CLIO IV RS - Trophy from page 111

[realnumber 1]

The biggest issue the reviews are having is the gear box isn't it. Surely this can/will be fixed with a firmware update or something later on?

Give it a year or 2 (and maybe better spec list) and most will probably love it. It was the same with the 197 then 200 on here...

 

[Heez]

remember its meant to be clio SPORT
is the new model really a sport?

Is it though? Pretty sure it's a Renault Clio Renaultsport 200 Turbo EDC.

 

[Matthew]

Catchy.

 

[klm182]

i saw the twingo on top gear,looks a great little car,i just expected the new clio to be a bit better.
guess you have to see it in person,drive it. looks might grow on you. yellow looks better than the red.
add swap my 182 tomorrow for one, straight swap ha.

If the only people who bought these cars were from geeky car forums, Renualtsport would have been forced to shut up shop years ago. So many so-called motoring enthusiasts just can't see past the end of their own keyboard TBH.

 

[klm182]

a badge means nothing, tell that to 206 gti owners who bought it after the 205 gti. it does not mean its good.you can put any badge on a car ,if its cr@p its cr@p.why does alot of people on here try to be clever?.

Is it though? Pretty sure it's a Renault Clio Renaultsport 200 Turbo EDC.

 

[Chris Lewis]

What is the point in a gearbox that can change gear in milliseconds, if it doesn't do it until a half a second after you press the button?

Sounds like the stupidest oversight i have seen since the Cypriots decided to close the banks to prevent bank runs.

 

[ColinG]

the most stupid thing is, the paddles may well be from a Nissan GTR but when your accelerating hard out of ASDA carpark on a quarter steering lock...you cant reach the damn paddle as it doesnt move with the wheel! Huge error there from Renault IMO!

Surely you will just be hitting the limiter all the time mid corner until you straighten up again??

 

[The Boosh!]

Surely you will just be hitting the limiter all the time mid corner until you straighten up again??

I was under the impression that all of your braking and gearing should be done pre corner, not while you're taking it. I'm sure there are benefits and cons to column and steering mounted though.

 

[Damo251]

Surely you will just be hitting the limiter all the time mid corner until you straighten up again??

Surely you could slide your hand a few inches and tap the lever? Or is that impossible, or leave it in sport and let it change up for you if you don't feel like it's possible to unclasp your talons. Probably best if you don't try manual.

Damo

 

[Gavin.]

There are plenty of super/hyper cars with paddle shifts of the column instead of the wheel, don't see the issue myself.

 

[Gally]

I can't think how great column mounted would be. Seems a tad weird.

 

[MarkCup]

I can't see how column mounted is an issue.

I'm used to taking my hand completely off the wheel and moving a big stick a few inches already...how hard is it to find a paddle that's always in the exact same place behind the wheel every single time I need it?

If taking your hands off the wheel to find a paddle is a problem, why is it not a problem with the sacred manual stick?

 

[ColinG]

Sliding your hands on the wheel to reach a paddle isnt really recommended though when your cornering hard you should have a good grip on the wheel...

In a perfect world we know changing mid corner isnt correct but sometimes if your accelerating out of a corner you run out of revs,

So if your in manual mode would it still change at the redline itsself??

 

[MarkCup]

Sliding your hands on the wheel to reach a paddle isnt really recommended though when your cornering hard you should have a good grip on the wheel...

In a perfect world we know changing mid corner isnt correct but sometimes if your accelerating out of a corner you run out of revs,

So if your in manual mode would it still change at the redline itsself??

How is moving hands to find a paddle any different from taking a hand off to find a gear lever?

Manual mode on race settings = no automatic upshift.

 

[Gally]

Slightly different mate, takes 2 hands to go up and down gears on a paddle shift, can be done with one via stick.

If you were in a skid, sticking it into a lower gear on a manual is a lot easier than doing it on a column mounted paddle shift box.

 

[ColinG]

I can't see how column mounted is an issue.

I'm used to taking my hand completely off the wheel and moving a big stick a few inches already...how hard is it to find a paddle that's always in the exact same place behind the wheel every single time I need it?

If taking your hands off the wheel to find a paddle is a problem, why is it not a problem with the sacred manual stick?

Fair point

 

[Gavin.]

Sliding your hands on the wheel to reach a paddle isnt really recommended though when your cornering hard you should have a good grip on the wheel...

In a perfect world we know changing mid corner isnt correct but sometimes if your accelerating out of a corner you run out of revs,

So if your in manual mode would it still change at the redline itsself??

Tbh I cant see it having a fully manual mode, it will still override you in that case I recon.

 

[MarkCup]

Slightly different mate, takes 2 hands to go up and down gears on a paddle shift, can be done with one via stick.

If you were in a skid, sticking it into a lower gear on a manual is a lot easier than doing it on a column mounted paddle shift box.

FLOL, what point are you making?

Is it that because there's two paddles you might need to take both hands off the wheel at the same time?

Using a stick takes longer and you have to move your hand further. The stick itself will be in a different place as well depending on what gear you're in.

Paddles don't move, they're a stretch of the finger away and always in the same place.

Or am I missing something fundamental? I must be.

 

[Martin_172]

Slightly different mate, takes 2 hands to go up and down gears on a paddle shift, can be done with one via stick.

If you were in a skid, sticking it into a lower gear on a manual is a lot easier than doing it on a column mounted paddle shift box.

but if your in a sideways slide a quick pull on the left paddle and an ultra quick shift is much quicker than, clutch down, shift down on the gearbox you cant rush or it will brake, clutch up and power down, id have thought anyway?

and as for having to change up mid corner, you have a turbo engine with plenty low down torque, just go for a higher gear in the first place so you don't run out of revs, worst case just hold the revs under the limiter as you would have done on a 200 anyway?

 

[Matt26]

I could see why a racing car built with column-mounted paddles would be a problem - you are rarely turning the wheel more than three-quarters each way. However, if you've got a road car that the wheel turns 2-3 times, isn't it possible to 'lose' where the paddles are if you're looking at the road? Column-mounted in that situation seems more sensible as you know where they are at all times.

 

[Chris Lewis]

Let's face it. The box will change itself anyway. In reality this is an automatic gearbox, with the illusion that you get to change gear yourself.

 

[Martin_172]

not in RS mode it wont, it will bounce off the limiter until you press the up paddle!

 

[Heez]

Let's face it. The box will change itself anyway. In reality this is an automatic gearbox, with the illusion that you get to change gear yourself.

Have you driven it?

 

[dare!]

the most stupid thing is, the paddles may well be from a Nissan GTR but when your accelerating hard out of ASDA carpark on a quarter steering lock...you cant reach the damn paddle as it doesnt move with the wheel! Huge error there from Renault IMO!

Surely you will just be hitting the limiter all the time mid corner until you straighten up again??

Only if you have it permanently in 'Race' mode.

 

[Matt26]

Lots of racing to be had in ASDA car park though, to be fair.

 

[Chris Lewis]

Have you driven it?

No, but the box is obviously going to override the driver, Do you honestly think Renault would allow the drive to force a down change on the gearbox that the engine cannot handle.

In a race car with a sadev sequential, if you force the downchange you will blow the engine up, the driver can simply force the downchange when he likes. The software will not allow this in a road car because people would blow the engines up. So it is obvious the software with override the driver.

 

[Martin_172]

I cant see how allowing you to downshift would be any different to what you can currently do, I managed to go from the top end of 4th gear to 3rd in a 172 years ago instead of 5th.

however of course it would be a good safe gaurd to prevent the gearbox from doing this as all its going to do is prevent you from blowing the engine, not going to affect the driving experience in any way!

you said the gearbox will change up on its own, that it wont do.

 

[Chris Lewis]

I cant see how allowing you to downshift would be any different to what you can currently do, I managed to go from the top end of 4th gear to 3rd in a 172 years ago instead of 5th.

however of course it would be a good safe gaurd to prevent the gearbox from doing this as all its going to do is prevent you from blowing the engine, not going to affect the driving experience in any way!

you said the gearbox will change up on its own, that it wont do.

The difference being of course that in a manual gearbox, the gear wont go in if you try to force it at an engine speed that is too high. In a sequential box or a box with an electronic sequential controller, the gear can be forced. In the former, the driver has to know when and how to effectively downshift, in the latter, the computer prevents the gear going in by overriding the command.

Driving along at 70 in the new rs and you suddenly click downchange 5 times. Do you honestly beleive it will go down 5 gears? No the computer with over ride and prevent a down change.

We know the computer will override commands, the golf dsg box does this all the time. When you drive up to a junction and stop it AUTOMATICALLY selects 1st. The rs box will be similar. The question is: will renault get the level of override right so that it doesnt feel intrusive?

 

[Martin_172]

of course it wont hence why I said its a good safe guard for them to use, it in absolutely no way affects the driving experience of the box in any way though does it?

with a decent manual gearbox it will let you downshift to a gear that could cause engine damage, all my clios have done it bar one that had a gearbox on the way out!

 

[Gally]

My Dsg didn't. You clicked the paddles it was instantly manual until you left it for 30 seconds or so then it went back into D.

If you want full manual you slide the selector down to D and then to the side +/- and it stays manual similar to the RS.

 

[Chris Lewis]

My Dsg didn't. You clicked the paddles it was instantly manual until you left it for 30 seconds or so then it went back into D.

If you want full manual you slide the selector down to D and then to the side +/- and it stays manual similar to the RS.

So you get to a junction and pull up in 5th, what does it do? The one i drove changed down to 1st even in manual.

 

[Martin_172]

regardless if it does that or not, I still fail to see how this takes anything away from the driving experience when driving quick?

 

[Chris Lewis]

regardless if it does that or not, I still fail to see how this takes anything away from the driving experience when driving quick?

Its not important.

 

[Gally]

So you get to a junction and pull up in 5th, what does it do? The one i drove changed down to 1st even in manual.

Lols it changed down to first when you flicked the paddle? That's definitely broken!

Flick the paddle puts it into manual and goes up or down depending on what paddle. So if auto is in 4th gear and you pull down it'll go into manual 3rd from memory.

 

[MarkCup]

I thought we'd already covered this?

"RS gearbox is rubbish because you can't downshift in a way which would harm it".

LOL

Using this argument any car with a rev limiter is useless as you can't try to rev it to 10k and blow the engine up.

Do rev limiters ruin the driving experience? Should they be removed for all the driving purists perhaps?

 

[Chris Lewis]

I thought we'd already covered this?

"RS gearbox is rubbish because you can't downshift in a way which would harm it".

LOL

Using this argument any car with a rev limiter is useless as you can't try to rev it to 10k and blow the engine up.

Do rev limiters ruin the driving experience? Should they be removed for all the driving purists perhaps?

The point is the gearbox has been shown not to change efficienty in response to the selection in two mainstream reviews so far (autocar and topgear). It has also been shown to not downshift correctly in one (topgear).

So the question is valid:

Is this really designed to be an automatic box, with the pretense of manual selection?

 

[Gally]

So what is the problem with the box? Surely it goes into manual mode when you blip the paddleshift up or down?

 

[James]

So you get to a junction and pull up in 5th, what does it do? The one i drove changed down to 1st even in manual.

Surely that's a GOOD thing? I'm not seeing your argument lol

the box won't let you change down if it'll cause the engine to over rev - good thing
the box won't auto change up a gear when bouncing off the limiter until the paddle is pressed - good thing
it'll go into 1st automatically if you come to a full stop - good thing

so what exactly is your argument?

all of the above are assumptions as I haven't driven one

 

[Chris Lewis]

Surely that's a GOOD thing? I'm not seeing your argument lol

the box won't let you change down if it'll cause the engine to over rev - good thing
the box won't auto change up a gear when bouncing off the limiter until the paddle is pressed - good thing
it'll go into 1st automatically if you come to a full stop - good thing

so what exactly is your argument?

all of the above are assumptions as I haven't driven one

Well what i found was as i started to change down, the computer did the same, and i ended up in neutral, tried to pull into a gap and went no where. Very annoying.

 

[Gally]

The assumptions don't sound bad, they sound like any decent Dsg box.

Never really tried to go from 5th to first because I have some common sense.