FAO harness owners using rear seatbelt positions for attachment points

[edde]

too the seat belt bolts in the back!!

Thats not a safe sport when you have a front end crash though as it will cause you massive back problems as it will compress your spine.

This attached phoots shows why you need a proer cage and harness bar.

I'd use the top seatbelt rear mount unless you have a cage.

 

[d4ve86]

or get a bar welded in, either a welded in strut brace or a bar welded across the car, maybe at the top of where the rear bench goes so its at the correct height

Do not just use a strut brace it would just rip out in an accident!

 

[edde]

or get a bar welded in, either a welded in strut brace or a bar welded across the car, maybe at the top of where the rear bench goes so its at the correct height

Do not just use a strut brace it would just rip out in an accident!

Yep its taken to be 7 tones of load in an accident on a point which no strut brace could hole even a 10% of I'd excpect.

 

[Clio_Craig]

so where exactly have i got to attacth my harnesses? has any one got any pics of theres?? i have 1.2 2003 extreme

 

[C.slicker]

I hear what you are saying about the 7 tonne thing but I find it hard to believe the rear upper seat belt mounts could hold anywhere near that!

 

[Clio_Craig]

thats wat i think, it cant be rite

 

[edde]

I hear what you are saying about the 7 tonne thing but I find it hard to believe the rear upper seat belt mounts could hold anywhere near that!

They will.

You'd be suprised how storng they are.

The issue is the fact the rear seatbelt mount is to low and will causer serious back injourioes and is infact illegal if your car were to be SVA approved. (if it were to be newly checked out)

 

[C.slicker]

You learn something everyday.

I am still not convinced they would hold 7 of my cars but I will take your word for it.


On a 4-point harness do you advise attaching both lines to the upper rear seatbelt mount? and then the same on the other side?

Sam

 

[Clio_Craig]

sam im still unsure where to attacth my harnesses lol i hear something new and different every day

 

[C.slicker]

Basically Edde is saying, and I have yet to find him to be wrong, that the harness lines should be attached to the rear upper seatbelt mounts on each side.

The rear upper seatbelt mounts are the mounts that hold the rear seat belt reels in place. I am unsure if they should be crossed or not though.

Then for the two lap belt straps you want one to be attached to the subframe (the tight space between the frame and the handbrake cover) and then the other side to be attached using a harness eye type bolt where the original front belts were attached.

 

[Clio_Craig]

rite ok ..... lol im useless wit all this

 

[Batman]

too the seat belt bolts in the back!!

Thats not a safe sport when you have a front end crash though as it will cause you massive back problems as it will compress your spine.

This attached phoots shows why you need a proer cage and harness bar.

I'd use the top seatbelt rear mount unless you have a cage.

guys looking a lil cramped here he needs to chill and put his seat back a tad

 

[foxon]

alrigt ladies, i know this is an old thead but on the subject of seat harnesses - my bro has corbeau revolution bucket seats (that r going in his ka) n the top holes for the harnesses sit higher than his shoulders so does he still need to fit the harnesses to the top rear beat mount?? n y do u cross them? any help??

 

[Hollister]

People cross them to make their effective length shorter, but you should really do it.

If it is a decent set of belts they should come with a diagram showing where they should go. Shoulder straps should be as shown in the diagram in the first post.

Another thing to NOT do its attach each strap points with different max loads

 

[foxon]

Another thing to NOT do its attach each strap points with different max loads

whats that mean?? fitted the seats yesterday in his KA (took al bloody day-fuckin pain, no room 2 move in a KA) crossed the seat belt, they look mint. `luke` harnesses by the way

 

[Clio_Craig]

any one got any pics of where to attacth please, im keeping my rear bench

 

[kevinhall]

Not fitted mine yet but assuming its the circled area where the rear sear belts are mounted behind the plastic trim:

ps borrowed image from another post - hope owner doesn't mind

 

[7MAT]

too the seat belt bolts in the back!!

Thats not a safe sport when you have a front end crash though as it will cause you massive back problems as it will compress your spine.

This attached phoots shows why you need a proer cage and harness bar.

I'd use the top seatbelt rear mount unless you have a cage.

I've read this before (only on this forum mind) and asked Mark from Mark Fish Motorsport about it because I had concerns as my belts are attached to the lower rear seat belt points. I was told not to worry.

If it is such a bad idea, then why do Schroth Racing (the manufacturers of Hanns device) make Quickfit ASM trackday harnesses?

Would spinal compression only be an issue if the belt holes on the back of your seat are lower than your shoulders?

 

[paul]

thats a good idea ^^^ havent seen that before!

 

[Clio_Craig]

can u fail an mot coz of harneses

 

[7MAT]

can u fail an mot coz of harneses

Yes you can, although you can buy road legal CE marked harnesses.

 

[Clio_Craig]

i have road legal harneses, but i mean can you fail for where they are attacthed?

 

[7MAT]

i have road legal harneses, but i mean can you fail for where they are attacthed?

Not that I'm aware, at least I don't think so?

 

[Clio_Craig]

i have road legal harneses, but there is so much debate about where to attacth them, i just dont wanna fail for having them in the wrong place

 

[d4ve86]

u should not fail an MOT on where they are attached, unless there stupidly unsafe

 

[A19 CUP]

i think you will find that if you have the rear seats in place and have harnesses and you have had to take out the rear seatbelts to fit the harnesses to the seat belt mounts this will actually fail an MOT

 

[Phoenix]

mine has litterally just passed its MOT with the harnesses attached to where the rear bench usd to b

 

[edde]

I've read this before (only on this forum mind) and asked Mark from Mark Fish Motorsport about it because I had concerns as my belts are attached to the lower rear seat belt points. I was told not to worry.

If it is such a bad idea, then why do Schroth Racing (the manufacturers of Hanns device) make Quickfit ASM trackday harnesses?

Would spinal compression only be an issue if the belt holes on the back of your seat are lower than your shoulders?

Well contact them and ask them about the subject of why they do and no race series would let you

your right the issue only exists when you use the lower holes when the belts ar upto -20 degreee as per the drawing your ok any more of a drop and unless you have the special seats then compression of the spine happens.

can u fail an mot coz of harneses

Nope not realy unless belt condition is poor. The MOT is a check if you went into SVA approval ie the CLio has been built by yourself as a kit with the holes in that position then it would be resused to pass the test but MOT doens't check for these things.

i have road legal harneses, but i mean can you fail for where they are attacthed?

See above answer.

u should not fail an MOT on where they are attached, unless there stupidly unsafe

Yep. Thats because MOT done't check or know what is good and safe.

 

[edde]

i think you will find that if you have the rear seats in place and have harnesses and you have had to take out the rear seatbelts to fit the harnesses to the seat belt mounts this will actually fail an MOT

just take the rear seats out and its no issue.

mine has litterally just passed its MOT with the harnesses attached to where the rear bench usd to b

Doens't mean its safe MOT don't check for harness mounts as its not normal car spec so not like ever car should have to be checked to see if it would if it were a new car trying to get on the road be legal.

 

[d4ve86]

u should not fail an MOT on where they are attached, unless there stupidly unsafe

Yep. Thats because MOT done't check or know what is good and safe.

agreeded, mine are on a harnesses bar, and for racing they have to be mounted as you have said, i think its part of the regulations for most race series.

 

[7MAT]

As I don't ever plan to enter my road legal Trophy into a race series, I'll just stick with my harnesses as they are. If its okay for Mark Fish and Schroth Racing to have track day harnesses in that position its okay for me too.

My Sabelt harnesses are road legal and CE marked, so also not race / FIA approved.

To be honest if it really was a big issue in this world of law suits etc I would of though that every harness sold would have a safety sheet pointing this out.

 

[Day]

Spot on.

I suppose we should be wearing florescent jackets and hard hats when driving too.

Damn EU muppets!

 

[Hollister]

To be honest if it really was a big issue in this world of law suits etc I would of though that every harness sold would have a safety sheet pointing this out.

My 5 point Willans harnesses did come with a sheet showing the recommeded angle for the shoulder straps

 

[edde]

As I don't ever plan to enter my road legal Trophy into a race series, I'll just stick with my harnesses as they are. If its okay for Mark Fish and Schroth Racing to have track day harnesses in that position its okay for me too.

My Sabelt harnesses are road legal and CE marked, so also not race / FIA approved.

To be honest if it really was a big issue in this world of law suits etc I would of though that every harness sold would have a safety sheet pointing this out.

Just because your not going to race are you not going to take note of what is safe they demand that in racing as its the only safe option.

Good harness compnaies do but there no implied warenty so they don't need to.

Damn EU muppets!

Its not the EU this goes back years into safe design and implementation.

If you think its safe how many racer series even the USA etc use low mounted points?

 

[7MAT]

Damn EU muppets!

If you think its safe how many racer series even the USA etc use low mounted points?

Spoke to a bloke who does banger racing at Wimbledon, and he told me that many stock racers harnesses are strapped almost under the seat.

 

[GabrielKnight]

Some more clarification please!

For those suggesting using the upper seatbelt mounts, how would you do this with a 4 point harness (where does the 4th point go?)

If mounting to the lower belt mounts (against the advice of 1st post) or to a cage, are you supposed to criss-cross the straps or not? What's the reason?

 

[GabrielKnight]

:bump:MOT tomorrow, need to know!

 

[jon_r]

For your MOT i'd mount them using the lower belt mounts and cross them.

Its only ClioSport that seems to have a problem with using the lower belt mounts. With a cage you'd wrap them round the harness bar and fix, though not cross them. I'm not certain why.

 

[theduck]

:bump:MOT tomorrow, need to know!

Wont fail for mounting points

 

[ben_p]

for the mot just double up on the lower belt clip mount,

or

remove the rear side plastics (c piller) and remove the belt mech from there. and mount them both to the plate where the mech used to be