Talk me through 197's

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

Managed to get myself a pretty good job and have started earning a decent amount of money so am considering saving up my monies and upgrading the motor.

It looks like i might be able to get enough money together for a 197, i've had a trawl through auto trader but it's a bit of an abyss.

What im looking to know is the different model types, ive got my head around the F1s (which are lovely!) but what are the others?
http://www2.autotrader.co.uk/classi.../keywords/197_f1/page/1/radius/1501?logcode=p
I love this one.

But some are called Cups, and some have (i quote) 'fruity' exhausts (which is just two pipes either side of the bumper from what i've seen)

http://www2.autotrader.co.uk/classi...0lr/keywords/197/page/4/radius/1501?logcode=p
So what is that then?!

I'd love to have Recaro seats as i've always wanted them for the 182 so that's the only thing i'm really using as guidance at the moment but i'd really appreciate a run down of the different models/specs/extras etc.

Cheers,

Tim

Edit: Also, is the belts being changed on these as vital as it is on the Mk2s? Because there's no mention of it in the Ads but i can only assume they'll need it doing.

... · Apr 10, 2012

we were looking at 197's alot recently before buying what we have , from what i can see

F1's have the cup pack plus recaro's

then you have the normal 197 which has the normal sport seats but may have had the cup pack fitted

then normal without cup pack ,

then a cup

cups have no aircon and black door handles (although you could spec aircon as an option ) the non cup cars can have a cup pack fitted but have silver door handles .

the exhaust are all one either side of the rear defuser , on a 197 if they poke through and are silver then its usually an aftermarket exhaust ,however you could get tail pieces from renault to extend the pipes through (so again beware)

before going to see a car where you can't see a picture of the recaro's also ask if they have a seperate headrest ,as alot of dealers say recaro type seats when they are just the normal seats

Chris205 · Apr 10, 2012

I'd maybe look into a 200 aswell, they seem to be coming down in price and look a lot newer

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

So there is:

A normal 197, no cup packs.

A normal 197 with Cup Packs,

Then there is a 197 Cup,

Then there is a 197 F1 which is a normal 197 + Cup Pack + Recaros?

Thank you very much for your help I think i'm nearly there.

Can i get a Non-F1 with Recaro seats?

What is included in the cup pack?

Is it similar to 182s where its not worth bothering with one that doesn't have cup packs?

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

You mean like these?

http://www2.autotrader.co.uk/classi...0lr/keywords/200/page/4/radius/1501?logcode=p

Thats a bit more than i wanted to spend unfortunately but i'll see how well my money raising goes.

JayR · Apr 10, 2012

I would buy a late one with all the goodies or an R27.

Recaros, cup chassis, Speedlines are probably the must haves.

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

Does R27 = Megane?
Don't like the look of meganes.

When did they do the 197s until, 2008?

Christopher · Apr 10, 2012

I'd just go for either an R27 or a Cup Chassis 200 with Recaros.

Sir_Dave · Apr 10, 2012

Bear in mind that only the very late R27's (i think) had the longer ratio gearbox, whereas all the 197 cup's did.

Recaros are a must, the interior is rather drab and these really help liven it up a bit. They are also epically comfy.

Tiababy · Apr 10, 2012

R27 is the F1
Recaros can be specced to any 197.
The earlier 197s pre cup won't have cup packs specced as you couldn't spec these until after the later release of the cup.
also around mid 2008 the gearboxes changed which gave slightly longer ratios in the gears.
They did 197s till late 2009 I think there are a few late regs but the design to 200 came about during the 59 plates as far as I'm aware.

If I'm honest test drive one with recaros and one without as that way you get an idea if they are worth the extra for. The standard seats are very comfy and you can always retrofit recaros later.

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

Thanks for all the help, i like the sound of the longer range gear box so i'll definitely keep an eye out for that and i'm really thinking that Recaros are a necessity.

Let me just get this straight, ALL 197 Cups have the longer range gearbox and only the later Normal 197s had the longer range gearbox?

Sir_Dave · Apr 10, 2012

Tim-182 said:
Let me just get this straight, ALL 197 Cups have the longer range gearbox and only the later Normal 197s had the longer range gearbox?

Thats correct. Longer ratio box was introduced with the 197 Cup

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

And how necessary/useful is the longer ratio box? I can imagine it is very for me because i spend a lot of time on motorways

VXR killer · Apr 10, 2012

but you may get earlier models with the longer ratios due to alot of customers complaining of the high revving on motorways etc and renault replaved them with the revised box which came out late 2007, or peoples gearboxs that went bang were replaced with the later box. you should be able to tell which box it is while driving it.

Gaz_ · Apr 10, 2012

Longer ratio box aint all that imo I've had both, an early 2006 197, and now have a 197 Cup. It probably helps 1/2 mpg if lucky imo

Pretty much everything has been covered, Cup packs are noticeable with red calipers and anthracite alloys, the Cup chassis came in mid 2007, so any 06/56 cars running red calipers have been painted.....

D4VPC · Apr 10, 2012

Just a note to say as nice as the recaros are the fabric is very very poor. Mine at 37k was on its 3rd drivers seat, and within 5k was showing signs of wear despite sliding the seat all the way back everytime I got out the car.

Gaz_ · Apr 10, 2012

Depends how you're built imo. I'm 5 stone wet and dont have any issues, now on 37k! Maybe it was a skinny guy who tested them originally....

Knuckles · Apr 10, 2012

Sir_Dave said:
Bear in mind that only the very late R27's (i think) had the longer ratio gearbox, whereas all the 197 cup's did.

Recaros are a must, the interior is rather drab and these really help liven it up a bit. They are also epically comfy.

57 plates got them I believe... As mine is just above 3.5k at 70mph and I think the old boxes they were 4krpm weren't they?

Op, think of it how I learned

197 cup - cheap with no toys
197 - standard car with toys
197 'ff' - standard car + cup chassis and suspension... Therefore the one to get
197 f1 team r27 - ff version with recaros as standard. The r27 was the first 197 to feature the cup chassis and was the only one available with LY paint. Think of this like the 182 trophy. Get one of these with xenons, cornering lights and climate control and you're laughing

Knuckles · Apr 10, 2012

D4VPC said:
Just a note to say as nice as the recaros are the fabric is very very poor. Mine at 37k was on its 3rd drivers seat, and within 5k was showing signs of wear despite sliding the seat all the way back everytime I got out the car.

Ive learned to 'jump' in over the bolster

Pacman. · Apr 10, 2012

Oh and they are incredibly thirsty for their engine size and weight!!! I wouldn't use it for a daily commute car. I only drive mine now and then when its back in Germany as I have the shite box Megane with tax free fuel and no car tax to pay to drive to work.

JayR · Apr 10, 2012

I had my recaros in the 197 for two years and there was never any sign of ware.

I have gone for the leathers in the 200 though which suit me better for the type of driving I'm doing.

They are as supportive as the recaros but more comfortable at the same time.

Just don't look quite as good. lol

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

I really really can't wait to (hopefully) get my hands on one!
Im pretty set on getting an F1 as they just have that little special touch which I really like, but I think a FF one would be a brilliant car as well so I suppose I'll just have to see what's around when the time comes.

In terms of fuel economy, are we talking better or worse than a 182?

Tim-182 · Apr 10, 2012

Also, I'm yet to have any response to my question about the belts? When are they changed etc.

Knuckles · Apr 10, 2012

Get over on 197.net for more help

there's a great buyers guide and cars for sale often.

Belts are 5 years or 42k for aux belt iirc and 72k for cambelt

Mpg... I'm getting low 30's doing mainly motorway driving at 70... If you do 50 for a while it'll go up to 43 lol

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

Yeah I'll head over there and have a look. that sounds pretty similar to the 182, does about 33mpg at 70.

Knuckles · Apr 11, 2012

something must be wrong there then lol!

general rule of thumb with these (although i never owned a 182 so cant compare) is to take 10 mpg off your 182 mpg and thats what your 197 mpg will be lol

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

Did a proper test of fuel consumption at 70mph today, over about 15 miles it averaged 38mpg i was astounded!

lemonnobby · Apr 11, 2012

197 is worse renault sport for mpg
belts are 5 years or 72k and that's cambelt and aux belt

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

Now for my most important question: How much should I be looking to spend?

Would I be optimistic to think I can get a good condition F1 for under £7000?

Because this tells me otherwise: http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?635469-clio-197-f1-£7995ono

But from what I can see that is about £1000 more than it should be.
http://www2.autotrader.co.uk/classi.../keywords/197_f1/page/1/radius/1501?logcode=p
It's done 18k more than this one, I can't see the £1000 difference for (as far as I can tell) two identical (ish) cars!

And If i was to find a FF with Recaros, with similar sort of mileage etc. how much less would that be than an F1?

And fundamentally, is an F1 really worth it?

mattg · Apr 11, 2012

I'd say an F1 is worth it mate, bearing in mind they have the recaros as standard whereas would be an extra on an FF, which you may pay more for. If you want recaros then IMO the F1 is better value. (Am slightly biased though!)Between £7k-£8k is about right i'd say. That UR on cs has new tires and coilies on it which is why its slightly more than other F1s. Bear in mind that even F1s have differing specs as well with things like cornering lights etc. The UR on autotrader could be a standard spec but on the other hand could also be a keen price. I'd be wary that they've avoided showing a picture of the drivers bolster though which is where the most wear occurs!

Knuckles · Apr 11, 2012

r27s seem to go for between £7k and about £8k as above. look out for xenons with cornering lights (look for the washer jets) and climate control (the screen on the centre console)

make sure the bolsters are unworn and if they look the car over before you take it, ask them to check the brake pins arent seized

im technically not biased towards r27s as i did a lot of research before i got one and can definately say these are the ones to get

r27>197

trophy>182

172cup>172

Steve · Apr 11, 2012

Buy the latest lowest mile full history car you can find.
Condition is everything; you can't polish a turd

I had the Cup with ac, speedlines & recaros in glacier white.
Good car & I used to give it death

200's are nearing 8k so I would save for another month & get one.

Christopher · Apr 11, 2012

Agreed.

An early Cup chassis 200 > any 197.

Cue the 197 owners disagreeing.

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

Cheers for the responses!

http://www2.autotrader.co.uk/classi...0lr/keywords/200/page/4/radius/1501?logcode=p

That would be about 6 weeks/2 months hard saving extra over that £7000 F1. Must be worth it surely?! It's gorgeous!

Christopher · Apr 11, 2012

That's what I decided to do rather than buy a 197 or R27. I did want a new one though, so that helped.

With late 197's and early 200's being so close in price, you'd be silly not to get the 200. IMO.

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

I think the only thing that'll result in a 197 will be my desparation and not wanting to wait and save for a 200.

JayR · Apr 11, 2012

Having owned a late spec'd 197 and now 200 I can say they are very similar spec for spec!

I personally prefer the looks of the 200 and the noise it makes when you push the go pedal seems a tad better but a well spec'd 197 or R27 is by no means a poor car.

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

I think the idea was that if I save for an extra 2 months I can get a car that's 2 years newer, thus pushing back when i need to get belts changed etc.

Tim-182 · Apr 11, 2012

Oh no, look what i just found...
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...keywords/type-r/radius/1501/page/20?logcode=p

Please try and talk me out of it.

not normal dan · Apr 11, 2012

Tim-182 said:
Oh no, look what i just found...
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...keywords/type-r/radius/1501/page/20?logcode=p

Please try and talk me out of it.

Bit on the cheap side for one of them?

There good cars but most the reviews reckon there not as good as the old EP3 type R's. Plus I feel honda's lack personality, maybe its just my opinion but I went to swap my old ph2 172 for an EP3 type R annerversary. Don't get me wrong the build quality was good but it just felt like it had nothing on it an just dead basic an the noise it made when I shut the doors was horrid haha. I then drove a 197 there an thought this is fun, brembos are awesome an it felt so attached to the road so I brought that.