still from the f4r? :O incredible if so.

 

[Jaff.]

Is it me or does that camshaft carrier block the spark plug holes...?

 

[182Trophy]

I thought around 215bhp was the most you could get out of these engines?

 

[Knuckles]

Ktec will show you massive gains regardless of what they sell you.

If you want to see number increases, go ktec.

 

[tom172cup]

Isn't it sodemo that builds the mental N/A engines. But have it in my head that they were a similar price to a house

 

[182Trophy]

300bhp na in a stripped clio would feel very pokey indeed!

 

[dann2707]

300bhp na in a stripped clio would feel very pokey indeed!

Just imagine that available power

 

[182Trophy]

Just imagine that available power :smiley:

I cant tbh. I much prefer the power delivery of na. Mind you i haven't driven any big hp turbo cars.

 

[Jonff]

I thought around 215bhp was the most you could get out of these engines?

Most I've seen from an NA F4R.

 

[Dan]

Most I've seen from an NA F4R.

The most powerful yet very very reliable N/A F4R engine!

Immense piece of kit imo!

But it is engineering genius also and I know Nik has spent and awful lot of time and money developing this kit to be just that.

 

[Dannyeff]

This looks amazing! Really tempted to invest in something like this

 

[Dan]

This looks amazing! Really tempted to invest in something like this

Roughly 15k for that engine I would say lol

 

[Jonff]

Brilliant engineering yeahhhh but costs 5 figures to build IIRC.

 

[Dannyeff]

Roughly 15k for that engine I would say lol

Maybe not quite what I'm looking at then but what a beauty it is

 

[Dan]

Thing is if you don't spend the outlay and buy the PMS engine you can build your own then it goes pop then you can build another and it goes pop again and by the time it all goes round your at the same price as the PMS engine and they have been proven to be reliable with an entire season of racing and only oil changes needed lol

 

[NorthloopCup]

Ashford motorsport have a video out there for a 279bhp n/a f4r and I'm pretty sure they've cracked 300+ hp. Not cheap though!

 

[DannyR]

I cant tbh. I much prefer the power delivery of na. Mind you i haven't driven any big hp turbo cars.

Supercharged feels like N/A, that's good for over 350!

 

[Andyman]

300bhp na in a stripped clio would feel very pokey indeed!

If its relying on the 9k rpm then would imagine the lower end of the rev range would feel anything but pokey. Fine for track though

 

[mark123]

Thing is if you don't spend the outlay and buy the PMS engine you can build your own then it goes pop then you can build another and it goes pop again and by the time it all goes round your at the same price as the PMS engine and they have been proven to be reliable with an entire season of racing and only oil changes needed lol

Do they have a blog or something you can point me at? I didn't think they did racing.
The PMS and Ashford engines only revved to around 8k IIRC. To go over 8k with that valve train kit you'll need custom crank and rods too to reduce the piston speeds to something manageable.
The Ashford one

 

[_Jay]

Cost/Power/Reliability - You may pick only two. Seems quite fitting for this thread.

Amazing bit of kit though, I'd imagine they're very fun on track probably not so much off of it. Although for OP, take your budget and double/triple to do it right.

 

[Martin.]

What are the differences between the the 197 and 1*2 engine. Apart from the obvious inlet manifold.

Both being an F4R do they share internals? I know the 197 crank is lighter, but that's all I know.

 

[_Jay]

What are the differences between the the 197 and 1*2 engine. Apart from the obvious inlet manifold.

Both being an F4R do they share internals? I know the 197 crank is lighter, but that's all I know.

I know 197 cams use a different profile, people use them as a mild upgrade for the 1*2's. I'm sure others will chime in, but it's not many as they're almost the same.

Edit - Quite a bit of useful info in this thread - http://www.cliosport.net/threads/engine-differences-172-182-197-200.673220/

 

[mark123]

197 has a better head with different pistons to suit. Various other minor differences.
But in a build like this it is the better head as a starting point that makes the difference.

 

[mark123]

197 head won't make a massive difference though.
Typical expectations for 1*2 sub 8k rpm from memory:
ITB - 190-200
ITB+421cams - 205-215
ITB+high comp pistons+422/423 cams+headwork - 225-240
More than that will require big expense.

 

[Goodj]

300hp out of NA 2-litre 4-pot?

How may revs is that going to take? :grimacing:

 

[Ph1 Tom]

300hp out of NA 2-litre 4-pot?

How may revs is that going to take? :grimacing:

Quite an achievable number. Usually 8500-9000rpm

 

[Goodj]

For how long before a rebuild is in order?

 

[tom172cup]

Honda lump would be the easiest option for 300hp N/A

 

[SharkyUK]

300bhp NA... I'd be crying into my wallet. A very, VERY empty wallet. And at the feet of my bank manager and various debt collectors. But it would be awesome

 

[Goodj]

Be cheaper to buy an NSX and stuff the engine into a V6 Clio....

....that might even work actually..... @cat171 I need your car.....and an NSX, and The Unit for several weeks....

...and some idea of how mechanical things work

 

[Willo40]

How close to the motors limit though? i.e. on the verge of going bang all the time?
Maybe easiest and cheapest setup would be 2 GSRX1000 engines mounted where the back seat is?
http://www.tigerracing.com/z100.php, just as idea of the engine setup.... I bet you could pick both motors up for less than 5k, obviously they would need mounting and setting up, but I am sure there are people on here who could do it...... they would be approx. 160bhp each, so comfortably over 300bhp..... and they would be the 2ltr bracket......:tongueout:, and with a decent map and exhaust those motors would be putting out over 180bhp each.....

Edit :-
Already been done, sorry I didn't know....
http://www.cliosport.net/threads/twin-engined-fireblade-renault-clio.681609/

 

[NorthloopCup]

197 head won't make a massive difference though.
Typical expectations for 1*2 sub 8k rpm from memory:
ITB - 190-200
ITB+421cams - 205-215
ITB+high comp pistons+422/423 cams+headwork - 225-240
More than that will require big expense.

Mine will be standard 197 inlet (just ported) ported 197 head, cams and high comp for a net result of around 230hp. Max rpm 8k unless I change to maxi evo spec top end and steel rods and crank.
It is doable for not a lot of cash as well. You've just got to be prepared to hold out for the stuff to come available.

 

[Cub.]

I like modifying and spending money, but even I'm not mental enough to pay for a 300bhp NA engined clio build.

 

[msremmert]

Honda lump would be the easiest option for 300hp N/A

Came to this thread to say the same thing.

 

[gambit]

What the most power one can hope to achieve with the stock throttle body , but everything else maximized on the engine, internals and head work and cams etc??

 

[marinop37]

What the most power one can hope to achieve with the stock throttle body , but everything else maximized on the engine, internals and head work and cams etc??

Veritec Competition (French) are offering some engine kits
http://www.veritec-competition.com/category.php?id_category=168

for example the 225hp (without the itb's) includes (google translate from french):
- 1 specific pair of camshafts ( for mechanical buttons)
- 1 set of 16 mechanical buttons with shims to correct
- 1 set of 16 reinforced valve springs
- 1 complete set of forged pistons with pins, clips and segments
- 1 set of ARP reinforced connecting rods screw
- 1 set of 8 half shells tri- metal connecting rods (with or without tabs , specify)

so basically you could "tune" your engine pretty much before removing the original throttle body and standard inlet.

 

[gambit]

Veritec Competition (French) are offering some engine kits
http://www.veritec-competition.com/category.php?id_category=168

for example the 225hp (without the itb's) includes (google translate from french):
- 1 specific pair of camshafts ( for mechanical buttons)
- 1 set of 16 mechanical buttons with shims to correct
- 1 set of 16 reinforced valve springs
- 1 complete set of forged pistons with pins, clips and segments
- 1 set of ARP reinforced connecting rods screw
- 1 set of 8 half shells tri- metal connecting rods (with or without tabs , specify)

so basically you could "tune" your engine pretty much before removing the original throttle body and standard inlet.

Thats not too bad..
Looking for someone local to do it though, but 225-230bhp at the engine for high comp pistons, balanced, blueprinted, cams, head work, ported inlets, and an OE throttle body.

 

[NorthloopCup]

What the most power one can hope to achieve with the stock throttle body , but everything else maximized on the engine, internals and head work and cams etc??

The standard throttle body isn't as much of a restriction as the 1*2 inlet manifold. That's the real enemy tbh.