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Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Sits nicely IMO, just needs wheels *cough* get cracking *cough*.
Do they do a vented disc option?
Do they do a vented disc option?
Sounds like a master cylinder issue.. The amount of times iv changed calipers on older cars went to bleed the brakes up an the MC has failed.. Pain in the arse..
Cant wait to see this finished! I may have to venture down your way to a meet when its out and about!
Edit: also those discs will be fine! My mini was standing or 6 years discs looked like that, good blast down the road and they cleaned up fine!
Cant wait to see this finished! I may have to venture down your way to a meet when its out and about!
Edit: also those discs will be fine! My mini was standing or 6 years discs looked like that, good blast down the road and they cleaned up fine!
I've done some research and yes, as feared it looks 99% likely to be a failed master cylinder.
To add to the confusion, there are 3 M/C's, one main, with 2 ports, and 2 in the boosters, each with just 1 port.
New M/C's from BMW are €476 which I'm not going to be paying, so tonight I'll bleed the brakes again in the vain hope it fixes it. If not, I need to source rebuild kits for the 3 M/C's, rebuild them all and then probably give the calipers a rebuild too.
The braking system on it is a very early design from the 60's. Finding the correct rebuild kits is proving very difficult.
The most annoying thing is that it now looks highly likely that I will miss the BMW festival at Gaydon on 18th August, and Trax is looking possible, but not as hopeful as I was last week.
To add to the confusion, there are 3 M/C's, one main, with 2 ports, and 2 in the boosters, each with just 1 port.
New M/C's from BMW are €476 which I'm not going to be paying, so tonight I'll bleed the brakes again in the vain hope it fixes it. If not, I need to source rebuild kits for the 3 M/C's, rebuild them all and then probably give the calipers a rebuild too.
The braking system on it is a very early design from the 60's. Finding the correct rebuild kits is proving very difficult.
The most annoying thing is that it now looks highly likely that I will miss the BMW festival at Gaydon on 18th August, and Trax is looking possible, but not as hopeful as I was last week.
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
You can do eeeeeet.
Can't be THAT hard to find a master cylinder kit through the forums can it?
Can't be THAT hard to find a master cylinder kit through the forums can it?
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Best bet would be to take one apart, then phone a brake specialist type person and send over pictures/measurements?
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
I'm not sure why I'm so on form today, but surely you get an idea from the exploded diagrams here?
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&hg=34&fg=25
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&hg=34&fg=25
I hate to sound so negative, but from those pictures, can you tell me which one of those 3 master cylinders is the correct one for my car?
I've narrowed it down to 2, and I'm pretty sure I know which one of those 2 it is.
Plus, they're the main M/C's, not the ones in the 2 boosters, which I might also need (I also might not need them, tbf).
Edit: Your filter was set to a 320i. I have a 316, the braking systems are different.
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
LOL! Surely you can tell if you sit infront of the car with the pictures printed out mate? (lazy northerner)
Are these boosters not on real oem?
Take some pics of them if not and post them up?
Booster, number 12 in this?
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0096&hg=34&fg=15
FYI, I think this is your master cylinder, as it actually brings up part numbers for you car, the others say "no parts for you car" I put in 1977 e21:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0196&hg=34&fg=25
Are these boosters not on real oem?
Take some pics of them if not and post them up?
Booster, number 12 in this?
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0096&hg=34&fg=15
FYI, I think this is your master cylinder, as it actually brings up part numbers for you car, the others say "no parts for you car" I put in 1977 e21:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0196&hg=34&fg=25
The M/C's are housed in a "box" so you can't see any of them.
Same story with the boosters, they're just a big drum looking thing. I can take them apart, but the issue with that is it's a point of no return. Take them apart and I have got to put them back together. Before I do that, I want to check I can actually get the parts I'm going to need.
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Check my edit above, one of the master cylinders comes up with part numbers, whilst the others say "no parts for you car" I think that means only one is correct?
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
I'm assuming these are the boosters?
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0248&hg=34&fg=25
and here's some more gasket part numbers and sizes etc:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0292&hg=34&fg=25
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0248&hg=34&fg=25
and here's some more gasket part numbers and sizes etc:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0292&hg=34&fg=25
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Sorry to spam to f**k, but summary, (I'd print these three pages, then sit infront of the car and check)
What I think is your MS:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0196&hg=34&fg=25
Your "boosters":
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0248&hg=34&fg=25
Booster brackets and a few outer gaskets etc:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0292&hg=34&fg=25
This is me guessing without the car infront of me, but it should help you make in-roads.
What I think is your MS:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0196&hg=34&fg=25
Your "boosters":
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0248&hg=34&fg=25
Booster brackets and a few outer gaskets etc:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=2932&mospid=47172&btnr=34_0292&hg=34&fg=25
This is me guessing without the car infront of me, but it should help you make in-roads.
welshname
ClioSport Club Member
How difficult would a more modern brake conversion be?
I'm not talking caliper, hub, disc etc.
I'm not talking caliper, hub, disc etc.
BOOM, brakes international do a service kit for the M/C for £36.
They also do a remote vacuum servo service kit, but it says it's not in stock, so there's no price. They also do replacement M/C's, but again, there's no price. I'll give them a ring and see what's what.
Progress is being made.
Pretty tricky. You'd need to make all new mounts for everything, find a conversion that would fit in the bay, get brackets made for the new callipers, make it all work with the current pedals.
They also do a remote vacuum servo service kit, but it says it's not in stock, so there's no price. They also do replacement M/C's, but again, there's no price. I'll give them a ring and see what's what.
Progress is being made.
Pretty tricky. You'd need to make all new mounts for everything, find a conversion that would fit in the bay, get brackets made for the new callipers, make it all work with the current pedals.
A ANIMAL
My BMX has a higher top speed than this and has no brakes. Just Roll brake-less?
welshname
ClioSport Club Member
I mean just for cylinders & servos.
So some updates.
Tonight was a mixed bag really, but in all it's left me feeling rather fed up with the car and the project as a whole, but more on that later.
The car itself is looking so good, it sits really nicely, and although the heights need a bit of tinkering with, I'm happy for now.
The rear camber is laughable!
Got a fair amount of the interior done over the weekend just gone:
New rev counter, thanks to Jamie who dropped it off one morning, out of the blue
It might be childish, but I love that just the rev counter has a red needle
So onto the less happy stuff.
The drivers carpet is drenched, literally full of water. I'm gutted to say the least as I put a lot of time and effort getting the carpet looking nice, and I fear it may be damaged by the water. Hopefully I will be able to dry it out once the leak is fixed, which appears to be coming from the back of the heater box. A new seal should hopefully see things right.
As we know, the brakes are not working, due to a suspected master cylinder failure.
I have managed to source a rebuild kit from a local company, fingers crossed it will sort the issues out.
That said, actually removing the master cylinder has proven tricky. The pushrod on the brake pedal is attached to the master cylinder and I can't figure out how it comes apart. Some research might give me the answer.
The master cylinder can be seen here:
Also, my dual booster setup can be seen over on the passenger side:
I'm hoping they won't need rebuilding.
So delays, problems and just generally a crappy night on the car. It's walking on thin ice, I'm not far off throwing it in the classifieds at the moment!
Tonight was a mixed bag really, but in all it's left me feeling rather fed up with the car and the project as a whole, but more on that later.
The car itself is looking so good, it sits really nicely, and although the heights need a bit of tinkering with, I'm happy for now.
The rear camber is laughable!
Got a fair amount of the interior done over the weekend just gone:
New rev counter, thanks to Jamie who dropped it off one morning, out of the blue
It might be childish, but I love that just the rev counter has a red needle
So onto the less happy stuff.
The drivers carpet is drenched, literally full of water. I'm gutted to say the least as I put a lot of time and effort getting the carpet looking nice, and I fear it may be damaged by the water. Hopefully I will be able to dry it out once the leak is fixed, which appears to be coming from the back of the heater box. A new seal should hopefully see things right.
As we know, the brakes are not working, due to a suspected master cylinder failure.
I have managed to source a rebuild kit from a local company, fingers crossed it will sort the issues out.
That said, actually removing the master cylinder has proven tricky. The pushrod on the brake pedal is attached to the master cylinder and I can't figure out how it comes apart. Some research might give me the answer.
The master cylinder can be seen here:
Also, my dual booster setup can be seen over on the passenger side:
I'm hoping they won't need rebuilding.
So delays, problems and just generally a crappy night on the car. It's walking on thin ice, I'm not far off throwing it in the classifieds at the moment!
With projects like this you always get frustrated towards the end, keep at it lad, you will regret it if you sell now.
Not only that, this is the only decent thread going on this section at present and if you stop I will have nothing to read!!!
Not only that, this is the only decent thread going on this section at present and if you stop I will have nothing to read!!!
A few people on the E21 forum have had a go at swapping over to a more modern and readily available system, but it seems to be harder than it sounds.
Fingers crossed the rebuild kit will sort the issues out. If not, I'll look at the brake boosters. If it's not the brake boosters, then I'm all out of ideas.
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Eddie, those lines look pretty damn old, and there seems to be perished rubber everywhere? Surely it's not just going to be the MC? Time to get some brake pipe, some connection fitting kits, some benders, and get handy
Have you considered speaking to f0xy? The lad's practically a boy genius so he may be able to help?
Have you considered speaking to f0xy? The lad's practically a boy genius so he may be able to help?
Believe it or not, the lines aren't as bad as they look in the pictures.
More than anything, they're filthy. None of the lines appear to be corroded, nor do the connections.
We think we might be able to hear a vacuum leak coming from one of the hoses that assist the boosters, we're not sure.
The various rubber fittings are all in decent enough condition, although yeah, some of them are close to 40 years old.
I'd love to start ripping it all out and rebuilding the entire engine bay, but it won't be ready for Trax if I start doing all that. I'll do that when the weather is a bit pap over winter.
More than anything, they're filthy. None of the lines appear to be corroded, nor do the connections.
We think we might be able to hear a vacuum leak coming from one of the hoses that assist the boosters, we're not sure.
The various rubber fittings are all in decent enough condition, although yeah, some of them are close to 40 years old.
I'd love to start ripping it all out and rebuilding the entire engine bay, but it won't be ready for Trax if I start doing all that. I'll do that when the weather is a bit pap over winter.
So, tonight I managed to remove the brake master cylinder and strip it down.
Circlip removed (it came off at about Mach 3 tbh, nearly took my eye out)
Pushrod removed:
First piston removed:
Second piston removed:
Rubber inlets and washers removed:
All stripped down and ready to be cleaned up and rebuilt:
Circlip removed (it came off at about Mach 3 tbh, nearly took my eye out)
Pushrod removed:
First piston removed:
Second piston removed:
Rubber inlets and washers removed:
All stripped down and ready to be cleaned up and rebuilt:
Christopher
ClioSport Club Member
Z4M
Decent progress! I'll pop round on Saturday if you're about?
Yeah, I'll be doing a fair few bits this weekend.
Let me know when you're leaving the gym and going home instead of coming round.
Keep at it mate, the night is darkest just before the dawn.
Is there a way to bubble test the suspected vac leaks with positive pressure?
Is there a way to bubble test the suspected vac leaks with positive pressure?
Who the F are you?
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Some muscle bound northern nutter iirc.
Nice work Eddie, keep at it.
Nice work Eddie, keep at it.
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