ST vs Audi S4?

[MarkCup]

So I'm out legally lapping a local section of DC trying to get my intake temps up when a B6 S4 joined in the fun.

Conclusion?

An upgraded intercooler is a waste of money unless you do trackdays, and the understeer in an S4 means it gives a massive amount away exiting tight 2nd gear turns.

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

I skipped a few bits, did he join you at the start of one end of your circuit or did he actually just decide to follow you round the A27 for a bit ?

 

[welshname]

I absolutely love how the speedo gets to 70 and stops even whilst you continue to accelerate and go through the gears.

 

[imprezaworks]

No idea, but got to love your vids.

 

[Jaff.]

You speedo needle on your telemetry bits seems to get a bit stuck towards the end...

 

[Feirny]

What's all the software you use for that?

 

[MarkCup]

I skipped a few bits, did he join you at the start of one end of your circuit or did he actually just decide to follow you round the A27 for a bit ?

At 2:55 I passed him then he looped around and followed me...both pulled into the Shell garage afterwards and had a chat, thoroughly nice bloke. Said his was decatted and had a Miltek exhaust. Claimed 370bhp but then he was giving my half a ton in return!

I absolutely love how the speedo gets to 70 and stops even whilst you continue to accelerate and go through the gears.

You speedo needle on your telemetry bits seems to get a bit stuck towards the end...

Datalogging is subject to variables. I am in full CS compliance.

What's all the software you use for that?

Android app Torque to log, Serif MoviePlus to edit, RaceRender to overlay the gauges and data.

 

[Alex5]

lol @ the needle stopping depsite accelerating. I don't fully understand what you are doing in this video

 

[Poopensharten]

lol @ the needle stopping depsite accelerating. I don't fully understand what you are doing in this video

+1

 

[MarkCup]

I was trying to see if I could get the intake temperatures to a point where the car starts holding back to see if there's any benefit to be had from an upgraded intercooler during normal road use.

Conclusion is it's pointless.

 

[JD]

339 standard so doubt 355+. And as you say, much heavier. Dads was great but not the quickest of cars. The ST does sound good. Did I read you'd placed the mic by your intake, hence the increased noise?

 

[craigy2703]

All I know is you car sounds great is it mountuned?

 

[imprezaworks]

Yep

 

[MarkCup]

339 standard so doubt 355+. And as you say, much heavier. Dads was great but not the quickest of cars. The ST does sound good. Did I read you'd placed the mic by your intake, hence the increased noise?

A little cheating in my part here, two audio sources on the clip, one from in the cabin, the other from beneath the bonnet.

I mixed the two a little too heavy on the side of the engine bay one so it's all a bit too much ptshhhh.

 

[leeds_182]

S4 sounded mint!

 

[MaLicE]

Agreed the s4 won't be over 350... Can't say mine suffered with under steer tbh it oversteered easy...

 

[Adey.]

and sounded epic

 

[MarkCup]

S4 sounded mint!

and sounded epic

It did indeed! I could almost feel it as it went by! Was the first thing I said as I walked over afterwards.

 

[Flat Eric]

Both cars sound great!
I'm trying to talk my mate into mountuning his but he is reluctant

 

[Knuckles]

Not helping my want/need for an s4.

Da noiz of the thing!

 

[Steven103]

The S4 was later on the power out of every corner, and was gaining by the end of every straight.

Only on CS is there a thread about which is faster in a straight line...

 

[Knuckles]

The S4 was later on the power out of every corner, and was gaining by the end of every straight.

Only on CS is there a thread about which is faster in a straight line...

You've obviously never set eyes on vxro.

If this was said forum. The s4 driver would've been crying in ops rear view while the op was effortlessly pulling away.

Then the following 6-12 pages will be everyone comparing stage 11 vxrs to Lamborghinis

 

[Flat Eric]

Lol at stage 11! True story!

 

[MarkCup]

The S4 was later on the power out of every corner, and was gaining by the end of every straight.

Only on CS is there a thread about which is faster in a straight line...

Only on CS would someone disregard a cars ability to get traction as being relevant when comparing two cars!

Did you not notice me coming off the throttle half way along each straight? Did you notice what happened when I didn't?

Fcuk it, I'd better go stage 11 as well.

 

[Scrooge]

I thought there'd be much more difference between the two.

 

[_Tom]

Malice said his was easily quicker than a E46 M3..

 

[Steven103]

Only on CS would someone disregard a cars ability to get traction as being relevant when comparing two cars!

Did you not notice me coming off the throttle half way along each straight? Did you notice what happened when I didn't?

Fcuk it, I'd better go stage 11 as well.

FLOL @ TRACTION!!!



And which car or indeed setup do you think has more traction? With any luck this could be as entertaining as the M3 thread.

For someone who seems to know their way around a track day I'm perplexed at your routine inability to distinguish vehicle performance with simple track driving notions. Two identical cars, two identical drivers and the lead car will always "gap" the following car in every acceleration zone.

It's just speed = distance over time. As velocity increases, for a constant time gap the distance will also increase.

 

[Detail Chris]

Yeah Mark he told you

 

[Knuckles]

Schooled.

 

[Steven103]

P.S.

Love the Molten (?) Orange,
Love the seats (I think it's the shoulder support that really sets the ST seats apart),
Very satisfying surge from low RPM in any gear,
Love the balance of price, performance & warranty of the Mountune pack,
Definitely a far superior all-rounder than a 1*2,
Torque vectoring (by individual brake effort I gather?) sounds brilliant for "in da twisties" etc.
It might even have been your own "stolen & recovered" video (apologies if that was a different member) that made me buy an RS,
No my 182 is not faster in a line, nor equal, to a ST.


For the inevitable misquotes: Yes an S4 is faster, but visually the difference in performance usually looks much closer than numbers suggest. What's that pub fact about the Veyron SS? Something like "600 BHP to do the first 200 MPH and then another 600 BHP to do the next 50 MPH." That's down to drag (squaring with speed) but the point is numbers can be very misleading.

 

[MarkCup]

FLOL @ TRACTION!!!



And which car or indeed setup do you think has more traction? With any luck this could be as entertaining as the M3 thread.

For someone who seems to know their way around a track day I'm perplexed at your routine inability to distinguish vehicle performance with simple track driving notions. Two identical cars, two identical drivers and the lead car will always "gap" the following car in every acceleration zone.

It's just speed = distance over time. As velocity increases, for a constant time gap the distance will also increase.

OK, I concede, lack of traction was not the most accurate way of describing a car's inability to get its power down due to taking so long to get turned in and back on the power from weighing half a ton more. Is that better?

 

[Steven103]

Fair enough, implying that you thought hatch-width tyres & FWD offered superior traction over barge-width tyres & Quattro was equally "trolling" of me. Back to the matter:


I presume you watched the F1? Think about those onboard heli shots that look directly down as two cars follow each other out of turn 2/3 and along the straight.

Even though a Merc is much (by real world standards) quicker in a straight line, a Redbull will still appear to pull away and increase the gap from 1 to 10 car lengths out of a slow corner along a straight. Before the Merc starts to visibly decrease the distance between the two cars it first has to overcome the effect of increasing distance (due to being on the throttle later) associated with increasing velocity and a constant time gap. (The constant time gap comes from the cars being, say, 0.1 second apart at the corner exit).

As has possibly been mentioned there are loads of other things that could have been in your favour. You also have a decent idea of how to drive & I'm sure have a lot of confidence in the car's ability. Non "car people" seem to do an array of bizarre things, e.g. shifting 3k before the redline even when driving quickly. Then there's that "S4s only make 12 BHP due to carbon build up" thing. To a lesser degree with Quattro and I imagine DSG there's also tyre quality, gear shift times etc.

 

[benhwolves]

Was the S4 driver impressed with ST when you spoke to him?

 

[Lal B3N]

S4 sounded class!

Video is cool with the gauges logged over it.

Could do with logging the intake temps on my Astra.

 

[chriscummins7]

Fair enough, implying that you thought hatch-width tyres & FWD offered superior traction over barge-width tyres & Quattro was equally "trolling" of me. Back to the matter:


I presume you watched the F1? Think about those onboard heli shots that look directly down as two cars follow each other out of turn 2/3 and along the straight.

Even though a Merc is much (by real world standards) quicker in a straight line, a Redbull will still appear to pull away and increase the gap from 1 to 10 car lengths out of a slow corner along a straight. Before the Merc starts to visibly decrease the distance between the two cars it first has to overcome the effect of increasing distance (due to being on the throttle later) associated with increasing velocity and a constant time gap. (The constant time gap comes from the cars being, say, 0.1 second apart at the corner exit).

As has possibly been mentioned there are loads of other things that could have been in your favour. You also have a decent idea of how to drive & I'm sure have a lot of confidence in the car's ability. Non "car people" seem to do an array of bizarre things, e.g. shifting 3k before the redline even when driving quickly. Then there's that "S4s only make 12 BHP due to carbon build up" thing. To a lesser degree with Quattro and I imagine DSG there's also tyre quality, gear shift times etc.

You've really gone off on a tangent there man. Makes a lot of sense what you're saying but massively irrelevant because I didn't see Mark claiming his car was faster etc, just that the S4 struggled slightly coming off be roundabout (which on the video it clearly does).

Back on topic, how bizarre that he just decided to follow you on your loop. Cool that he came for a chin wag though! Both awesome cars.

 

[Ray Gin]

*off to PH to look at S4s*

 

[_Tom]

The S4 would have been playing. Simple.

My TT apparently understeers you in to any ditch if you believe the internet. In reality I pushed a "245" bhp Fiesta ST round a roundabout and passed with relative ease. I have no doubt a S4 would do the same to me tbh.

 

[Lal B3N]

The S4 would have been playing. Simple.

My TT apparently understeers you in to any ditch if you believe the internet. In reality I pushed a "245" bhp Fiesta ST round a roundabout and passed with relative ease. I have no doubt a S4 would do the same to me tbh.

lol! Same with my Astra, lost count the number of times I've needed pulled out of a ditch.

 

[MarkCup]

The S4 would have been playing. Simple.

My TT apparently understeers you in to any ditch if you believe the internet. In reality I pushed a "245" bhp Fiesta ST round a roundabout and passed with relative ease. I have no doubt a S4 would do the same to me tbh.

That's all well and good were it not for the fact that the owner confirmed to me he absolutely wasn't playing with me at all.

Think about it...his power to weight is only circa 10% higher than mine, he couldn't get it turned in (I'm not saying you or anyone else couldn't or wouldn't), he couldn't exploit his mahoosive power advantage as we weren't at license loosing speeds.

Regardless, it was a bit of unplanned fun...it sounded fantastic, and he was a nice bloke to talk to.

 

[_Tom]

That's all well and good were it not for the fact that the owner confirmed to me he absolutely wasn't playing with me at all.

Think about it...his power to weight is only circa 10% higher than mine, he couldn't get it turned in (I'm not saying you or anyone else couldn't or wouldn't), he couldn't exploit his mahoosive power advantage as we weren't at license loosing speeds.

Regardless, it was a bit of unplanned fun...it sounded fantastic, and he was a nice bloke to talk to.

Ok, fair enough.