cambelt guide 182

[danansley182]

hi there i am a new member just bought a clio 182 i am going to do the cambelt myself as trainning to be a mechanic just wondering if anyone has got a guide to make it easyier would really like the help thanks dan

 

[not normal dan]

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?437872-Cambelt-Auxbelt-Dephaser-Pulley-Guide

 

[lemonnobby]

If your not use to the engine I would leave well alone also need locking tools

 

[sideways danny]

not a good engine to work on for the first time without supervision of someone that knows it

 

[Mr R.]

hi there i am a new member just bought a clio 182 i am going to do the cambelt myself as trainning to be a mechanic just wondering if anyone has got a guide to make it easyier would really like the help thanks dan

Train on something a little easier dan, you will need all of the locking tools from Renault at a cost of about £150 and then the cost of the timimg belt kit along with the aux belt kit from Renault only.

I know as i have just bought all of the tools and the belt kits to do mine, this job can NOT be done in the right way without the Renault tools as all of the cam belt sprockets "free wheel" (no keys on the sprockets)
Bite the bullet and pay a "specalist" on here who knows what they are doing as doing it wrong WILL cost you loads.......FACT!

 

[jinjur]

So, i have my oen thread open where i have raised concerns over a Renault MAIN dealership having set my timing incorrectly.

if you havent done one of these before, i wouldnt start now.

Thats a great guide posted by the way, how on earth did i miss that one....doh!

Anyway, i just wanted to get an understanding of the procedure. Id like to understand how the process works.

As far as i see it:

(lets exclude the dephaser for simplicity)

The cams and crank all get locked in TDC using the tools, that will ALWAYS be correct assuming you are in the correct hole (as is with other parts of life ) in the crankshaft. So we now have an engine locked in TDC. If this does not line up from the off, your timing is out.

Once the belt is removed, tensioners replaced etc and belt is replaced, a bit of tom foolery with the pulleys seems to happen that i dont really understand.

The 2 crank pulleys are loosened, correct? Is that even for a scenario without the dephaser being changed?

Would i be right in saying then, that the entire belt will turn freely now even though the cams and crank are locked? I assume the crank is floating too?

Why is this bit done? Is this a tensioning exercise?

Is it strictly speaking, the tension of the belt that affects the accurate timing of these engines ?

I mean, the cams and crank are locked in tdc, surely it would be hard to SEVERELY c**k this up? No?

Jj

 

[Mr R.]

You can get the crank pin in the wrong hole very easy as there is a blance cut out of the crank web right next to the timing hole. The dephaser is removed anyway so that makes no difference as it needs to be cleaned very well also the cam sprockets seals are replaced along with the fixing bolt/nuts.

 

[jinjur]

Aye, but if you follow the guide at setting the cams just before tdc and rotating the engine, you should be alright.

That should be the first port of call if you suspect the timing is out, to recheck the crank pin location.

Im more interested in the timing steps.....replacing and cleaning the various components is a given, any monkey could do that.

But as setting the timing is seemingly difficult, i just would like to know how.

I have never had an engine that times in this way, i have always dealt with timing marks etc and i appreciate that the tools are required.

Just having read the guide and the manual with regards to setting the timing, i find it a bit confusing regarding rotating the belt etc, with the engine seemingly locked.

Jj

 

[Mr R.]

Well you talk as if you know what you are doing so why ask advice?
Just go and get on with it then as cleaning etc.... is a monkeys job you say but if you DONT get the dephaser 100% clean of its oil then it could slip and smash the valves up....

As i have said and ill say it again "THE PULLIES HAVE NO KEY AND "FREE" WHEEL" you set the belt tension with the pullies loose, if you dont it will pull the cam timimg out when you take the lock out of the cams.

Got it?

 

[jinjur]

Well you talk as if you know what you are doing so why ask advice?
Just go and get on with it then as cleaning etc.... is a monkeys job you say but if you DONT get the dephaser 100% clean of its oil then it could slip and smash the valves up....

..WHIIIIINE...

Got it?

WTF man?

Whats your problem?

I didnt ask at all about changing flipping pulleys or other maintenance steps did I? Is that the hard part of the engine timing procedure, Really?

Yes I do know what I am doing, very much...........BUT STILL, I dont have the balls to touch this.

The background of this is that RENAULT did my belts and I want to make sure its done right as they managed to take 2 entire days and the car is running a bit poo.

So, given that...I'd imagine that EVERYTHING has been replaced that needs replaced, cleaned that needed cleaned.....PROBABLY, by monkeys. Yeah?

ALL I enquired about was the timing procedure. I have the workshop manual, I read it.....and I didnt understand a couple of bits as the notion of floating pulleys (yes, I did know that before you told me twice) is new to me.

....you set the belt tension with the pullies loose, if you dont it will pull the cam timimg out when you take the lock out of the cams.

You gave me the answer eventually, thanks for that.....but there was no need for your time of the month response thanks.

Have a nice day

Jj

 

[mark123]

You can check if Renault got it right by just putting the timing tool in and crank locking pin.

I'm a self taught hobby mechanic. I've changed the belts on my 172 and 182 3 times in total and they've done over 100k miles between them since being done. If you follow the instructions, understand how engines work, take your time and know what you're doing you'll be fine.

It isn't that hard, it's just easy to f-up and is engine destroying if you do.

 

[lemonnobby]

the pulleys are loose so you can tension properly then turn over 4 times and recheck tension do pulleys up job done

 

[mark123]

AFAIK Renault regard procedure 2 in their manual as good enough - so they probably wouldn't have undone the cam pulleys and set the belt tension with all the pulleys loose.

Procedure 1 is more accurate, but a Renault dealer mechanic I know has never done procedure 1 just for a belt change.

 

[jinjur]

And thank you guys for your NORMAL informative responses

Cheers
Jj

 

[Mr R.]

I dont do NORMAL.....:rasp:

 

[danansley182]

where i work in a garage they already got the locking tool and another mechanic siad he would give me a hand

 

[sideways danny]

where i work in a garage they already got the locking tool and another mechanic siad he would give me a hand

Read this

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?510521-cambelt-problems-(local-garages)

i'll put £5 on them having s**t locking tools

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

i did mine yesterday, and i have never done one before ever.

furthermore, i didnt use the renault locking tool.

ignore the scare mongers, its really not difficult.

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

You can get the crank pin in the wrong hole very easy as there is a blance cut out of the crank web right next to the timing hole. The dephaser is removed anyway so that makes no difference as it needs to be cleaned very well also the cam sprockets seals are replaced along with the fixing bolt/nuts.

im sorry but only a plonker would get the pin in the wrong hole!

take the spark plug out of number 1 cylinder, and put a long screwdriver in there, watch it going up and down as you rotate the engine,
when it stops going up and starts going back down you have clearly passed TDC. use that simple, FREE tip, to make sure you get the correct hole.

its really not rocket science guys

 

[ben lee]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Renault-Timin...1848?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment#ht_2277wt_814

would these be any good to use when changeing my belt on my 1.6 16v rsi ?

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

yes, pretty much the same kit i got to do mine.


people complain they "bend", the fact is you shouldnt use it to hold the cams while you torque them up.

THERE FOR SETTING TIMING ONLY

 

[sideways danny]

i did mine yesterday, and i have never done one before ever.

furthermore, i didnt use the renault locking tool.

ignore the scare mongers, its really not difficult.

bet it's wrong

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

lol, of course it is.

 

[sideways danny]

you've done 1, i've done around 200 a large number of which are rectification jobs

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

ive done 1 f4r belt....

i dont want to get into a willy waiving contest, but im not exactly new to engines, ive built countless.

i build, design, and map my own drag car, which makes more power than per cc than any car i know of.


if you think your the only guy in the world capable of changing a simple belt, thats upto you, but if you think everyone should
be scared into believing you, thats not cricket.

 

[sideways danny]

i'm not trying to scare anyone, I'm saying, from specific experience, use of the non genuine tools leads to incorrect cam timing, no matter who's using them. my point is, you dont have the specific experience to make that recomendation for this engine, so should defer to those who have it

Similarly, using the best tools in the world and not knowing how to use them will give the same s**t results

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

i disagree.


its a pin that stops the crank moving. simple piece of metal of the correct dia.

and any piece of angle iron that can check the cams are in-line with each other will work fine. how will it not??

as i said earlier, the key is not to use the locking tools to torque things up, they are simply for check timing/alignment.

and as long as you rotate the motor a few times and re-check your timing BEFORE starting the engine, how can you go wrong? if you have got the tension wrong, you will not get the locking tools in after rotation of the motor, if you have something totally wrong, you will get piston to valve contact upon turning by hand, in which case, re-do it.

 

[sideways danny]

i'll gracefully withdraw let you be happy with what you've done, but please dont give bad advice like using cheap tools

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

im not happy or un-happy, its a simple belt.

and i only churped up because im a new member, and the amount of threads i have read where people ask questions, only to get silly answers like "take it to a garage" (which is not what they asked for) is unreal. how do people learn, break barriers, be the 1st, etc etc, if all people do is follow the opinions of others. noone would ever progress at anything ever, where would we all be??

 

[mark123]

I agree if you're handy with spanners you shouldn't be put off and there is a general attitude on here that you shouldn't touch it unless you're a specialist.

I guess danny has seen it end in disaster so many times...

I've done it with and without the tools and it is a lot easier to get right with them.

 

[my leige]

Slightly off topic but it's niggling me now and i'm fed up of googling for an answer.

What's the purpose of making the pullies fully floating? Further more, how do they transmit drive if they are free to turn relative to the shaft?

Any links or explanations appreciated.

 

[Fred@BTM]

^because the nut/bolts holding them on are tightened up to f**k!

 

[mark123]

Friction! Hence if you don't get the mating surfaces spotlessly clean they slip and ...

Probably 2 reasons why they're fully floating:

1. The french like to be different.
2. You can get the cam timing more accurately set than you would with woodruff keys and mass production.

Slightly off topic but it's niggling me now and i'm fed up of googling for an answer.

What's the purpose of making the pullies fully floating? Further more, how do they transmit drive if they are free to turn relative to the shaft?

Any links or explanations appreciated.

 

[my leige]

Thanks for the replies, I completely understand now.

 

[Mr R.]

im sorry but only a plonker would get the pin in the wrong hole!

take the spark plug out of number 1 cylinder, and put a long screwdriver in there, watch it going up and down as you rotate the engine,
when it stops going up and starts going back down you have clearly passed TDC. use that simple, FREE tip, to make sure you get the correct hole.

its really not rocket science guys

If you dont know that you should take a plug out to be abe to find tdc then you can fu@k it up.......Simples...After working on Aston Martins for well over 12 years i have no problems in doing mine which i have just done but i did shell out and buy the Renault locking tools.
There are many "Plonkers" out there that think they have the skills in doing one of these belts but remember "Little knowledge is a dangerous thing"

 

[Ant@BackyardRacing]

not really, as you should still rotate a few turns by hand before attempting to start, in which case if it was wrong, you would almost certainly spot it then.

 

[jinjur]

Can I just clarify, does rotating the engine a few times pull the belt to the correct tension for setting?

Jj

 

[tlpoe222]

Bad link, wont let me access it???