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Clio 200 EDC, are they really that bad?

I've driven all of the above.

My choice would be the 220 trophy all day long. It's a cracking car. And whether people like it or not, it's quicker and handles better than the Fiesta. So you can slag it off all you like but Renault achieved exactly what they set out to do, make the quickest hot hatch on the market in that class. (even the 200 is quicker than an ST iirc?)

And on another note the Fiesta ST in my opinion feels cramped. The 220 is spacious in comparison.
 
Sunglasses_Ron said:
My choice would be the 220 trophy all day long. It's a cracking car. And whether people like it or not, it's quicker and handles better than the Fiesta. So you can slag it off all you like but Renault achieved exactly what they set out to do, make the quickest hot hatch on the market in that class. (even the 200 is quicker than an ST iirc?)
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According to tests, yes it's quicker in a straight line.
 
Haven't driven the fiesta so I cant comment on that but I have had 3 200T's and a 220T Trophy (work for Renault) The Trophy Is a great car, updates to the gearbox and increased power have given it a completely different feel IMO to the 200T. I would be very impressed if the Fiesta could out perform this car either in a straight line or around a track.

I would recommend the new Akrapovic option available on these too!
 
Of course it's important to remember the Fiesta has its own merits and I've never even been in an ST. But when I had a go in one at Brands the racing driver (Will Arif) gave me a flying lap as a passenger and the car was amazingly capable. Very impressive agility.

Which I think highlights the point, no matter how good a driver you think you are (I think I'm decent), you're not a racing driver and you won't extract anywhere near the performance any of these cars have to offer on the road. Thus, comparing performance is largely for bragging rights only.

You could say straight line performance is easily comparable on the road, but how often are you in your Clio 200 and come up against:

a/ A standard Fiesta ST
b/ With a driver who wants to race you
c/ Where the conditions are equal (i.e. neither of you have a passenger or luggage)

It just doesn't happen, so it doesn't matter. Buy the car you like and don't worry about what the dudes posting on the internet are saying.
 
I drove the 220 on the Renaultsport track day at Bedford the other week and all I can say is.. It's really quick in a straight line..gear changes are lightning quick and goes round corners almost as quick as my fully prepared AST'ed quaifed track car. If I had the monies I'd be getting one
 
Jeff simply said:
According to tests, yes it's quicker in a straight line.
Click to expand...

... And from a standard start using its launch control and super quick gear changes.

Rolling there would be next to no difference. As said above though, comparing or favouring a car because of a tenth here or a tenth there is very short-sighted. Bragging rights yes, but it does not communicate how a car makes you feel.

In that respect both the 220 and the ST (even without any Mountune bolt ons) are as good as dead level.
 
I think the problem for many people is how the car feels, not how fast it is. All modern hot hatches are quick. Arguing about which accelerates the fastest or which can do the best lap time is almost pointless. As someone said above, no mere mortal can get the best from it, so debating tenths of seconds is pretty irrelevant.

Much of the criticism that I've seen of the Clio is nothing to do with how capable it is; it's very capable. The problem seems to come with the fact that it lacks the fun factor of other Renault Sport Clios. I love my 172 because it's fun to drive. There are faster cars out there, but the way the Clio feels is very special for a car of that value. For a lot of people, the new car lacks that. It also looks a bit pants compared to the older models. The older RS Clios really stood out from their base model siblings, whereas this one doesn't so much.

There is a lot more to the argument than ultimate performance. But, as has also been said, the best thing to do is to drive it and form an individual opinion. The 200T did little for me but I haven't driven the Trophy so it might be better. I still think that Renault dropped the ball anyway. They wanted the car to appeal to a broader audience, but has that actually worked? It would be interesting to see sales figures for them compared to the older models.
 
ive said it before, but i test drove fiesta st twice and for instant fun factor it was incredible, it communicated everything it was doing brilliantly, so you can just get in and drive it hard straight away, but i found when i pushed it hard, it just wasnt quite as capable as the instant fun factor would have you believe, it couldnt lay its power exiting a corner anything like as good as a trophy, and this always shows on lap test comparisons, the trophy is always a few seconds up the road. I guess for some people thats irrelevant, so it doesn't matter to them, but it does matter to me, front drive cars scrabbling for traction out of corners and wasting all their power, do my head in!. Its probably because i spent years chasing lap times when tenths of a second mattered.
Ive just done 1800 miles in my trophy, so its officially run in lol, and its a mighty little package, the speed it can carry into a corner, the sheer grip at the apex and then the traction on the exit is astounding, you'd think it had a mechanical lsd and was wearing 888's if you didn't know better.
David
 
They are both fine Ben The trophy is very good on track but Suzanne's car with map and cup chassis is ideal for everyday driving had no issues with either car. Hi to Vicki
 
realnumber 1 said:
To a degree maybe, but every year I've been over for the last 8 years I only saw a handful of 1*2's, 225's etc where as now there are loads off the 200t's and new meg sports.
My friend who lives there pointed out that it's largely because of a shift back towards people buying petrol cars again because of the scandals and the fact a lot of petrol cars now get similar (or closer to) mpg of dervs of 10-15 years ago...
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So it's not so much them seeing it as a better car, it's that they were just too tight to shell out for the previous models.
 
ForceIndia said:
I don't like them. Can't see why anyone would pick one over a megane 250/275. That's a genuine rs product, the clio feels like a GT version. Box is the worst dual clutch I've tried, the ten yr old golf gti box is light years ahead.

If you like the old rs products, the Meg is the one to go with.
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Some people need 5 doors and the 265 is crap at carrying stuff about. It's why I never bothered with em.
I quite like the 200 t but if I was spending 20k on a hot hatch I'd get the focus st.
 
Iain C said:
Some people need 5 doors and the 265 is crap at carrying stuff about. It's why I never bothered with em.
I quite like the 200 t but if I was spending 20k on a hot hatch I'd get the focus st.
Click to expand...

I know I've not really got on with my 200t but it is quicker and handles better than a focus st
There is a few guys at work got focus st and I've managed to out drag them on straights and also out handle all of them around bends
Maybe it's the driver but the complaint they were saying about the st was that it was spinning up a wheel around corners and loosing traction
 
Iain C said:
Some people need 5 doors and the 265 is crap at carrying stuff about. It's why I never bothered with em.
I quite like the 200 t but if I was spending 20k on a hot hatch I'd get the focus st.
Click to expand...
Fair enough. In that case, I've no idea why anyone would pick one over a golf gti!
Most people finance new purchases via lease/pcp. Similar money (think the golf is often cheaper).

Or a Cooper S.

The 200t fulfils a brief that most UK buyers don't need. And for those that do, other manufacturers do it better imo.

They aren't horrendous cars, but it doesn't do anything that others don't do better!

All imo of course. But how few of them you see knocking about would suggest its missed the target with UK buyers.
 
Does anyone know who their target audience were?

Because if it was 40/50/60 year old women, then they've hit the nail on the head.

They're the only people who I see driving them around here, and I see a lot of 200ts
 
I'm a 29 year old male with one :(. There's quite a few old women driving fiesta St's by me... including one who has a mounted mk2 focus rs lol!
 
RSaddict said:
Well I love mine, owned several renaultsports too. Much prefer it to the Meg 250 I had. The British love to slag stuff off and enjoy a bandwagon. I ignore what I hear and make my own mind up.
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No bandwagons here. I drove it and just wasn't impressed by it. It's lost the rawness of the older Renault Sport cars and that was what made them so special. I'd never go as far as to say that it's a "bad" car, just there are better options out there in my view. I don't think it has anything about it that would make me buy it over another car.

As you say though, everyone should make their own minds up. Not everything you read on t'internet is true.
 
massivewangers said:
No bandwagons here. I drove it and just wasn't impressed by it. It's lost the rawness of the older Renault Sport cars and that was what made them so special. I'd never go as far as to say that it's a "bad" car, just there are better options out there in my view. I don't think it has anything about it that would make me buy it over another car.

As you say though, everyone should make their own minds up. Not everything you read on t'internet is true.
Click to expand...
In Renault's defense, that's just what new cars are like. I went in a Fiesta ST for the first time (apart from sitting in one in the showroom) yesterday and I would describe it as many things before I used the word, raw.

If raw is what you're after then good news, you only need a few grand and a 182 will see you right!
 
RSaddict said:
Well I love mine, owned several renaultsports too. Much prefer it to the Meg 250 I had. The British love to slag stuff off and enjoy a bandwagon. I ignore what I hear and make my own mind up.
Click to expand...
Not at all. Renault sport have been the darling of the motoring media for over a decade, and obviously on here you'd expect there to be many rs fans.

It missed the target for a lot of folks. It didn't for you, which is great. Doesn't render others opinions void. Plenty have driven it and not been impressed.
 
I've had mine about 3 months, and I love it. For reference, my previous car was a new Fiesta ST, and I have a 182 track day car. I currently commute about 70 miles a day on A/B-roads in it, and it's perfect for that. It has improved build quality, a more refined and comfortable ride (even with the Cup chassis option), but it's also quick in a straight line and fun to chuck about when the mood takes you. I also get about 35-37 mpg on average. The auto-box I have absolutely no problems with; I believe it was updated slightly for the latest models (which mine is), and I've yet to confuse it in full auto, and gear changes are suitably rapid with some nice pops from the exhaust on upshifts. It also makes that crawling morning traffic through town much less effort!

I admit it's perhaps aimed at a very narrow market, but it definitely has its fans, as this thread has proved. The Fiesta ST is more go-kart like and perhaps more faithful to the original hot hatch values that Renault themselves played a big part in setting, but the ride was a bit wearing for me on my commute, every single day. Also whilst the heated Recaros were good, the rest of the interior was dated and not as refined as the Clio, IMO. It was, dare I say it, more fun generally though. Every journey could be made to feel like a rally stage, it just had an eager feeling about it and with a shorter commute (and a little less Renault 'fanboy-ism') I'd have kept it.

Another point is the price. I'm lucky and had access to a 'Friends & Family' discount meaning it was actually cheaper than a Fiesta ST-3, but if I'm a member of the public who can only negotiate so far, or had a short commute and didn't need to worry about comfort, or refinement, or any of that, I'd definitely have to consider a Fiesta, or if it had to be Renault, stretching a little more for a Megane. Or just go all out for a 220 Trophy! They are genuinely very good. For me though, it fits my needs perfectly, but can see why some people are disappointed with it. It all comes down to what you want from it. Unfortunately, it does seem to have let down a huge chunk of the fanbase, but for others (like me), it's allowed me to have a Clio R.S. without having to turn to something like a Polo GTI for small hatch 'refinement' and all that, and probably won over a few new fans as well.

DSC_0028.jpg
 
Having driven the 220 trophy at oulton a part of me thought how easy it was to drive and drive quickly (despite the brakes being utterly fooked at this point)
Nothing like the buzz of my megane down the straights or around the corners but so easy to just throw it around every corner and it was certainly no slouch at all. Just didn't make you feel like it was you driving it rather it just doing its own thing and doing it very well mind.
The interior felt a little basic for this day and age for a daily but I didn't care on the track one bit. I missed the gear change of a manual but I can imagine that gearbox be very handy in the day to day most cars face
 
I was really tempted by a 200T EDC when they were first released and went and took one for a test drive. Just didn't gel with it like I thought I would. It was quick and surprisingly comfortable but I just didn't find it that exciting. At the time I wanted a manual and the auto just didn't feel good enough to convince me otherwise. Wasn't that keen on the 5 door looks or the interior either.

Looking back I might have been a bit harsh. It wasn't what I wanted at the time, but I think a year or so later when I was commuting by car each day rather than just using it at the weekends, it's more refined nature may have suited me better.
 
Do other people's opinions on a car influence people much? Genuine question.

Magazine reviews, ytube etc give me an idea of what I want to try, and generally seem pretty accurate. But not sure the opinion of random folks has any influence (personally).
 
Agree. The reviews might make me eager (or less so) to tst drive or look into a car, but it wouldnt affect weather I bought it. The only way I think it would, would be if it highlighted some serious issues. Always test drive, and make up my own mind. I think you'd have to be a bit of a mong to buy a car (or not buy a car) on the basis of someone else's opinion.
 
Matthew said:
Agree. The reviews might make me eager (or less so) to tst drive or look into a car, but it wouldnt affect weather I bought it. The only way I think it would, would be if it highlighted some serious issues. Always test drive, and make up my own mind. I think you'd have to be a bit of a mong to buy a car (or not buy a car) on the basis of someone else's opinion.
Click to expand...
This. And some cars catch me by surprise by being way off expectations.

Went to Ford with money waiting to buy a fiesta St. Massively underwhelmed so bought an R26 instead. Test drove a mk5 gti out of boredom, ended up ordering one on the spot.
 
the 220 Trophy is awesomely capable, Dale Lomas put a stock one (cup 2 rubber) round the ring in 8.12 mins BTG on an out lap and sang its praises.
 
Love mine, done loads to it, it really is an enjoyable drive, box is brilliant. This is from a person that has mostly owned modded hot hatches, including Focus RS's, Megane 265 Trophy, Clio's Escorts Sierras etc etc
 
Matthew said:
Agree. The reviews might make me eager (or less so) to tst drive or look into a car, but it wouldnt affect weather I bought it. The only way I think it would, would be if it highlighted some serious issues. Always test drive, and make up my own mind. I think you'd have to be a bit of a mong to buy a car (or not buy a car) on the basis of someone else's opinion.
Click to expand...
I bought my 182 without ever even sitting in one. Twelve years on, I still have it. I bought it on face value of all the positive comments it had at the time.

Granted, it wasn't the smartest of things to do, but sometimes it works out for the best.
 
Big gamble though. Not quite sure why anyone would buy a car without even sitting in one, let alone driving one. Driving position could be terrible for you. Not something that someone else might pick up and report back on. The new Mx5's driving position was shocking for me, not something I've heard many others complain about.
 
i tried the launch control for the first time last night.......its pretty brutal isnt it.!
imo the gearbox is superb, i love it ...and the trophy is a proper fast little car. I guess a trophy is really all about handling and corners but make no mistake, it can more than hold its own in a straight line with most cars.
I came from a 335i bmw coupe, and ill tell you what, once rolling the trophy isnt far behind at all.
David
 
ben_r1 said:
Morning all.

Haven't shown my face on here for a long time, completely left the Renault scene behind in favour of jap metal but here I find myself again considering another ClioSport!?

Considering selling the Evo because, although it's an insanely fast car and a very special place to be, the maintenance and running costs that come with it kind of take away a lot of the fun. It gets to the point where your scared to use it in anger in case of clutch/gearbox/transfer box/diff/turbo/engine/AYC pump failure and costing many £££ to replace.

The end result is I keep her in the garage 360 days a year and she makes the occasional trip to Japfest at 70mph cruise, if it's sunny.

I miss the driving pleasure my old Clios provided, thrash them and then park up for a week well knowing she'll welcomely take the same abuse next weekend.
However times have changed for me, I have a family to lug round and consider myself more grown up as low bouncy loud road ready go karts don't appeal to me anymore.
This led me to look at Renaults latest offering in the form of the 200 EDC. Still turbo for instant response and mid range torque, 5 door and modern.
I've read so many bad reviews though that the gearbox ruins the entire car and it's actually quite gutless over 70mph.

Anyway who better to ask than the CS community. I know it wasn't well received here initially but have people grown to it now? Any positive owners out there?

Ben.
Click to expand...
 
220Trophy said:
ive said it before, but i test drove fiesta st twice and for instant fun factor it was incredible, it communicated everything it was doing brilliantly, so you can just get in and drive it hard straight away, but i found when i pushed it hard, it just wasnt quite as capable as the instant fun factor would have you believe, it couldnt lay its power exiting a corner anything like as good as a trophy, and this always shows on lap test comparisons, the trophy is always a few seconds up the road. I guess for some people thats irrelevant, so it doesn't matter to them, but it does matter to me, front drive cars scrabbling for traction out of corners and wasting all their power, do my head in!. Its probably because i spent years chasing lap times when tenths of a second mattered.
Ive just done 1800 miles in my trophy, so its officially run in lol, and its a mighty little package, the speed it can carry into a corner, the sheer grip at the apex and then the traction on the exit is astounding, you'd think it had a mechanical lsd and was wearing 888's if you didn't know better.
David
Click to expand...
I totally agree. I've read all these threads. Really can't understand why there is any debate about the clio edc being good or not. Is it better or worse than ST. Not as fun as old renaultsport... Blah blah blah. Absolutely load of bul.s**t. what the hell is wrong with everyone. Everything single review about the Clio from any other country other than UK is 100% its amazing car. Forget the st, 208gti or old clio 200 thst rides like a tank.
I've owned my 2017 clio 200edc for 16 months after spending 2 years struggling to drive a R26 running 280bhp as a daily. Quite frankly was a nightmare. Had a 2009 clio 200 before that. A 2014 AMG45. And various 172 and 182. So can give an honest opinion here about what's fun and capabilities of the clio 200edc. Nit driven a trophy. But the 2017 200edc was much improved. Has the trophy gearbox software and 192ftlb rather than 177.
Irs a f**king amazing car. Its certainly the best most composed handling car on my local dodgy cambered B roads than anything above mentioned. It's 15% stiffer chassis than the old(manual)200. But yet it feels so much softer. And as a result much more capable. No way can carry same speed down these roads in old 200 or the R26. How renaultsport have achieved this is pure Genius. The rally spec twin damper set up is Genius. Simular as 182 trophy without needing constant service every 30k. This is gone completely unnoticed. It's a oroper road going rally car. With the paddle gear change it really is. Renaultsport created a masterpiece.
The Amg45 dual clutch was absolutely awful. Nobody ever minded about that. Delayed in pull away(f**king dangerous) and tefude to change on certain gears at a given revs. Was a fault. How they was designed. Crap. Handled like a boat. 350kg heavier but actually smaller than clio inside.
Forget all the negative silly reviews of this clio. Its a Genius hot hatch simple as that. Stop comparing it to anything else cause nothing has those dampers. And u till get on a really badly cambered fucked up B Road, of which there are many. And absolutely go Insanly fast it's never gonna make any sense
.
The R26 I previously had was no way near as much fun. And not as fast in straight like and corners.
 
massiveCoRbyn said:
I drove a 200T at the 'ring and wasn't really very impressed by it. It went ok and handled ok, but it just didn't feel raw and exciting like an older RS Clio. It lacked the "special" feeling. The gearbox wasn't terrible but it wasn't nearly as good as the DSG in my Golf, or even the one in my friend's '07 Passat diesel. I didn't try auto mode I must say. I do think some of the Clio reviews are slightly unfair as it isn't a bad car by any means. The problem is, it just isn't as good as its rivals. Renault can't exactly trade on build quality, residuals or a premium brand, so the Renault Sport magic is their big selling point. The 200 EDC doesn't have that magic in my view, so I'd be looking elsewhere.

If I was looking for a five door hot hatch with an auto option, I would be looking at a Golf GTI. Bigger, more practical, more stylish, better build quality, better gearbox. Or what about a Polo GTI if you want to stay with something a bit smaller? They wouldn't be as new but are much nicer cars in my view. We're very lucky in that we are spoiled for choice when it comes to hot hatches, which makes the case for the Clio even worse.
Click to expand...
The clio 200 edc is not a track. Trying to form an opinion based on a drive at the ultra smooth, Highley predictable race track is a big mistake. The public roads is whole different ball game especially on unpredictable bumpy b roads on a very narrow road with absolutely no room for mistakes. Can not compare to a golf Gti. That ridiculous. Who cares If dsg is better. It absolutely is not, has different character maybe, less raw and smoother. Its more expensive package. The polo gti is s**t. I test drove one before the clio. There was no magic. What's great about the clio is the gear change process is really involved. The audilbaul exhaust note blow when changes at normal driving speed is great.(standard exhaust)I love it. I know when the gears changed. Not by looking at the dash. The dsg has no driver involvement. The chest nasty plastic switches on steering for manual change feel awful. The clunk of those Nissan GTR paddles is so satisfying. But o no the means and groans of having to lift one's hand from the steering wheel to change gear with fixed steering wheel paddles. Not like the German cars who got ot so right.... bo how bo hoo.
How absolutely pathetic the UK approach to this clio 200 or 220.
Unbelievable ego based negatively. Or pure French xenophobia. Maybe.
It the best Clio Renaultsport ever made. One of the best hot hatches ever made. End of.
 
ForceIndia said:
I don't like them. Can't see why anyone would pick one over a megane 250/275. That's a genuine rs product, the clio feels like a GT version. Box is the worst dual clutch I've tried, the ten yr old golf gti box is light years ahead.

If you like the old rs products, the Meg is the one to go with.
Click to expand...
Have you actually driven one?
So it's not a genuine RS car. What is it then? Another interesting ego based opinon. Why you even on this site if dont even like them, and according to your expert knowledge the amazng guys at the Alpine factory in Dieppe, who spent miiions euros and 1000',s researching like f**k to create this car, and all on the previous knowledge on the cars they have made including yiur mentioned megane. Have now suddenly got itcall wrong. Sp the concept of rally spec disl damper tron shocks. Never seen on any production car, abd a race style, no need to lift hands of steering wheel dual clutch paddle shift geearbox means they got it all wrong. Not a genuine motorsport product then.
A 10 year old dsg unit is not light years ahead. Ego based negatives. Bet u not owned an edc.
And why the hell you on this site expressing negatives. Really don't understand
 
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