cup suspension?

[katiescar]

Hi all, as a newcomer to the clio world, could some one tell me what's the difference between cup and non cup suspension ? Ie are shock rates different? And are the wishbones different? And can you use cup shocks/wishbones on a non cup car? Many thanks guys.

 

[griffonu]

From what I know the differences are:
- different springs (and shocks?)
- different anti roll bars (thicker)
- quicker sterring rack

However, it would be super cool if somebody could confirm this. It would mean that in theory you could put the cup suspension (springs, ARBs) on a non-cup car.

-VaVaVoum

 

[MG cup]

Been covered 33333,000,000 times if you do a google search.

But anyway heres a quick summary of what I have came to notice.

You can fit everything to anyone of the 1*2's

Never heard of differences in the racks except some being made by TRW and some SMI.

Cups have wider drilled subframes so you need the driveshafts from a Cup if you fit one along with Cup inner tie rods (longest) to be right.

Cup shock and springs are 15% lower and stiffer according to Renault sales spiel.

Trophys came with Sachs dampers and Eibach springs iirc with 182 bolt spacing.

182 hubs have different size bearings (bigger) to any other car and obviously the bolt spacing for the hubs are different between the variations.

Cup or it seems to be that cars after around 2003 came with increased caster wishbones.

Theres various different lengths/designs of shaft from ph1 to 172 to cup to 182 twin piece shafts. 172 cup being the longest I have seen and I'm sure the 182 cups share the same.

ARB's got thicker throughout the evolution's with the 182 cup having the thickest I have been told.

To answer your question, you could throw cup dampers and springs, higher caster wishbones on any car as long as you have the right hub bolt spacing which is 54mm for 172 and 60mm for 182, don't quote me in the dimensions of the bolt spacing as I use laguna hubs so have taken no interest.

 

[katiescar]

Many thanks for the info.

 

[ripp]

so the 172 cup has a wider subframe, that means that the front track is wider than a 182 cup?

 

[MG cup]

so the 172 cup has a wider subframe, that means that the front track is wider than a 182 cup?

I'm not entirely sure which is wider with wheel offsets and hubs etc but the 172 cup has a subframe that's drilled wider for the wishbones and will allow you to go wider without massive offsets or spacers.

 

[ripp]

so it gains track width from the subframe, and also from the wheels which are ET 38. The hubs from a 182 cup have about the same width so doing the math the 172 has the wider track. I'm a bit surprised as to why renault would make the newer 182 narrower?!

 

[MG cup]

The 172 cups have many better things than most 1*2's including engines in most cases, it was sold as a track car for the road initially remember and had most things slightly fettled to improve this.

Measure the distance from the wishbone bolt centre to the edge of the subframe on your 182 cup and there is a thread on here somewhere with pictures of different subframes. Someone might be able to find it but mark123 took the pictures

 

[ripp]

can't find the damn thing! I'm set up to solve this mistery once and for all ha ha!
will take measurements on my car and then hopefully some others will and clear this up. over 10 years of "cup history" and there's still a lot of debate on this

 

[MG cup]

Check out post #23 & #36 but the whole thread is good and there isn't really anything more to clear up, I know for a fact that the 172 cups have the longest/widest everything as I have done loads of searching/measuring/fitting to be able to fit cup racer suspension onto my 172 cup

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?659166-172-cup-track-rod-ends/page2

this thread too

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...-182-cup-hubs&highlight=Subframe+cup+pictures