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Saxo dreamers again



  172 Cup, V6 255, Williams


I hate posts like this. "He says that and he reckons that and hes pissed on that"........just let em be.

Youre as bad for visiting the site in the first place!
 
  Skoda Fabia vRS


he says he has 155 at the wheels, well a V6 has 200+ at the wheels, so thats a hell of a lot of difference still !
 


This bloke is off another planet! Well Ive got 500bhp at the wheels and I beat an F1 car yesterday. Them induction kits give you soom power boost!!!!!
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


Guys hate to p155 on your bonfire but if these car are fitted with a supercharger which is very easy they can push out over 220bhp at the fly. This is not unreasonable and combined with the light weight body this car could fly.

Having said that they are still sh1t.
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


Zidan why do you say that mate ? After all you can run alot more power through a 172 box and get away with it.
 


We are talkin about a car with a 1.6 8v engine pushing out 90bhp as standard! Strapping on a supercharger and more than doubling the power output is bound to put a massive strain on a gearbox that isnt designed for that sort of power. Saying that, I still find it hard to believe a 1.6 could produce 200bhp anyway even with a s/c.
 


Dont forget the clio super 1600 car. A 1.6 16v engine with alot of money spent on it putting out 220 bhp, and that is with the regulations restricting the size of the throttle body.

Although if the guy was clued up enough to do the engine mods required for that power, why on earth did he buy a saxo?
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


Zidan I suspect they probably use the same GBox in the VTS as the VTR which has got to be bullet proof. Come on 200bhp out of a 1.6 is very possible as black-cat said. Look at Nick Hills 1.8 16v turbo Clio that he could of run upto 400bhp.
 


Ok fair enough its possible but I still think the longevity of the engine a g/box will be dramatically reduced.
 


Hello look i have nothing against 172s, cup and the V6 but as it has already been said in this thread... a s/c makes a big difference to the Saxo.

Matts saxo has 200bhp+ AT THE WHEELS and is currently one of the most powerful Saxos about... fact.

It also happens to weigh about 900kg which is a good 400kg lighter than the V6 .... the facts speak for themselves... it will be a faster car.



Just as i will accespt there is some Reno 5 GTT somewhere that has over 300bhp and will be even quicker.



There is always something quicker out there.



BTW your right about the gearbox, MAtt blew his not long ago but the prob is sorted!
 
  clio 20v


sorry lads but a few of my mates have saxos and while i wouldnt buy 1 theyre not bad cars and theres nuthin in it between a vts and a valver

also there quite easily tuned as well unlike valvers and s/c works very well, saxos have been out a while and there poular theres bound to be some silly power figures ones going around

id prob be more believable of 200bhp if it was a vts though this is big money and at the end of the day a s/c or turbod 172 would kick its ass

we will hav to hope cap slarty rolls out his beast soon and goes saxo baiting
 
  CTR EK9 turbo


Just buy a fast car in the first place..... I bought a car for £11,400 with a full warranty, reasonable insurance etc etc and it was fast as standard. Why buy a slow car and try and make it as fast as something that will have cost a little bit more, but would be standard and probably have cheaper insurance (not modded). Loadsa people say that says that the saxo handles better than the 172, but if you put a turbo or supercharger into it, youl be dealing with loadsa understeer etc.

As Jeremy Clarkson once put it, if youre going to modify a car, start with a fast one in the first place......

Only my thoughts/opinions tho.

A friend of mine bought the same year (Y-reg) as mine, but a saxo vts, which incidently he paid more for. Hes been spending money on it to make it go faster and is infuriated that he still cant beat me, even when im 4-up - a classic case of should have bought something faster. I suppose its the free insurance etc.
 


Valver will still eck out a little lead over a VTS, especially in-gear and at motorway speeds - but the VTS is still a cracking motor. Just remember that you really have to rag the 16v to take full advantage.

VTS and VTR are only "more tuneable" than a 16v/Willy becuase the demand is there. I bet there are more properly tuned VTR/S than there are of the 16v/Willy in total;)
 


um....200bhp+ @ the wheels

i dont think so...from a charged 1.6 8v!! LMFAO!!

hmm.....i wonder if these people actually know anything....

thats like 270bhp+ at teh flywheel.....hmmmmmmmmmmm........NO
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


BenR you do make me laugh sometimes.

If a standard V6 Clio was making 200bhp at the wheels as has been posted then 200bhp out of a supercharged 1.6 8v is not impossible, But I suppose you are now going to tell us the S1600 clio making 220bhp is also B/S then ?
 
  BMW 320d Sport


hehe glad there are some people on here who arent out to just rubbish everyone elses ideas/claims. 200bhp on a blown 1.6 is not exactly rocket science...true it might be hard to get a consistent reliable 200 but if money and time are no problem then why not.

I detect people missing the point about modding a car here - Im no Saxo fan but if someone wants one and wants to mod it then thats their call - all power to them. It would be nice to live in a world where everyone could afford to pick up a 10 grand + car with group 15 insurance (or whatever it is for say a 172). But in the real world, there are a lot of under 25 drivers who cant afford to insure a car like that, nor walk into a dealership and buy one outright.

Why do you think Maxxing motors has got so big? Not that I agree with viper stripes and making a bloody slow car look fast by dressing it up, but there are a lot of young drivers in the position where theres not much else they can do. And if they want a fast car its down to buying a common sporty looking car fairly cheap and with lowish insurance, then doing the mods that work and not declaring to the insurance. Hence the Saxo scene. Its much easier to spend less on a car in the first place and slowly shell out a bit of money here and there to get it to go quicker. It makes financial sense for many people and I for one would rather spend £20 grand on buying an Escort Cossie and doing a load of mods, than the same money on a tatty second hand 911. Id rather buy a second hand Clio V6 in a few years, and spend time and money getting it as fast as an Evo, rather than just buy the Evo 9 (or whatever it will be by then!) Its not always about having the fastest car to start off with, its the getting there thats the fun bit, building on whatever you have...
 


BenR you do make me laugh sometimes.

If a standard V6 Clio was making 200bhp at the wheels as has been posted then 200bhp out of a supercharged 1.6 8v is not impossible, But I suppose you are now going to tell us the S1600 clio making 220bhp is also B/S then ?


ahhh.....BUT

losses account for much more than you think....so for a 1.6 8v to run 200hp @the wheels, it has to run well over 250bhp @ the fly......

ok, the 1.6 4a-ge motor can run 200+bhp @11,000rpm with the big port head and TBs.....but thats a whole different ball game!

the saxo engine would need to run silly boost to get almost 3x the std power!!! thats insane!

as for the S1600.......another different game. The max power potential of any engine is its total inlet valve area. so, a 16V has more than an 8v....and a rally 16V has more than a rd 16V....

and BTW, i was the one to rpovide the specs on the S1600 origianlly......so, yes, i KNOW it can run 220bhp.........the E.B.D 1.6 16V XE unit makes 246bhp!

all im saying is that to get a charged saxo to 250+bhp.......um, NO
 


Just to put it straight... the mailto:200@wheels">200@wheels is a VTS which i did say.

Using 23% trans loss = 259.74 @ fly. (divide by .77 not times by 1.23)



The most powerful vtR i know of is running 164 @ wheels

:)
 


Rudi, are u trying to tell us that u increased ur VTS which probably had about 92.4BHP at the flywheel when bought upto 200 with a supercharger - hum - u should maybe enter the junior WRC in that car except u wouldnt be allowed for fear of it blowing up and maybe the regulations! Are u sure ur cars totally reliable? A supercharger normally only increases power by 50/60% so maybe u could show us a printout and stats for the car etc.................fair play if u managed it though
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


BenR you just dont get it do you. If someone has got 200bhp at the wheels why do you doubt them. Just admit that on this occasion somebody else is right ! FACT !
 


RUDI:

Check out the thread on the Saxosports forum about a VTR versus a Clio V6. THis guy reckons he has tuned his VTR to 200 BHP. Loser.


thats where i got it from..i have not read the post and wont as i cant be arsed.

But, i divided by 0.73....so, were close enough......and we all know thats a rough estimate.

But the fact is......can a scharger push out that much, were talking about 25psi or there abouts roughly.

i just dont believe a saxo is pushing out close to 300bhp on a supercharger!

if it is, top job........but proof please......
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


BenR what is to say that he hasnt had work on other parts of the engine. You cant even be bothered to read the thread !
 


no, im no doubting it........well actually i am.....

only because of the cost involved......it must of cost about 5k for all parts and development. and 1 hr on a RR is 70 quid minimum alone....so, 10 test runs is esy to stack up....which is 700 quid alone..

BTW, why r u so ratty.......im having a logical discussion geez...

and i dont need to read it as RUDI has come on here to say that.....so, im talking to him about it.

i like to discuss things.....and to discuss properly, people ahve to be opposed otherwise itll just be 2 people agreeing on something.......and i wont know any better.

Dude, take a chill pill.

why r u picking on me so much lately anyways?
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


BenR I am fed up with people just dismissing things when they obviously havent got all the fact. :mad:

Point - There is a guy who spent 30K on a saxo 1.1 yes 30K and nothing was done to the engine. So why is it that this guy cant get 200bhp at the wheels with enough money.

If he is saying he has 200bhp at the wheel dont dismiss it straight away maybe he has taken the time to do some extensive work.

There are certain people on this board who make a mockery of you when you suggest things that do work when then think they dont, then when they are fronted up they go off into one.

This is a dicussion forum not a suggest something and then get a verbal slap for it board if I am wrong.



Quote Dude, take a chill pill. - It is not I that needs to take one of these my friend, maybe try taking a Well he might actually be right pill.



# RANT OVER #
 


HOLY COW!!!


now that was a RANT!

anyway, ok so its possible.............

but i was discussing it with the other dude..........I really dont think it was needed for you to go off on one, especially picking out me (for some reason you see fit) to vent this.

its has become common diet for saxo people to say stuff........i read the posts on here and deducted from what other were saying that it WAS BS......hence, me listning to OTHER PEOPLE on this board..

i didnt give anybody a verbal slap........i said it was it was almost impossible, and i ivited RUDI to prove me wrong....which i am more then happy to be.....so long as he shows me.

then this moves the topic on.....WHY SPEND 30K on a saxo.....you could have a f**kin ace car for that!

and if i were to tell you my MK1 XR2 from 1982 lapped faster than a porsche 964......would you belive me......oh, and if i added that as with the 100bhp engine......what would you thikn of the car when the 160bhp engine goes in? i mean, its only a 40 yr old design, 1.6 8V with pushrods and parallel valves and the combustion chamber in the cylinder......sounds pretty silly dont it.

But why the sudden defense of the saxo guys (no offence, im not saying their crap as i think the VS could be quite fast).......i mean, everybody else who posted here took the piss....in a much more harsh manner...i simply said why i didnt think so and how.....

chill out dude, we all on the same side..........its is a DISCUSSION forum after all....
 


i mean look at this off the SSC forum...

Was just mucking about with the 155, its running 8psi i THINK... Andy is the best person to reply to this cos it was his baby, ive only had it a matter of weeks now.

heres the spec:
GMC Supercharged conversion consisting of the following:
- Rotrex oil-cooled Supercharger running 8psi boost
- 5th fuel injector controlled by Dastek Boost controller - Reprogramable Dastec “piggyback” ECU
- Pace Aluminium Welded Construction Intercooler
- Pace Aluminium Welded Construction Radiator
- Aluminium Radiator Header Tank
- Kenlowe Cooling Fan Kit
- Mocal Oil Cooler kit
- 4-1 GMC Competion exhaust manifold,
- BTB/GMC Developed Custom Stainless Exhaust System
- K&N Filter Charger


200+bhp from that little amount of mods....and 8psi!!!

GTTs have to run about 23psi to get well over the 200bhp mark, and Ktecs is running 42psi to get 350bhp.........so........now its is sounding a little bit silly.....and highly expensive!
 
  Corsa 1.3 CDTI


BenR 30k on the Saxo is one thing I wouldnt do either, I would buy an import STi and have the other 4k for some modding of teh engine internals.

My theory is show me and prove me wrong !

The verbal slap wasnt referring to this particular post !

"But why the sudden defense of the saxo guys (no offence, im not saying their crap as i think the VS could be quite fast).......i mean, everybody else who posted here took the piss....in a much more harsh manner...i simply said why i didnt think so and how....."

This is because you said straight away this was not possible.

"chill out dude, we all on the same side..........its is a DISCUSSION forum after all...."

Point I made earlier - Dont dismiss until you have seen the facts.

I am on the same side as well, but GIVE people a bit more credit mate. You might be suprised.
 


haha!

capt...yeah, unfortunately hes away for the week.....lazing about somewhere with a beer........

and Chavy...if i did insult or come across as an ass on any other post, i do apologise.......i do NOT dislike anybody on these forums! i love the place.
 


Im having a laugh at this one ;)

I have to agree with BenR here, this guy says hes pushing mailto:200bhp@wheels">200bhp@wheels, that would be mailto:250bhp@fly">250bhp@fly or near enough.

That engine was a 90bhp engine, its now pushing nearly 3 times its power and no internals have been replaced, thats going to be one expensive rebuild if you ask me ;)

Those engines were not designed to take 200+bhp, simple as that, ive seen a golf gti (1.8 turbo) running 333bhp on standard internals, v quick and v smokey lol! The list there is for parts there of for the supercharger and breathing, nothing about brakes, nothing about uprated gearboxes or clutches, nothing about engine internals work..... it sounds good but wait until it blows up, the car will be worth less than the repairs it will need doing to it lol!



Tony
 


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