clio 1.4 8v worth tuning!

[RICHARD BARCLAY]

Was thinkng about the engine conversion but it seems i may aswell just buy a williams etc but because of insurance just had an accident in the old vts so its gonna be expensive for me im 20 now and i got a 1000 premium so not bad!

Anyone tuned there 1.4 what can i expect!

It has a k&N

Ive got a spare dastek so that will go on and it has a backbox?!

So me thinking changed the K&N...get a full system de-cat put the dastek on then where do i go?!

its 81bhp standard the 2000model all i really want is 100+ or there abouts!

I know i can do headwork etc and can you put the throttle bodies from a 1.8 16v model worth doing?

i was hoping for about 95 with the full exhast air filter and dastek only 14bhp so should be possible i put the dastek on my vts and gave me 13bhp alone!

 

[BenR]

Worth it, debatable, but its cetainly possibly and 120-130 isnt out of your reach.

valver TB wont fit.

Main restriction on that engine is the injection system and inle manifold.

 

[JAY172]

we used a 2ltr 8v single point injection laguna throttle body on my mates clio.

 

[1fast6]

jay, how easy is it to change the existing TB to the 2l spi laguna one?

 

[JAY172]

think it was just a straight swap but it was ages ago and i cant really remember.

 

[BenR]

Almost a straight swap.........

Its such a crude method though!

 

[BUTRE]

BenR.... grrrrrrrrrrr sometimes its the best way to go.

Somewhere this year Im going to get the damn RT engine finally done. Going to stick to the primary plan
Head work
Tubular 4-2-1 exhaust manifold
laguna 1.8 TB
Custom chip to go with all that

Hoping to be hiting the 120bhp mark... @ fly.

Never thought of cams because it needs to be studied first.

So worth tuning? 120bhp on a 850kg car? I guess the answer is yes.

btw... keeping the 14" alloy will help geting it moving.

 

[Colin_S]

i did the Laguna Throttle as well years ago and it was a great mod, did that, reground cam, modded head and chip and was running over 100bhp, Was very nice.

 

[The Big Yin]

Colin _S what chip did you run with it?

This sounds too easy to be so good

 

[Colin_S]

I cant remember what chip it was, it was >3 years ago but it was either a super chip or star chip.

It is very good and very easy. I was so impressed and so was thegarage that actually did the work. No phiscal looks difference so no need to tell the insurance and you gat a group 5 120ish bhp beast. If i was 17-18 again id do it again!!!

 

[Djw John]

You mean you can just chuck a laguna TB on and instantly itll be more powerful? If so how much am i likely to be able to get one for?

 

[BUTRE]

you need to bore open by a little the inlet manifold. Also you need to get a custom chip (only if your ecu is a siemens) because the std one isnt up to the job... it would be running lean at high rpm.

I got my laguna TB + laguna inj for 60quid... in spain.

 

[JAY172]

Quote: Originally posted by EvilJohn on 04 April 2004

You mean you can just chuck a laguna TB on and instantly itll be more powerful? If so how much am i likely to be able to get one for?

you can only do this on the clio 1 with the energy spi engine in it.

 

[Djw John]

Bugger!!! Nice thought anyhoo!

 

[Djw John]

How much power could headwork free up on its own ie no exhaust, cams, etc? How much cash as well roughly?

 

[Fred@BTM]

Quote: Originally posted by RICHARD BARCLAY on 04 April 2004


its 81bhp standard the 2000model

really?? mine was only 75bhp!!! whered the +6bhp come from???

 

[RICHARD BARCLAY]

Hold up problems with injection system mine is multi point injection model!!

So what we saying

Headwork

cams 275degree

Full system de cat

Manifold

TB from laguna if it works!!

Airfilter

And my dastek

120-130 bhp

Sounds o.k to me!

Will it beat a standard vts though?!

 

[RICHARD BARCLAY]

Would it be a better to start off with a 1.416v si model?!

Oh and the 81bhp thats what i was told but i was young then so i could be wrong!! But it is multipoint is yours?!

 

[BUTRE]

Richard, if your inj is MPI, then forget the laguna TB since its for SPI models ONLY!

can you take a picture of your engine bay? would like to see a 1.4 8v MPI.

dont know if yours inlet manifold and TB is up to the 120bhp mark. It needs checking... mesuring.

I would say that head work, wilder cam, good exhaust manifold and the basic good exhaust system and good air filter would get you up of the 100bhp at least.


btw, its kind of funny when some topic is about 1.4 8v tuning because it gets alot of views..... 130 views in one day and still counting eheh.
Maybee alot of valver owners miss their RT.

 

[Saner]

I have a 1.4 16v Si which has 98bhp, so all I intend to do is Full exhaust and a ramcharger which will tip it just over 100 bhp

 

[RICHARD BARCLAY]

so 17bhp more sounds like a better option to me!

Thats 17less to worry about should easyley reach 120 then

 

[BUTRE]

go for it mate!

 

[1fast6]

if i found myself a laguna 1.8 spi tb, how much am i looking at for fitting? or is it so easy that its a DIY job?

i also assume that a chip is definately required to feel the benefit of any of these mods? headwork and reground cams on a 1.4 seems to put this work in the £400 bracket so possibly not worth the money?

 

[BenR]

rich, yours is MPI and a better starting point, send the manifold along to get worked with the head.

 

[kingJimBob]

Lads i wanna learn more about this Straight swap for a 2ltr 8v single point injection laguna throttle body.

is this true? how much £££ are we looking at here e.g. ECU plus SPI swap

my dad used to be a mechanic so the swap we could do, the ECU tho?

also noticed colin_S said he didnt notify insurance company is this right? could u get away with this if u were in a crash? e.g. they not gonno look over everything and f**k u over on the insurance

 

[Mole]

yea id like to look into this, i got a 1.4RT on the older clio, and wouldnt mind a bit of extra power, as kingjimbob said, how much roughly would it cost to get it all working etc and what would the power gains be over the standard 1.4 throttle body

 

[BenR]

The gains from the TB alone are not massive, but couples with a cam, aproperly done head, matched manifolds and a chip...120bhp is within easy reach.

When swapping (whats going on with my text?) TBs you need to enlarge and match the bore size to the larger 1.8 lag TB. This means a slight bore and if you got the time matching/flowing and removing any sharp edges which are abundant in the 1.4s tiny mathing plenham.

Cost, whatver you can find the TB assembly for, about 50 quid.

NO idea about the insurace though, depends how much the guy knows.

 

[Colin_S]

When I did it, I got the TB for 20 quid, you need to slightly overbore the manifold, which I did myself. I bought a reground cam, flowed head and manifold for £400 and then get it chipped.

As for insurance, physically looking at it an insurance inspector will not be able to tell that it has been modded (unless he is BenR), but seriously it does not look any different. He might check for a chip tho, which is probably the only area you could possibly be caught out on so you may want to tell them about that. Never had my car RRed but it deffo surprised a lot of people, it was excellent!!!!

 

[kingJimBob]

Nice one lads thans of the info, doubt i would ever get around to it but i like to know about these things



Colin_S how much then would u say all the work cost u? including ECU

 

[BenR]

This engine is sensitive to cam and rocker wear so you can typically pickup a few BHP on old engines just by replacing said items. Nice engine....just wish it wasnt a rocker assembly.

 

[BUTRE]

you can buy a brand new wilder cam from catcams.
you can buy a new rocker from renault.

What can you do to this excessive wear go away? The problem comes (like Ford CVH engines) from oil lub failure at the head? Moding the oil pump for more oil pressure would do it?





btw, BenR what do you mean by cam wear?

http://img2.photobucket.com/albums/v11/Perception/pics/3364c147.jpg
http://img2.photobucket.com/albums/v11/Perception/pics/9c5ae9fb.jpg
http://img2.photobucket.com/albums/v11/Perception/pics/040c6be0.jpg

Nice lobe uh? It was a cam from a Diesel Renault Espace.

 

[BenR]

NO pick dood.

Cam wear is a lubrication problem, but nothing you can sort with pressure. What you need is better flow and detter distribution. The valver cams stay near new as they swim in oil from the get go. The rockers and cams in the energy though dont have a massive oil covering to form a hydrodunamic wedge at startup and at low rpms.

 

[BUTRE]

yes, but that is comon knowledge (at idle/low rpms oil pressure is too low to the get a good lub on the head). Thats why I recomend once you started a engine (from cold) you should rev it up to 2500rpm and keep it there a few seconds so oil gets quikly to the head.

Valver and willy hit 3bar of oil pressure at 4000rpm right? Ive heard there is a kit that can get the oil pressure up to 2.5/3bar on idle and 5bar at 4000rpm. I think that something was done to the valver oil pump to achive this. Also there is a uprated sump that would make the valver accept 7lts of oil to prevent oil surge.

Cant the oil pump just be electric and always pump 3bar of oil?

 

[BenR]

pressure isnt whats important here........were talking flow, pressure could be 5 bar but if it only flows 1ltr/hr then its pointless. Too much pressure is just as bad as too little.

And i was talking about cam speed and hydrodynamic wedges, nowt to do with flow, altough more oil would be nice.

Uprated sump?
Again, no point.......you make it deeper but the pickup would be in the same place and surge would still occur. Baffling the std sump would be better.

And electric pump............you would need to regulate pressure with RPM.

 

[BUTRE]

damn... you dont make things any easier do you??

eheh Thanks mate!

 

[BenR]

the pics are now working....f**k ME the cam is worn.

Whats it off?

 

[RICHARD BARCLAY]

So hold up?!

What im i doing to get 120ish

what tbs out of what car?!

Also headwork etc hillpower is quite expensive anyone else do this discounted!

And which air filter is best regardless of money?!

And exhaust?!

Then i have the chip

 

[BenR]

1.8 lag TB. I summed it up a page back.

If you want headwork PM me and talk to Andy GDI about fitting.

 

[BUTRE]

Quote: Originally posted by BenR on 06 April 2004


NO pick dood.

LOL Now I get it! I thought you were saying I was picking on you...

This cam is from a Renault Espace... diesel engine. Yesterday helped out at the workshop and striped the head for inspection. The pictures says it all.

I think RICHARD BARCLAYs clio is 1.4 8v MPI, so the laguna 1.8 TB wont do!
this MPI needs checking for other TB aplication. Dont know if it needs a new TB, std one can be up to the job......... doubt it. I bet the runners are the major restrictor factor in this engine.

RICHARD BARCLAY, air filter is just an air filter... spend the least has possible on it and get some REAL engine mod for performance like head work.

 

[The Big Yin]

Ben R

What if you just replace the TB will this benefit in any way ?

I know it would be better to do it all but what order if you couldnt afford all at once ?