Big Steve World Cup Williams 🌍

[Big_Steve_T]

Back in the summer of 1994 my mother wanted to replace her Peugeot 205 and chose a brand new MK1 Phase 2 Clio 16v delivered on 1st August 1994 with the reg M916 WAV.

I vividly remember that when she ordered the car, the dealer asked her if she wanted to have a Clio Williams 2 instead as he was sure he could get her one? I was all for that, but she declined the offer as she wanted the “Luxury” options of Sunroof & Remote stereo controls that only came on the regular 16v.

I was so taken with that car, and the reason I bought my first 5GTT Raider as it was the closest thing to one I could afford at the time (Here’s my 1st Raider behind my Mothers Clio 16v)

One of my mothers work colleagues actually bought a Clio Williams 2 at the same time and I can remember drooling at the two “HOT” Clio’s parked next to each other at my mothers office when I used to visit her.

I knew back then, that my mother had made the wrong decision buying the regular Clio 16v and wish she had bought the Williams. The car just looked so much more purposeful with those Gold Alloys and wider/squat stance.

I’ve always wanted a Clio Williams, but have never done anything to satisfy that craving, and as the years pass, realise I’d missed the boat as the prices of them just keep climbing up as they rightfully take their place in the Hot Hatch hall of fame.

Earlier in 2022 I went to the Linas De Monthlery Renault show in Paris and the place was awash with Clio Williams’ being thrashed around the track and that added to the conversation with Jesus aka Matty Clements about how much he loved his Williams really got those juices to own my own Williams flowing HARD!

Following my return to the UK I started to see if there was any way I could get myself into Clio Williams… and a few options presented themselves:

1) Chap in Sunderland is selling a Williams 2 on Facebook for £8,500, but it’s a Cat D, and that put me off:

2) Clio Williams 1 on eBay that keeps being auctioned off, he wants £7k for it, and it’s been thru auctions several times and finished making the number, but sure enough, re-appears back on eBay a day or two later as the buyer pulls out?

The problem is, the cars ROTTEN as a pear!!!:

The other problem with this car, is it’s got a load of bits missing which are just unobtainable now.

3) Clio Williams 1 which a chap is trying to sell on eBay right now. The car looks great, and really original. 87k miles, 3 owners, heaps of history, bill of sale, dealer plates etc. BUT, it still needs a pair of sills and arches repairing, so at the £16,500 he wants for it, makes it out of my price range.

4) Looking at what else is available, there’s only one other Clio Williams 2 on sale now at a dealer in Ware. £17,495 gets you a 109k car that again looks really clean: But I’m not interested in spending that much money, so it got knocked on the head.

So looks like I’ve properly missed the boat for a Clio Williams 😭

Well, I then found a lead and gave it a tug… an unearthed a Clio Williams 2, 127k miles, plenty of owners, 6 months MOT, original book pack and some service history. Started a conversation with the guy, and the found the numbers could work, even with the pair of sills it needs.

I was REALLY into this car, as I could see where I could make a difference to it with my history of working with Old Renaults…

So on Sunday 18th December 2022, my best man Jez and I took a ride down to Andover to have a look at it… turned up and this was the first time I saw the car:

The car looked great, but was covered in rain so knew it was going to look better for itself! Have a look over and could confirm everything was present & correct and the engine ran sweet.

Took it out for a test drive and just fell in love with it… within 3 miles, I could see why the motoring press make such a noise about these cars! Took another photo whilst out on the test drive whilst I changed driver with Jez

Jez drove back to the sellers house and instantly commented he thought the car would be my best car should I buy it! Preferring it over my Clio 182 and Clio 200 Raider!!

So with that… I bought it! 😲

Took nearly 3 hours for the money to eventually be transferred to the seller, so by the time I was ready to drive home, the 2022 Qatar World Cup Final between France & Argentina had started, and I spent a truly memorable drive home listening to that game play out!

The car drives REALLY well and just SOOOO comfortable with those big squishy armchair seats! The only issue was I had no heater fan and you can see I’m the picture above, the centre vents are also missing for some reason..??

By the time we got back to Peterborough, the Megane desperately needed some petrol, so I took the chance to get a couple of photos whilst the car was being filled as I was listening to the penalty shootout play out!!!!

We also had to pick up a bit of shopping:

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Following the drive home, I was keen to get the heater fan and Centre vents fixed, so and I took a ride over to a breakers yard near Bury St Edmunds and grabbed a few choice bits:

Including a new passenger side door as the original one is starting to look a bit crusty at the bottom!

Also grabbed the dash vent:

So with that, I got cracking on the car on Christmas Eve 2022 and got to the bottom of the shoddy attempted fix to the heater resistor loom, and made it good (this is before):

So that brings me to Christmas Day 2022 and the day I revealed the car to my family, so now it’s out in the open, I can share my latest news with CS.

I was up at 7: 00 giving the car a quick clean so it’s looking it’s best:

I think it paid off!

So what my plan….??? Well I can categorically state THAT I WILL NOT BE DOING MY USUAL RESTORATION/REBUILD on this one. That’s been done to death already by so many people. I just want this car to be a great usable Classic I’m not afraid to take to a Trackday or drive round the UK/Europe.

What it needs from my first review:

• New sills and jacking points both sides
• Welding/repairs to rear arches
• Exhaust repair/replacement (current one blows)
• Few small pieces of trim/clips/seals
• Rear boot panel repainting as it’s blistered like hell:

Watch this space as I’ll share my journey with you.

 

[Stefan.]

Awesome!!

I too wish I pulled the plug on a Williams. Very cool

 

[Daz.]

Original spoiler is a must too!

 

[Hixle]

Great buy, I’d absolutely love one! I still wish I’d kept my 16v.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Wanted to just share what I know about the car, the advert for it read as follows:

1995 Renault Clio Williams, long mot, 127k, loads of service history, stamped original Renault service history booklet, original handbooks, a folder full of documents and old mots, a very original example, even has the original rare suit holder parcel shelf that sell for a grand alone, full engine rebuild by N.D Hill Engineering 20k miles ago, drives very well and pulls like a train, handles like it’s on rails, stops on the spot, has a stainless steel exhaust, stage 2 cylinder head, 4-2-1 tubular manifold, kent cams and bigger brakes, electric windows, electric mirrors, Michelin tyres, only ran on V-Power, if you’re fussy the rear arches could be done and the sills tidied up, or really fussy then a respray, perfectly useable as it is though, could easily be a £20k car with a light resto but still perfectly useable as it is, only going up in value, super rare little cars and still continuously hailed the king of hot hatches!

You can see there’s a few points which caught my attention which I marked in bold…. full engine rebuild, Kent cams, 4,2,1 Tubular Manifold..?

So I did a fair bit of Googling on the car, and actually managed to unearth the advert from the chap who actually sold it to the guy who sold it to me!! In his advert he wrote:

1995 Renault Clio Williams 2. FSH + MOT July 2023. Runs + drives superbly. Had plenty of work done recently, but sadly just don’t have the time or money available to carry on. Would be suitable for a restoration project, but is more than capable of being driven as-is. Couple of minor issues: Heater doesn’t work, suspect wiper motor is in its way out, rust beginning to creep in, but body work over all is very good. Open to any sensible offers or discussions.

nterestingly, the sellers phone number was at the bottom of the advert… so ever the chancer, I sent him a message!! 😬

Turns out he’s a Renault Tech at St Helens Renault near Liverpool!!! 😁 And was pleased I’d got in touch. He shared with me some more information on the car:

Hello, just standard things for a car nearly 30 years old. It’s got a bit of rust underneath and definitely needs some TLC. Couple of minor cosmetic bits inside and out as well if I remember right. Was serviced by me in July but will likely want belts doing. Actually runs and drives very well. So it would be ideal for either a long term project or just something fun at the weekends. It’s definitely not perfect but it’s not bad either.

I asked him if he knew anything about this supposed engine rebuild by ND Hill Engineering:

I know bits about it, but not a lot. The guy I bought it off was a bit vague about the history so I don’t know the full story. But I’ve kinda worked some of it out. There’s a book in the car full of paperwork as far back as 2008. I kept it and added to it with any work I did. Some of the earlier paperwork suggests that it has had bigger brakes, exhaust upgrade, couple of engine bits and a bit more. Also, if you look at the engine bay picture, you’ll notice at the top of the suspension is 3 drilled holes on each side, suggesting there has been a strut brace there at one point. Some of the clues hint towards racing. Or track use of some sort. I can’t remember how much of the paperwork has details of engine work, but the guy who bought it off me did his own research and found an old advert for the car from 2010 which had a bit more detail. I’ll see if I can find that for you now:

Hmmm… sounds interesting!!! But also a little spurious! You know how hard it is to get more power out of an NA car… well this advert states 185bhp up from the factory 150bhp… that’s some going!?

He then sent me a load more pictures of the car from when he had it.

I was very quickly getting a good bit of detail in this car!! As I was looking at the car, I did an HPI report and found that the car wore the registration K60 FRY from 9th May 1997 - 19th August 2020, and found a picture on Facebook of it:

 

[RustyMojo]

Subscribed! This is going to be an epic build of that I’m sure!

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Original spoiler is a must too!

I actually like that spoiler, wherever it’s from..?? So going to keep it. But interesting to know more about it, if you or any of the other members know the story of it, I’d be keen to learn?

 

[Daz.]

Shame, I've always thought that spoiler was a poor effort, ruins the car for me.

Nd hill aka Hill Power. Very popular mk1 tuner back in the day.

Had my old williams 2 down there a couple of times.

These engines always responded well to cams. Most willys on the rollers were making close to 160bhp.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Shame, I've always thought that spoiler was a poor effort, ruins the car for me.

Nd hill aka Hill Power. Very popular mk1 tuner back in the day.

Had my old williams 2 down there a couple of times.

These engines always responded well to cams. Most willys on the rollers were making close to 160bhp.

Oh wow, so there might be some truth in that statement then @Daz?? I must admit, she really does pick herself up and shift down the road when you give it some..!?

Do you know if KTEC ever made a 4-2-1 Manifold like some of the advertising said and suggests the car has? I’ve not dug into it enough yet, to confirm..?

 

[yeecup]

i had a mint williams 3 many years ago, it had a hill power "stage 1" kit on it which was an induction kit, decat pipe and chip. went well and sounded epic. wish id never sold it.

 

[ali-ham]

I used Hill power back around 2004 for bits for my mk1, were big mk1 tuner then.

If I remember correctly a 4 - 2 - 1 manifold was available, wish I had 1 now.

Nice project.

 

[Andyano12]

Great write up, thanks for sharing, I will be following this. I'd love to have a Williams one day.

I love the back stories to owning/searching for these cars, also it is something that we can all relate to; the nervous excitement of collecting a new (to us) car.

 

[Poopensharten]

I absolutely love seeing people get the cars they wanted from when they were younger! Looking forward to see how you go with this!

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

Love these. Just about the best looking hot hatch ever in my view. The proportions are just spot on. Look forward to seeing this evolve.

 

[Bluebeard]

Jealously level 2000! Great work mate.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Thanks for all your comments in support gentlemen! Very nice to read!!

I found a few more pictures of my Mum’s Clio Valver 💙

That bonnet bulge just gets me everytime

I can see a recreation of this photo on the cards in summer 23

 

[Djw Dave]

Subscribed. This'll be great.

 

[ali-ham]

I always think its nice to get that car you always wanted when younger, and even better when it lives up to expectation.

I can still remember when I finally got my Williams home and got the first drive in it. Grinning from ear to ear!

Agree with The Chubby Pirate, can't wait to see how you go with this.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

The history of this car keeps coming out of the woodwork, and I’m loving the journey!! 😆

Adam, The Renault Tech from St Helens saw in one of my threads about my conversation with the super chatty eBay seller of K60 FRY and sent me a message with a few pictures:

Hi steve, just been catching up on the forum and seen that you’d been trying to track down some info regarding K60 FRY. I have a bit of info but not a lot. I followed the EBay advert myself and noticed the guy selling it has the username “gaztwo”. The guy I bought the car from was called Gareth, and if I remember right, he put the car back from K60 FRY to M225 RKK. So I’m somewhat guessing, but I think that could be the same person, and he’s relatively local to me. I actually managed to find the owner of the car while it was registered as K60 FRY about a year and a half ago. His name is Max Derry. I tried messaging him on Facebook but he never replied. I did manage to find his friend who was able to supply me with a couple of pictures which may interest you. His name was James Becke. So if you’re after any more info, I’d try get hold of one of those people…

And MOST IMPORTANTLY, sent me a picture of the engine bay:

So I can now see how the engine bay looked following the Hill Power engine work that was done, and I can also see the reason for the holes in the strut towers, a Sparco Strut Brace.

RIGHT after I bought the car, I had a punt on a strut brace that was advertised on eBay that looked like it might be the right one:

Well bugger my old boots!!! Looks like I’ve lucked out with that strut brace now 🎉

BUT… Flippin YODEL appear to have lost the parcel in transit 🤬🤬🤬🤬 Fingers crossed they can find it.. 🙄

Back to the engine, the valve cover isn’t blue anymore, but it does look as though it’s had some work polishing it up… so I’m guessing somewhere along the ownership, someone stripped the blue paint off, to return it to somewhat standard??

Going to have a couple of days on it this weekend and do a couple of bits & pieces. Will report back.

 

[16v_paddy]

I think @GazTwo used to own that when it was K60 FRY

 

[16v_paddy]

If you want to go the whole hog, he's even selling the plate on ebay

Pardon our interruption...

 

[RichValver]

Nice thread 👌

 

[16V F7R]

Looks like a cracking buy, looking forward to see what you do with it Steve. It’s great to have a usable classic but with the money the Williams fetch now it’s well worth going to town on it.

I prefer my Williams powered Valver compared to the 182.

Out of interest is the rocker cover gasket the same on all F7P and F7R engines? I need mine refurbed in the right silver.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Out of interest is the rocker cover gasket the same on all F7P and F7R engines? I need mine refurbed in the right silver.

Thanks for your nice comments sir! But I’m afraid I’ve no flippin idea @16V F7R I’m afraid mate?

I would assume so, because the difference between the two engines is the bore/stroke, believe the head castings are the same..? But I’m sure @Coops Mk1 will pop along in a moment to set us both straight… 😆

 

[Coops Mk1]

yep same for all F7's no difference in castings between the two, differences are internal

 

[16v_paddy]

yep same for all F7's no difference in castings between the two, differences are internal

Incorrect unless you're completely ignoring the Megane F7's

 

[16v_paddy]

Out of interest is the rocker cover gasket the same on all F7P and F7R engines? I need mine refurbed in the right silver.

Exactly the same part on both engines, just be wary of getting an R19 F7P gasket, it's not an issue but the R19 one has a bit in the cambelt end that needs to be cut off if you're fitting it to a Clio F7 because it fouls the support bracket for the pulley cover

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Exactly the same part on both engines, just be wary of getting an R19 F7P gasket, it's not an issue but the R19 one has a bit in the cambelt end that needs to be cut off if you're fitting it to a Clio F7 because it fouls the support bracket for the pulley cover

Do you know the correct part number for the Clio F7 Gasket @16v_paddy ?

 

[Coops Mk1]

Incorrect unless you're completely ignoring the Megane F7's

everyone ignores them as they're not a Clio engine, which is what this question was about....same as the Spyder too which you failed to note....amateur

 

[Coops Mk1]

Do you know the correct part number for the Clio F7 Gasket @16v_paddy ?

I believe its Clio - 7700853262 19 - 7700749494

 

[16V F7R]

Love the banter, any of you lads selling one?

 

[Mr Underhill]

Cool story and thread. Look forward to seeing progress.

 

[16v_paddy]

Love the banter, any of you lads selling one?

Gasket or a Williams?

Deffo selling my Williams once I've eventually finished rebuilding it, not sure if I've got any rocker gaskets left though, I did get a load of genuine ones from a random guy at the Nurburgring a few years ago but used some and sold some

 

[16V F7R]

Gasket please if you have one spare?

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Gasket please if you have one spare?

@16v_paddy Me too if you’ve got any?? Will cross your palm with silver!

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Wanted to improve the way the roof trim and upper door gasket was fitted to the car, they weren’t quite sitting right:

Whipped the door seal off, and sourced some new clips from eBay:

The reason it wasn’t quite sitting right was a combination of rusting metal substrate within the seal, and broken clips.

Gave it a bit of tlc and a blob of tiger seal where it wasn’t playing ball… and it was soon looking better for itself:

Roof trim was again just broken clips, again managed to source some clips from eBay:

Pulled off the old clips:

Fitted the new clips:

Then it was soon back on:

Looking a lot better for itself now.

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Drivers door is suffering from the usual Renault dropped door syndrome.. 🙄 so I bought a pair of new hinge and bushes from CGB in Telford:

Just a case of whipping the old hinge pins out, and replacing with the new stuff..

WHY DO I KID MYSELF THESE JOBS WILL BE THIS EASY…!??? 🙄

Of course, the old pins had rusted into the hinges on the door, so when I tried to remove them, they sheared at the end of the Impact Gun I was trying to undo them with:

So faced with the remaining bits in the hinges, out came the hammer and chisels:

Then the Gas torch🔥:

And finally I managed to get the door off:

I was sick of hammering, so I thought I would make the hinges on the body right first. Just a case of drilling/driving the old bushes out:

And then dropping the new bushes and pin in:

Was sick of it at this point. So just left the door off and decided to go back to it another day:

 

[Big_Steve_T]

Following the saga of the drivers door, I couldn’t resist the opportunity to get hold of the minty door off a low mile breaker at a yard in Bury St Edmunds, so dashed over there and grabbed it:

So I’ve now got BOTH doors from that car, which should put me in good stead for the rebuild of this car.

After a week off, I got back into the garage today with the bit between my teeth to decide if I was going to fit the new doors now, or get the old one back on?

Following a LOT of hammer, gas torch and drill action, I managed to get the last piece of pin out of the door hinge:

and managed to get the original door back onto the car:

So is it better…? NOPE 😡 But I’m pleased I’ve done the donkey work now which will let the new doors go on easier when I do get the bodywork done.

Whilst I was in the garage, I took a few photos of the sills to help my welder get a better idea of the work needed:

Looks like some monkey has just been going HARD with the trolley Jack.. 🙄🤦🏼‍♂️

But hey ho, everything’s fixable…!

 

[Big_Steve_T]

@16v_paddy i read somewhere you got a full exhaust made for your car for £800 touch. Can you please share where that was/are they still in business??