HD can someone explain......

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

Again sorry for my ignorance, or laziness to search, but I have some Q about HD relating to the definitions. I notice most TV's have a figure of 720i, then some have 1080i, and then 1080p?

I am assuming the higher the number the better the resolution, but how do they work together? Will some HD DVD's for example be sold in 1080, so if you have a TV that only supports 720 you wont be able to watch it? What is the difference on the 1080 between i + p?

The samsung http://www.rgbdirect.co.uk/Referrer.asp?SKUNumber=104237&ReferrerCode=3 seems to only support 720, where as, from what I can see, the toshiba 32wlt66 supports 1080.

Can someone clear this up for me in a nutshell, without savagely attacking my lack of knowledge :rasp:

 

[sn00p]

Dear McBunny,

Could you fix it for Thomas so that.....





(He'll be along shortly I'm sure!)

 

[The Hoff]

Cliosport the forum of experts for every subject.

www.avforums.com post the exact same question on there and get some genuine answers.

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

Cliosport the forum of experts for every subject.

www.avforums.com post the exact same question on there and get some genuine answers.

I think we have enough geeks on here to answer my question.

 

[Clart]

the tosh supports 1080i, which is just 720p upscaled to 1080 lines.

a 1080p TV like the one mcbunny got can display true 1080p resolutions, but on a 32 inch TV you won't even notice the difference. Anything over 40inches and I would consider 1080p.

all HD DVD discs show the same thing, but the source that its played on defines the resolution.

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

the tosh supports 1080i, which is just 720p upscaled to 1080 lines.

a 1080p TV like the one mcbunny got can display true 1080p resolutions, but on a 32 inch TV you won't even notice the difference. Anything over 40inches and I would consider 1080p.

all HD DVD discs show the same thing, but the source that its played on defines the resolution.

See, we do have enough geeks to answer my questions :rasp:

 

[McBunny]

heloooo

right there are 3 main hd resolutions 720p 1080i and 1080p

your are right in saying the bigger the number the higher the resolution

720p is 1280x720 and 1080i and p are 1920x1080

where it starts to get confusing is the fact that there arnt many native 720p screen out there most lcd's use 1366x768 and plasmas use 1024x768 and use square pixels to make the image widescreen so then they have to scale all the images to fit either that ou you have a border around the screen. most will also display 1080i footage too but they downsample them to their native resolution so you miss out on the quality

then you get the 1080 panels there arnt many 1080p capable tv's out there either at the mo the cheapest is the goodmans that i have at about 989
there are more 1080i panels tho and alot of these do have a screen resolution of 1920x1080 or same as their native content but lack the more expensive technology to allow them to input 1080.

i and p purely mean interlaced meaning that every frame is split into odd and even lines before been sent to the screen
and progressive means that the entire frame is displayed in one go rather than half at a time

but lcd's and plasmas by their very nature are progressive they CANT do interlaced ! so what happens is your dvd player sends the tv half a frame at a time the tv then combines them to make the image (thats the simple version)

as for hd dvd and bluray all the discs are encoded at 1080p and if you connect it to a display that doesnt accept a native 1080p input it just scales it to what ever will fit on its screen

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

cheers for that ^^^

Guarantee if I didnt clarify i'd go out and buy the wrong thing. It doesnt really seem like I can do that from what's been said though

 

[McBunny]

erm you can lol as some 1080p tv's wont accept 1080p over every input ! some will only allow it via hdmi not component dvi or vga

its a fricking dangerous place to be

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

erm you can lol as some 1080p tv's wont accept 1080p over every input ! some will only allow it via hdmi not component dvi or vga

its a fricking dangerous place to be

on a 32" TV is 1080 really something that needs to be worried about?

 

[McBunny]

what you after and how much you want to spend ?

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

Just after a 32" LCD, for use with my 360 + Sky HD next yr. Looking at spending in the region of £600.

 

[McBunny]

erm you can lol as some 1080p tv's wont accept 1080p over every input ! some will only allow it via hdmi not component dvi or vga

its a fricking dangerous place to be

on a 32" TV is 1080 really something that needs to be worried about?

no


as for a tv try the tosh 32wlt66 nice tv or a samsung but im not too hot on all their model ranges and there is alot of them !

 

[Ads_172]

I'm pleased with the 32WLT66 thus far, and that's without any HD sources yet.

 

[rich[182]]

Do yourself a favour and don't bother with HD for another year, I've just spent 4 weeks looking into it and asking similar questions to the one in orginal post, my conclusion is that AT THIS time it's all overated bollox imho

Simply spend less than 10 mins reading through several threads at random over at www.avforums.co.uk and theres no end of people having all kinds of issues with LCD screens, manufacturers releasing sets that are known to be flawed, the farce that is Blu-Ray v HD-DVD, upscaling & downscaling issues, initial HD movies with poor transfers

I've asked myself if I can really be arsed to spend any more time researching anymore, and whether the end result is worth it, I've decided no and who cares

I'll wait another year until all the supposed claims are proven, until the manufacturers pull their finger out their arses and HD DVD (whatever format wins) actually does what it says it does out of the box

Until then I'll stay with my tried and trusted 28" CRT and £60 Toshiba DVD player, neither ever miss a beat and I've yet to see ANY LCD provide a better picture from a SD source regardless of what they cost :lolup:

Saw a £2.5k Sony the other day, properly setup and the picture from coax aerial & freeview was laughable

 

[tomdbomb61_djtj]

I feel your pain brother

 

[McBunny]

Do yourself a favour and don't bother with HD for another year, I've just spent 4 weeks looking into it and asking similar questions to the one in orginal post, my conclusion is that AT THIS time it's all overated bollox imho

Simply spend less than 10 mins reading through several threads at random over at www.avforums.co.uk and theres no end of people having all kinds of issues with LCD screens, manufacturers releasing sets that are known to be flawed, the farce that is Blu-Ray v HD-DVD, upscaling & downscaling issues, initial HD movies with poor transfers

I've asked myself if I can really be arsed to spend any more time researching anymore, and whether the end result is worth it, I've decided no and who cares

I'll wait another year until all the supposed claims are proven, until the manufacturers pull their finger out their arses and HD DVD (whatever format wins) actually does what it says it does out of the box

Until then I'll stay with my tried and trusted 28" CRT and £60 Toshiba DVD player, neither ever miss a beat and I've yet to see ANY LCD provide a better picture from a SD source regardless of what they cost :lolup:

Saw a £2.5k Sony the other day, properly setup and the picture from coax aerial & freeview was laughable

properly setup, coax and freeview dont go hand in hand at all !!

freeview will always be substandard on lcds due to the fact they show the flaws in the very poor feeds the quality of stuff on freeview is shocking

 

[rich[182]]

Anyone wants to know about the 720, 1080, i & p stuff then heres pure geeks baffle

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=437176&highlight=sharp

 

[dk]

Do yourself a favour and don't bother with HD for another year, I've just spent 4 weeks looking into it and asking similar questions to the one in orginal post, my conclusion is that AT THIS time it's all overated bollox imho

overated in what way? I have been enjoying HD gaming for nearly a year and HD-DVD's for nearly a month and I am loving it, picture perfect, can't fault it? I started my 360 on SD and then moved to HD after a month as it was sh1t compared to HD

Simply spend less than 10 mins reading through several threads at random over at www.avforums.co.uk and theres no end of people having all kinds of issues with LCD screens, manufacturers releasing sets that are known to be flawed, the farce that is Blu-Ray v HD-DVD, upscaling & downscaling issues, initial HD movies with poor transfers

I haven't had a problem with HD-DVD, bluray are having a few problems but not HD-DVD, why upscale when you can have native HD on the TV with a 360? To the average user i.e. most of us, we can't even see these flaws people talk of, its only the hardcore element that seek them out and then bang on about them

I've asked myself if I can really be arsed to spend any more time researching anymore, and whether the end result is worth it, I've decided no and who cares

what research is needed except which HD TV to buy, so much choice and so many good ones, just stay away from the bad ones.

I'll wait another year until all the supposed claims are proven, until the manufacturers pull their finger out their arses and HD DVD (whatever format wins) actually does what it says it does out of the box

it does what it says out of the box thanks, no need to prove claims, it works, if you haven't got it you can't really confirm it, so its just an opinion until then.

Until then I'll stay with my tried and trusted 28" CRT and £60 Toshiba DVD player, neither ever miss a beat and I've yet to see ANY LCD provide a better picture from a SD source regardless of what they cost :lolup:

my LCD is fine with freeview, some people are too critical or too close for the size screen they have and is there much really worth watching on tv that requires amazing resolution, if you think so then get sky HD, most of my tv time is HD gaming and HD-DVD though so it doesn't bother me and I won't let SD picture prevent me from fully enjoying my game and movie time.

Saw a £2.5k Sony the other day, properly setup and the picture from coax aerial & freeview was laughable

Maybe, but a 360 of HD-DVD player would look amazing and thats what they are designed for, gaming and movies NOW and terrestrial TV in the future when HD Freeview happens.

This is of course your opinion and I respect that, but I think you should mayberealise that all this technology is not tomorrows technology but todays and it works, very well!

 

[rich[182]]

^ Dave, sound like your happy with your purchases etc, some good points too. Maybe I'm too picky, I dunno.

I'm really into movies, I could prob live with any SD source issues to be honest, but heres my gripes re. the movies issues

If I'm paying between £1k and £2k for a LCD then it's on the basis I'll keep it for a good 3-5 yrs so I'd simply have to get a good 1080p that takes advantage of both HD-DVD or Blu-Ray, again maybe picky but personally I won't accept anything less
I can only go upto 37" due to my living room, currently theres not many 1080p 37" LCD's , the one I'd had my eye on is the new Sharp, but theres various problems with that set
There just seems to be all sorts of banding and backlight and bleed probs with most of the sets I've looked at and the Sony Bravia are either too big/too expensive

Then theres the format war which pisses me off bigtime, The regional coding strategy hasn't been finalised yet for either format, many of the initial launch titles aren't using the new codec which technically is better than Mpeg2, especially for older "lower quality" films that have low bitrate sampling, which means that eventually a movie will prob get a re-release with the new codec, also I don't think any of the launch titles use the new Dolby HD or DTS HD audio tracks, again prob resulting in reissues in a few months when they decide to do them properly, It just smacks of rushing HD-DVD and launch titles out to take advantage of the PS3 & Blu-Ray delay & pricing to try and get in their first

Also because I'm into movies it's clear that not all the movies I'm into will necessarily be on ONE format, well not until one format dies and they have to change their stance

The HD-DVD drive for the 360 is cool, and good price but I don't need a 360 as I prefer PC for gaming too

 

[Clart]

if 37 inch is the maximum then you'll hardly notice the difference that 1080p will produce compared to 720/1080i

 

[McBunny]

unless your sat about 4ft away from it

 

[172blue]

I'm pleased with the 32WLT66 thus far, and that's without any HD sources yet.

Me too, great TV, no HD yet but do have sky+, well chuffed. All the mag wins were correct!

 

[rich[182]]

reckon id be about 7ft away from the 37", if you reckon i wouldnt know the difference with 1080p maybe thats the reason most of the 1080p screens are 40"+ ?

37" is def the max i can go to without it looking silly in my room so maybe a good 720p/1080i would be ok and save a fair ammount of money, would also want the tosh360 dvd player with hdmi output and upscaling to get the best out of my dvd's, ive seen one of these demo'd upscaling on a toshiba 37" running starwars ep3 and picture was amazing for normal dvd

thanks re. the 1080p on a 37", didnt realise it was a factor to take into account

Is this a good price for the Tosh 37wlt66 inc genuine stand ?
Only £181 for 5yrs warranty too
http://www.cramptonandmoore.co.uk/37wlt66-i675.html

 

[Clart]

looks ok, although i think i've seen it for 850. I paid 950 for mine 3 months ago

 

[dk]

^ Dave, sound like your happy with your purchases etc, some good points too. Maybe I'm too picky, I dunno.

I'm really into movies, I could prob live with any SD source issues to be honest, but heres my gripes re. the movies issues

If I'm paying between £1k and £2k for a LCD then it's on the basis I'll keep it for a good 3-5 yrs so I'd simply have to get a good 1080p that takes advantage of both HD-DVD or Blu-Ray, again maybe picky but personally I won't accept anything less
I can only go upto 37" due to my living room, currently theres not many 1080p 37" LCD's , the one I'd had my eye on is the new Sharp, but theres various problems with that set
There just seems to be all sorts of banding and backlight and bleed probs with most of the sets I've looked at and the Sony Bravia are either too big/too expensive

Then theres the format war which pisses me off bigtime, The regional coding strategy hasn't been finalised yet for either format, many of the initial launch titles aren't using the new codec which technically is better than Mpeg2, especially for older "lower quality" films that have low bitrate sampling, which means that eventually a movie will prob get a re-release with the new codec, also I don't think any of the launch titles use the new Dolby HD or DTS HD audio tracks, again prob resulting in reissues in a few months when they decide to do them properly, It just smacks of rushing HD-DVD and launch titles out to take advantage of the PS3 & Blu-Ray delay & pricing to try and get in their first

Also because I'm into movies it's clear that not all the movies I'm into will necessarily be on ONE format, well not until one format dies and they have to change their stance

The HD-DVD drive for the 360 is cool, and good price but I don't need a 360 as I prefer PC for gaming too

good point on the sound options, I only have my tv sound as i haven't got a big enough room and the logistics to handle a decent sound system so not having True HD sound at the mo is nothing for me, i might change my mind when i do in a few years time maybe.

Regarding the codecs, this is where HD-DVD is winning currently as they are using the VC1 encoding whereas most of the bluray seem to be MPEG2, even films released at the same time on both formats such as WTC are encoded differently meaning the HD-DVD version actually looks better even though bluray has more space to play with.

As far as the format war goes, my personal opinion is that there is so much backing behind each format that i can't see one format winning soon, it will be a long fought out battle and the result may be in dual format players like we have dual format DVD writers for + and - R discs, they have survived together without much hassle.

I am always an early adopter though, i love my gadgets and always have to be at the bleeding edge!

 

[McBunny]

reckon id be about 7ft away from the 37", if you reckon i wouldnt know the difference with 1080p maybe thats the reason most of the 1080p screens are 40"+ ?

37" is def the max i can go to without it looking silly in my room so maybe a good 720p/1080i would be ok and save a fair ammount of money, would also want the tosh360 dvd player with hdmi output and upscaling to get the best out of my dvd's, ive seen one of these demo'd upscaling on a toshiba 37" running starwars ep3 and picture was amazing for normal dvd

thanks re. the 1080p on a 37", didnt realise it was a factor to take into account

Is this a good price for the Tosh 37wlt66 inc genuine stand ?
Only £181 for 5yrs warranty too
http://www.cramptonandmoore.co.uk/37wlt66-i675.html

37 is too small for 1080p especially at 7ft i have a 42" 1080p set at about 8-9 ft

 

[rich[182]]

Thanks for the info guys, might revisit this stuff after xmas when Ive more free time