How to kill the under steer?

[Ryanph1rs]

Hi guys and gals been on a few spirited drives today after fitting me white line rarb I've got front and rear strut braces and the cars been lowered around 40mm, now the handling is feeling like a go cart I've noticed the under steer more i was thinking about solid top mounts and power flex front anti roll bar bushes. I'm just wondering what have you done and found to be the best of all and pound for pound the best.....stiffness isn't a problem as I love bouncing around town and i intend to become more track orientated.

 

[Bluebeard]

What tyres do you have? What pressures are in them? Are you driving too aggressively?

I'd look at the basics before you go wasting money.

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I have 205/50/15 falken zex914 tyres with 33 psi in them on 8 inch wide axe 8wheels and there about 1200 miles old... I'd say it was aggressive but I'd still like to see what people are finding to be the best handling upgrades with out spending thousands on the pms wishbones and things that are a bit ott for the odd track day....

 

[Fred@BTM]

Tyre pressure is too high

 

[Ryanph1rs]

Tyre pressure is too high

what would you recommend ? The garage who done the tyres filled them... I'm unsure what's best on this front as I've heard loads of reviews on the power flex bushings being good.. Is there an upgraded front anti roll bar available ?

 

[Fred@BTM]

You want to be at 30psi when hot, but it varies with driver

 

[Ryanph1rs]

Cheers Fred ill alter it in the morning and have a little tinkle about still if any one on here can comment on these power flex bushes and what brand of top mounts and how they felt after it would be good to know....

 

[Tony Hunter]

Seems to me you've just completely ignored some advice already.

Stop worrying about bushes etc and get the car sorted as it is.

As Fred say's tyre pressure's, it's more than likely too stiff at the front which will give you understeer.

Have you still got any rake left on the car? (difference in height from front to back) like the standard cars have, or is it level?

PM wishbones are the last thing you need atm.

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I didn't ignore the advice I just asked as its good to know things so then in future I'm not as ignorant and I could help some one else with a similar issue yeh the car is still raked by about 7mm I'd say with out measuring it its fairly obvious by just looking at the car ( not just a slight rake ) .... I don't want the pm wishbones I'd never get anybenifit from it as the car isn't for just race..... I'd just like to (be a bit blunt ) know what's good, worth the money and has a good noticeable result and what's all b****cks that makes f**k all difference and has a large name and a big price tag....

 

[Tony Hunter]

What coilovers are you running.

Vmax, Ktec??

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I'm not I'm using spax springs as that's what came on the car when I bought it, ( there not the best but there okay ) it still sits raked though I assumed that rear are 35mm and fronts are 40mm however I have no proof of any of this I'm going to be saving for a set of bilstein coilovers but can't afford anything till end of August now as I've just done the dephasar and tyres

 

[MartinR]

Iirc spax springs are cack linear wound things. You need a good set of springs with fresh shocks or good quality coilovers not the k-tec/ vmaxx tat! Then do what has been mentioned above sort out tyre pressures.

***edit just read above about saving for coilovers***

 

[Breamy]

Think the spax may be your problem here!

 

[John Gordon]

Seems to me you've just completely ignored some advice already.

Stop worrying about bushes etc and get the car sorted as it is.

As Fred say's tyre pressure's, it's more than likely too stiff at the front which will give you understeer.

Have you still got any rake left on the car? (difference in height from front to back) like the standard cars have, or is it level?

PM wishbones are the last thing you need atm.

I was going to start a thread on Rake. I have some shitty VMAXX on at the moment however I have been playing with Rake. When I first fitted the coilovers the rear was slammed, we did not measure the height just threw the suspension in and I drove it as I was, intending to set it up at a later date. Slowly I have added more and more rake raising the rear and I swear the handling improves massively.

The Clio in my opinion needs (positive i guess??) rake. Of course it makes sense as its all about weight transfer, you want the weight on the front wheels during braking and turn in, gives the car much more positive turn in and the back floats around nice and progressive.

​Rake in my opinion is a huge part of car setup that's often overlooked.

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I agree with the rake and I am massivly inclined to agree that the spax are the problem I've adjusted the tire pressures and the feel of a loss of control in the understeer is still there I'm going to have to look deeper into the suspension.. What are people running? Coil overs or standard shocks and ebachs? I drove a mates standard cup and the suspension felt better the body roll was more but I have the whiteline and the omp strut braces ... Best pound for pound suspension set up out there?? I can't be affording 1000 pound avo coil overs

 

[MartinR]

Koni yellow shocks and eibach sportlines/cooksports is the best non coilover setup imo.

 

[NorthloopCup]

I'd be getting the alignment checked as a starting point as well tbh. You want toe out on the front. That helps to reduce the understeer, and should cost no more than £35 to have set!

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I've had the alignment done my mate works in hiq so got a freebe outta him,, I think it's going to have to be a full new suspension set up the standard ones were replaced by renault @44k according to receipts so now I'm on 88k couldn't hurt ( best get saving)
​

 

[Cup_Phil]

Had the alignment set to what? If you set it up to standard renault settings that won't be much good on track

 

[Ryanph1rs]

I believe it is setting standard what degree should it be for track camber bolts as well? Or will it be enough I can get them to re adjust it?

 

[NorthloopCup]

As a starting point go for 2" negative and around 10' minutes toe out. Be aware though, this is all driver specific. You tailor the way the car feels to your driving style and what you are comfortable with. There's no definitive 'put x amount of negative camber on and x amount of toe out, and it'll drive like a beaut'.

 

[Ryanph1rs]

Awsome cheers thanks ill pop and see my mate tomo morn and see if he can set this for me and ill give it a whizz about for a week. Suspension geometry and spring weights go right above my head ill try these settings out and get my mate to explaine it to me and ill take it from there cheers again

 

[Tony Hunter]

I was going to start a thread on Rake. I have some shitty VMAXX on at the moment however I have been playing with Rake. When I first fitted the coilovers the rear was slammed, we did not measure the height just threw the suspension in and I drove it as I was, intending to set it up at a later date. Slowly I have added more and more rake raising the rear and I swear the handling improves massively. The Clio in my opinion needs (positive i guess??) rake. Of course it makes sense as its all about weight transfer, you want the weight on the front wheels during braking and turn in, gives the car much more positive turn in and the back floats around nice and progressive. ​Rake in my opinion is a huge part of car setup that's often overlooked.

I would even go as far as to say, you need to replicate the standard mount of rake. If you get the car corner weighted, you'd be surprised at how much is needed to get it balanced.