Satin black grill help

[Tomo_Rep.97]

spraying my grill satin black, I've sprayed several coats of plastic primer, it is ready to sand 1200 grit and then spray satin black, how do I go about protecting the satin black?

Has anyone used satin lacquer from Halfords? Most people say just use several coats of wax! Several coats of wax won't protect it as well as a lacquer against a flying stone! I'm a bit of a perfectionist with things so wouldn't really be keen on leaving it unprotected. So if anyone has done this in the past and protected in in a different way? Clear lacquer dust coat? I know there's probably thousands of threads asking this question but quite frankly I can't be bothered to search around for a while

 

[DannyR]

Satin black will be fine, just dust over it again when it gets too bad.

Bonnets and bumpers are lacquered and still get chipped

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Satin black will be fine, just dust over it again when it gets too bad.

Bonnets and bumpers are lacquered and still get chipped

That's true didn't think of that! My satin has gone really odd though,

Any idea what's going on here? Not my luck with paint today!

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Just looks awful! Why it's gone s**t for?

 

[Daniel]

I don't mean to sound rude, but wtf have you done??

I just wiped mine with alcohol (IPA) and sprayed 2 coats of satin black on it, came up like new! Lol.

 

[Gally]

I don't mean to sound rude, but wtf have you done??

I just wiped mine with alcohol (IPA) and sprayed 2 coats of satin black on it, came up like new! Lol.

Was just thinking that. Not even like it's textured to start with.

 

[Jekyll]

Looks like some sort of paint reaction.

 

[DannyR]

Did you spray it in the rain?!

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

I don't mean to sound rude, but wtf have you done??

I just wiped mine with alcohol (IPA) and sprayed 2 coats of satin black on it, came up like new! Lol.

I don't have a clue, it's not as if I'm a newbie at spraying either but I'm so f*****g p****d off though! Plastic primer, then several coats of satin black. Come out awful! Soooooo annoyed

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Looks like some sort of paint reaction.

That's what I thought but I've used the same brand of paint primer and satin!

Did you spray it in the rain?!

I sprayed it after it finished raining yes, I am not a happy bunny

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

It seems to be getting worse,

What on earth has happened

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Anyone any ideas? I used hycote paint as it was on offer on Amazon, could that be why? Cheap paint?

 

[DannyR]

You painted after it rained, too much moisture in the air.

Better off buying a new one and spraying it now, it's fucked. Unless you want to rub all the paint off.

 

[joytodrive25]

I just used halfords body shop primer and Renault pearl black then lacquer though lacquer is dubiously needed. Worked fine apart from being lazy and not sanding. So I guess just a weird paint+primer reaction. Not too expensive a problem at the end of day but all I can suggest is to clean off and start again. Sorry bud.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

You painted after it rained, too much moisture in the air.

Better off buying a new one and spraying it now, it's fucked. Unless you want to rub all the paint off.

Ah really? I thought this only applied with lacquer. I see thanks mate! I'll probably just wack some nitromors on it and try again. Didn't know that though, we'll see! Thanks mate. Was thinking of doing it gloss black as they satin doesnt have any shine at all to it, or is that likely to be because of the moisture made it look matt?

I just used halfords body shop primer and Renault pearl black then lacquer though lacquer is dubiously needed. Worked fine apart from being lazy and not sanding. So I guess just a weird paint+primer reaction. Not too expensive a problem at the end of day but all I can suggest is to clean off and start again. Sorry bud.

Apparently it's moisture mate, will give it another go tomorrow after work! Cheers

 

[DannyR]

Of course, why do you think sprayers use booths?

Nitromors will get into the plastic and you'll never be able to paint it.

Satin is hard to get right anyway, but you need a new Grille either way.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Of course, why do you think sprayers use booths?

Nitromors will get into the plastic and you'll never be able to paint it.

Satin is hard to get right anyway, but you need a new Grille either way.

Suppose you're right, oh great!

 

[Gus]

Suppose you're right, oh great!

Or sand the runs I can see in that last pic and then send it away for dipping.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Or sand the runs I can see in that last pic and then send it away for dipping.

yeah found the paint very runny even though i did light coats, how much would dipping cost me? i was thinking of sending it to sprayshack, but unaware of how much this would cost?

 

[Craigy88]

That's to much product applied to quickly mate, it's a solvent reaction.

No need to have applied primer, just a normal plastic adhesion promoter would of worked but failing getting that then one coat of primer then wait 10-15 mins, then apply the satin. Less is more to begin with. Should wait 10 mins inbetween coats aswell.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

That's to much product applied to quickly mate, it's a solvent reaction.

No need to have applied primer, just a normal plastic adhesion promoter would of worked but failing getting that then one coat of primer then wait 10-15 mins, then apply the satin. Less is more to begin with. Should wait 10 mins inbetween coats aswell.

So many people saying different things! Didn't have any plastic adhesion promoter so just used plastic primer! I left the primer an 1-2 hours to dry and then sprayed *light* coats of satin, leaving 15 minutes between coats! I did light dust coats so not sure it's too much product applied to quickly, I'm giving it another go though, I think @DannyR is right by saying its moisture. I shall wait for a nice dry day to do it!

 

[Craigy88]

Well listen to me as I'm a painter by trade lol.

It's not moisture mate, you can spray in your shed when it's raining and it won't do that it's rubbish.

Leaving it that long won't help mate, did you sand it down? Possibly broke through then that will cause a similar reaction.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Well listen to me as I'm a painter by trade lol.

It's not moisture mate, you can spray in your shed when it's raining and it won't do that it's rubbish.

Leaving it that long won't help mate, did you sand it down? Possibly broke through then that will cause a similar reaction.

Oh I do apologise! I've always said in the past it can be moisture as it doesn't clear up when you hair dryer it start after it turns white! But so many people have told me that it's moisture or something else, just don't know what to believe haha, get so many different opinions! Leaving the primer that long? So how come on the cans it says like leave 24 hours to dry? Is that bullshit for everything or does it depend on the situation?
I sanded the primer down yes, with 1200 grit? Is that too high? could that be an issue. Sorry what broke through? what do you suggest I do next time? Cheers bud, sorry for saying you were wrong

 

[DannyR]

Well listen to me as I'm a painter by trade lol.

It's not moisture mate, you can spray in your shed when it's raining and it won't do that it's rubbish.
.

It was sprayed outside after it rained, of course moisture will effect it.

 

[Craigy88]

It was sprayed outside after it rained, of course moisture will effect it.

So when it rains all day like today at work and I was spraying an E type in the oven, that draws in air from outside with the burner off means I had the same issue yeah? No mate, if you don't know what you're on about don't apply a comment. It's simple understanding of products.....

 

[Craigy88]

Oh I do apologise! I've always said in the past it can be moisture as it doesn't clear up when you hair dryer it start after it turns white! But so many people have told me that it's moisture or something else, just don't know what to believe haha, get so many different opinions! Leaving the primer that long? So how come on the cans it says like leave 24 hours to dry? Is that bullshit for everything or does it depend on the situation?
I sanded the primer down yes, with 1200 grit? Is that too high? could that be an issue. Sorry what broke through? what do you suggest I do next time? Cheers bud, sorry for saying you were wrong

That's ok mate, I thought you didn't rub it down so leaving it that long should be ok depending on how many coats you put on. I believe it to be solvent issue not moisture, moisture clouding is a thing but that's only when using old style paints that depend on air drying alone. Solvent is both air and heat so yours would be like a 1k type of deal, like nail varnish. When I say broke through I mean you rubbed through to the plastic so espousing the plastic again, the plastic is poreous so will suck in most things applied to it hence sinkage etc etc.

I would just try again on a new grill, key up the grill before hand? Did you do that? And then just one coat of primer, wait a while then 3 even coats of satin. Get a can that's direct satin so no need for clear coat.

 

[DannyR]

So when it rains all day like today at work and I was spraying an E type in the oven, that draws in air from outside with the burner off means I had the same issue yeah? No mate, if you don't know what you're on about don't apply a comment. It's simple understanding of products.....

Your in an oven you melt, of course moisture isn't going to effect it.

So if you'd of sprayed the E type outside just after it has rained you'd of had the same finish, right?

I'm guessing that you don't have a full understanding of ovens...

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

That's ok mate, I thought you didn't rub it down so leaving it that long should be ok depending on how many coats you put on. I believe it to be solvent issue not moisture, moisture clouding is a thing but that's only when using old style paints that depend on air drying alone. Solvent is both air and heat so yours would be like a 1k type of deal, like nail varnish. When I say broke through I mean you rubbed through to the plastic so espousing the plastic again, the plastic is poreous so will suck in most things applied to it hence sinkage etc etc.

I would just try again on a new grill, key up the grill before hand? Did you do that? And then just one coat of primer, wait a while then 3 even coats of satin. Get a can that's direct satin so no need for clear coat.

Firstly I cleaned it, then wet sand 240 grit everywhere, then plastic primed about 3 coats as the plastic was sucking some of the paint up, I found 3 coats found good even coverage. Left 2 hours. Rubbed down 1200 grit, dryed, then sprayed 4 coats of satin black. The paint seemed to sink into the plastic quite a lot! I left 10-15 minutes between coats.
I can't afford to get a new grill, I've taken all the paint off, I shall sand it 240 grit again, what do I different this time then? to avoid the reaction?
So you're saying that spraying outside in damp conditions wouldn't affect it? I'm going to do it when it's warmer but just for future reference. In tempted to use gloss black instead, satin didn't provide as much shine as I'd like, looked matt!
I'm just using hycote paint. Cheers

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Your in an oven you melt, of course moisture isn't going to effect it.

So if you'd of sprayed the E type outside just after it has rained you'd of had the same finish, right?

I'm guessing that you don't have a full understanding of ovens...

I thought this too, I'm quite confused right now

Judging by the finished product I don't think the damp air helped but there's definitely some kind of reaction. Both right

 

[Gus]

@Craigy88 - Need some advice if I may (sorry for posting on your thread Tomo)
Ive been constructing some garage shelves and painted the frame which is made of wood with grey gloss paint.
The paint has reacted and gone pimply like in the pics on most of the wood. What do i have to do to fix this. Im waiting for the gloss to harden more at the moment as the plan was to sand.

 

[DannyR]

I thought this too, I'm quite confused right now

Judging by the finished product I don't think the damp air helped but there's definitely some kind of reaction. Both right

Personally I don't think the primer was dry enough either after only two hours, but being outside with heavy humidity made it even worse.

 

[Craigy88]

Your in an oven you melt, of course moisture isn't going to effect it.

So if you'd of sprayed the E type outside just after it has rained you'd of had the same finish, right?

I'm guessing that you don't have a full understanding of ovens...

I would of had contaminants only, no moisture related issues/blooming if sprayed outside.

Honestly don't bother commenting I'm a trained professional, my life's work is painting cars so please understand that what I say is 99% true.

There are a million reasons why it would of done this but we wasn't there and just don't know. It's getting worse over time so that means as its drying out the solvent its milking out and becoming what you see.

The op had similar issues on a perfectly dry Dayan the sun and warm temps.

I say to cold and to much solvent being trapped still in either primer stage or satin stage.

But what do I know.....

 

[Craigy88]

Firstly I cleaned it, then wet sand 240 grit everywhere, then plastic primed about 3 coats as the plastic was sucking some of the paint up, I found 3 coats found good even coverage. Left 2 hours. Rubbed down 1200 grit, dryed, then sprayed 4 coats of satin black. The paint seemed to sink into the plastic quite a lot! I left 10-15 minutes between coats.
I can't afford to get a new grill, I've taken all the paint off, I shall sand it 240 grit again, what do I different this time then? to avoid the reaction?
So you're saying that spraying outside in damp conditions wouldn't affect it? I'm going to do it when it's warmer but just for future reference. In tempted to use gloss black instead, satin didn't provide as much shine as I'd like, looked matt!
I'm just using hycote paint. Cheers

240 is way to rough mate.
Finish in anything above 500-800....
Clean it down, warm it up a tad, one coat of primer. Wait until it's dry and looks Matt all over, like 10-15 mins and then just use a direct satin finish mate, 2-3 coats is plenty. All the same thickness.
Don't go gloss you won't be happy with the result trust me, a decent finish on satin will be pukka.

 

[Craigy88]

@Craigy88 - Need some advice if I may (sorry for posting on your thread Tomo)
Ive been constructing some garage shelves and painted the frame which is made of wood with grey gloss paint.
The paint has reacted and gone pimply like in the pics on most of the wood. What do i have to do to fix this. Im waiting for the gloss to harden more at the moment as the plan was to sand.

No worrys, wood always does this.... Just trapped air pockets in the wood. Only way to loose them is as you say just rub it down, break the bubbles as it were, release the air trapped and go again. In my experience depending on wood I have done, mainly running boards on rolls Royce/bentleys is 3 coats once dried and rubbing each coat down seals the wood. So 1 coat, dry it, rub it, repeat. Heat them up as that draws the air out but will make more pimples appear.

You can get wood sealer but obviously you've painted yours now. On other shelves try sealer then the gloss.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

@Craigy88 - Need some advice if I may (sorry for posting on your thread Tomo)
Ive been constructing some garage shelves and painted the frame which is made of wood with grey gloss paint.
The paint has reacted and gone pimply like in the pics on most of the wood. What do i have to do to fix this. Im waiting for the gloss to harden more at the moment as the plan was to sand.

No problem mate was the surface smooth before you painted it?

Personally I don't think the primer was dry enough either after only two hours, but being outside with heavy humidity made it even worse.

Tbh mate, I've always thought primer was meant to be left for 24 hours to dry before doing anything but I was told before I started spraying my grill that I shouldn't leave it 24 hours because it will harden and won't have the same adhesion compared to a 2 hour dry. In the past I've always left it 24 hours, but all these new paints there's so many different rules etc. I've never had a problem when leaving it 24 hours. I've only started having problems with paint when I haven't had a lot of time to wait and be patient for the paint to dry, I think this adds to the list of reasons! Very good point that, I think I will leave it 24 hours primed and then carry on like usual. I just rushed doing it last time.

It could be a reaction because the primer wasn't fully dry and the satin sunk back into the primer and reacted with this, when I was spraying the satin it did sink quite a lot into the plastic! Where as if it was 24 hours left to dry, the primer would be hardener to not allow the satin to 'sink' and mix with the primer.

It could also be that the primer had moisture in it after spraying and because of it not fully drying out for 24 hours, letting all the moisture evaporate then the satin has trapped in the moisture in and this is shown in the finish.

Either way I'm going to go back to my old technique of leaving 24 hours, I'd never had problems with that in the past so not sure why I changed. Just the advice I'd been given.

I appreciated both of your's advice and I've taken it on board, too a certain degree I think you're both correct. I certainly agree it's a reaction in the paint of some sort but then again i also agree I'm painting in a damp moisture heavy environment which won't help either way. I will respray this again after removing all the paint and preparing the surface for the primer. I will leave it 24 hours to dry, and I will spray in a warmer environment. I will post the results in here. Thank you both!

 

[Craigy88]

Go for it mate, if it worked before then should be fine.

The cold is not your friend and neither is rain obviously but for such a small part it wouldn't make a difference. Heat and patients mate.
If it fails again il do it for free if you send me it.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

240 is way to rough mate.
Finish in anything above 500-800....
Clean it down, warm it up a tad, one coat of primer. Wait until it's dry and looks Matt all over, like 10-15 mins and then just use a direct satin finish mate, 2-3 coats is plenty. All the same thickness.
Don't go gloss you won't be happy with the result trust me, a decent finish on satin will be pukka.

I've always finished in 400 grit before sanding but my brother who does a lot of painting at his work told me that was too high for primer. Only 15 minutes between primer and satin? Really?
I was tempted to go gloss because I wanted a slightly shiny finish like I thought satin had, but when it was dry I up it just looked Matt! See that grill looks really really good and does have a shiny tinge to it! I will think about it, but we will see how it goes.

 

[DannyR]

I would of had contaminants only, no moisture related issues/blooming if sprayed outside.

Honestly don't bother commenting I'm a trained professional, my life's work is painting cars so please understand that what I say is 99% true.

There are a million reasons why it would of done this but we wasn't there and just don't know. It's getting worse over time so that means as its drying out the solvent its milking out and becoming what you see.

The op had similar issues on a perfectly dry Dayan the sun and warm temps.

I say to cold and to much solvent being trapped still in either primer stage or satin stage.

But what do I know.....

Of course you'd of had moisture problems after it has rained?!
Are you a meteorologist too? This is one reason why you spray in an oven, so there is no moisture and a constant temperature, you are aware how condensation works right?

When did the OP say he sprayed it in the day/sun?

Of course there are many reasons, but I guessed he had sprayed it in the rain without him even saying when he had sprayed it. It's obvious the primer wouldn't of cured after two hours in those conditions too.

Heat treats it completely different, but you know this, I can usually sorry anything 30 minutes after being in direct sunlight.

 

[Tomo_Rep.97]

Go for it mate, if it worked before then should be fine.

The cold is not your friend and neither is rain obviously but for such a small part it wouldn't make a difference. Heat and patients mate.
If it fails again il do it for free if you send me it.

I refurbished my alloys, I left 24 hours after primer before I sprayed the black and they came out brilliant. It's in my project thread, had a few comments saying it's the best diy job they've seen. I must say they look pretty good, I think I will go back to my old technique and see how I go on with that! Oh really? Wow cheers mate

 

[DannyR]

I prepped, primed, sprayed and lacquered these within two hours.