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Daz.
ClioSport Club Member
Clio 200 RS EDC
2 live! I'm suprised by your lack of compassion for newer clios!
I loved my williams LOVED LOVED LOVED LOVED it, but even you have to admit they're getting on now - The thing with the willy was you had to nurture it, I don't mean drive it like a pussy but it was like the crafty kid that used to flick paint at your back in school - you always had to keep your eye on it for being naughty...
I sold it not because I didn't want it but because I needed to financially and to secure my future (as ghey as that sounds).. without the need for violence(!) I do believe your a few years older (and wiser
) than my 28 years, I'd wager you've been there done that with plenty of cars, have the house, mortgage and are content with what you have, this is exactly the kind of guy a willy owner needs to, you forget that the average age of new 172/182 drivers won't have even been in secondarty school w**king over cars when the willy was first around...a 100% standard williams (i reiterate 100% standard williams) is as quick as a ph1 172 std for std for me. I don't care what people say but 99.9999% of willys are modded in some small way (spare out, stainless exhaust, I took the carbon cannister off yada yada yada)
Theres way too few good willy's to compare against, I'm also reffering to straight line pace here it's too much of a pain in the arse to compare corner abilities in cars more than ten years old - it becomes based on the example used at the time..
Better poised, yes I'll give that to the willy, the mk2's have a tendency to hop and take a split second longer that the willy to adjust - I'd say thats weight plus suspension alterations, I've never driven a trophy but all the other I have, and the willy was superior, the 182 cup pack was heading the right way to fixing it though on my drives in them, I'd say firming up the suspension further would help - my 172 is much happier over bumps on a normal drive though...
more economical? not a chance! I can't believe how good the f4r is on fuel in std trim, the willy was better when semi stripped but we're taking std for std here..
larger boot? yes easily, BUT! fold the seats down in the 172 and you can fit more in than a williams - I found this usefull personally - plus (gay alert) the carpeted backed rear seats win! how many times have you scratched the black paint on the back of the willy seats (c'mon honestly!
)Just as reliable - yes BUT! (again) they're not new cars, you can't judge them on the make/model anymore but more with the example you have - I'd rather run an f7r than an f4r anyday (I just don't think the f4r's are as reliable but thats just me) but I'd want the electrics from the mk2's, the build quality of the mk2 and the abs of the mk2 (mk1 abs = fail!).
Reliability is down to the previous owner - I'd wager a 14 owner 172 would be less reliable that a 2 owner williams mileage for mileage - people who sell a 30k 172 cannot expect an easy ride when buying a 120k willy 1, at that mileage I'd be ~(and have done!) changing all shocks, springs, subframe, bushes, steering components, tracking done, engine mounts - the list goes on - this is where people fall down - they expect a high mileage willy to mesmorise them over their old 172 just as they're read in they're magazines - how!!?!
handles better? - in my experience yes it does.
more driver feeling? that depends on the driver - I would never myself turn round and say this has a better feel than this, well I would but I'd also expect everyone else to give totally different views..
I FEEL happier driving the 172 at the end of the day - I feel happier that nothings broken, I feel happier I don't stand out as much, I feel happier parking the car, I feel happier when its raining, I feel happier when I pick my family and kids up in it - I feel the same about the leaking boot (lol).
I think my point is I still want a willy, will always want one again but I don't miss its issues, its age, its expense, its candle sticks in the dark, when your using it as intended its fabulous but my 172 makes me feel better more of the time and is 90% as good as the williams was when really going for it - this for me makes the 172 a better car.
But I will always let people know I've owned a williams before I mention the 172.
S3, Polo
For me: Mk2 Ph1.
Nice driving in that video BTW 2 live - Though can't believe your mate was happy with you banging off the limiter every 30s!!
Oh, and that Elise driver can't drive for sh!t - hugely inconsiderate too! The S1 118bhp Elise might not be as fast as a Williams, but if his lines had been better through most of those corners he *should* have been out of your way!
Nice driving in that video BTW 2 live - Though can't believe your mate was happy with you banging off the limiter every 30s!!
Oh, and that Elise driver can't drive for sh!t - hugely inconsiderate too! The S1 118bhp Elise might not be as fast as a Williams, but if his lines had been better through most of those corners he *should* have been out of your way!
Golf GTD Mk7
2 live! I'm suprised by your lack of compassion for newer clios!
I loved my williams LOVED LOVED LOVED LOVED it, but even you have to admit they're getting on now - The thing with the willy was you had to nurture it, I don't mean drive it like a pussy but it was like the crafty kid that used to flick paint at your back in school - you always had to keep your eye on it for being naughty...
I sold it not because I didn't want it but because I needed to financially and to secure my future (as ghey as that sounds).. without the need for violence(!) I do believe your a few years older (and wiser
a 100% standard williams (i reiterate 100% standard williams) is as quick as a ph1 172 std for std for me. I don't care what people say but 99.9999% of willys are modded in some small way (spare out, stainless exhaust, I took the carbon cannister off yada yada yada)
Theres way too few good willy's to compare against, I'm also reffering to straight line pace here it's too much of a pain in the arse to compare corner abilities in cars more than ten years old - it becomes based on the example used at the time..
Better poised, yes I'll give that to the willy, the mk2's have a tendency to hop and take a split second longer that the willy to adjust - I'd say thats weight plus suspension alterations, I've never driven a trophy but all the other I have, and the willy was superior, the 182 cup pack was heading the right way to fixing it though on my drives in them, I'd say firming up the suspension further would help - my 172 is much happier over bumps on a normal drive though...
more economical? not a chance! I can't believe how good the f4r is on fuel in std trim, the willy was better when semi stripped but we're taking std for std here..
larger boot? yes easily, BUT! fold the seats down in the 172 and you can fit more in than a williams - I found this usefull personally - plus (gay alert) the carpeted backed rear seats win! how many times have you scratched the black paint on the back of the willy seats (c'mon honestly!
Just as reliable - yes BUT! (again) they're not new cars, you can't judge them on the make/model anymore but more with the example you have - I'd rather run an f7r than an f4r anyday (I just don't think the f4r's are as reliable but thats just me) but I'd want the electrics from the mk2's, the build quality of the mk2 and the abs of the mk2 (mk1 abs = fail!).
Reliability is down to the previous owner - I'd wager a 14 owner 172 would be less reliable that a 2 owner williams mileage for mileage - people who sell a 30k 172 cannot expect an easy ride when buying a 120k willy 1, at that mileage I'd be ~(and have done!) changing all shocks, springs, subframe, bushes, steering components, tracking done, engine mounts - the list goes on - this is where people fall down - they expect a high mileage willy to mesmorise them over their old 172 just as they're read in they're magazines - how!!?!
handles better? - in my experience yes it does.
more driver feeling? that depends on the driver - I would never myself turn round and say this has a better feel than this, well I would but I'd also expect everyone else to give totally different views..
I FEEL happier driving the 172 at the end of the day - I feel happier that nothings broken, I feel happier I don't stand out as much, I feel happier parking the car, I feel happier when its raining, I feel happier when I pick my family and kids up in it - I feel the same about the leaking boot (lol).
I think my point is I still want a willy, will always want one again but I don't miss its issues, its age, its expense, its candle sticks in the dark, when your using it as intended its fabulous but my 172 makes me feel better more of the time and is 90% as good as the williams was when really going for it - this for me makes the 172 a better car.
But I will always let people know I've owned a williams before I mention the 172.
christ, that was a lot to read. Nicely summed up mate :approve:
2 live! I'm suprised by your lack of compassion for newer clios!
I loved my williams LOVED LOVED LOVED LOVED it, but even you have to admit they're getting on now - The thing with the willy was you had to nurture it, I don't mean drive it like a pussy but it was like the crafty kid that used to flick paint at your back in school - you always had to keep your eye on it for being naughty...
I sold it not because I didn't want it but because I needed to financially and to secure my future (as ghey as that sounds).. without the need for violence(!) I do believe your a few years older (and wiser
a 100% standard williams (i reiterate 100% standard williams) is as quick as a ph1 172 std for std for me. I don't care what people say but 99.9999% of willys are modded in some small way (spare out, stainless exhaust, I took the carbon cannister off yada yada yada)
Theres way too few good willy's to compare against, I'm also reffering to straight line pace here it's too much of a pain in the arse to compare corner abilities in cars more than ten years old - it becomes based on the example used at the time..
Better poised, yes I'll give that to the willy, the mk2's have a tendency to hop and take a split second longer that the willy to adjust - I'd say thats weight plus suspension alterations, I've never driven a trophy but all the other I have, and the willy was superior, the 182 cup pack was heading the right way to fixing it though on my drives in them, I'd say firming up the suspension further would help - my 172 is much happier over bumps on a normal drive though...
more economical? not a chance! I can't believe how good the f4r is on fuel in std trim, the willy was better when semi stripped but we're taking std for std here..
larger boot? yes easily, BUT! fold the seats down in the 172 and you can fit more in than a williams - I found this usefull personally - plus (gay alert) the carpeted backed rear seats win! how many times have you scratched the black paint on the back of the willy seats (c'mon honestly!
Just as reliable - yes BUT! (again) they're not new cars, you can't judge them on the make/model anymore but more with the example you have - I'd rather run an f7r than an f4r anyday (I just don't think the f4r's are as reliable but thats just me) but I'd want the electrics from the mk2's, the build quality of the mk2 and the abs of the mk2 (mk1 abs = fail!).
Reliability is down to the previous owner - I'd wager a 14 owner 172 would be less reliable that a 2 owner williams mileage for mileage - people who sell a 30k 172 cannot expect an easy ride when buying a 120k willy 1, at that mileage I'd be ~(and have done!) changing all shocks, springs, subframe, bushes, steering components, tracking done, engine mounts - the list goes on - this is where people fall down - they expect a high mileage willy to mesmorise them over their old 172 just as they're read in they're magazines - how!!?!
handles better? - in my experience yes it does.
more driver feeling? that depends on the driver - I would never myself turn round and say this has a better feel than this, well I would but I'd also expect everyone else to give totally different views..
I FEEL happier driving the 172 at the end of the day - I feel happier that nothings broken, I feel happier I don't stand out as much, I feel happier parking the car, I feel happier when its raining, I feel happier when I pick my family and kids up in it - I feel the same about the leaking boot (lol).
I think my point is I still want a willy, will always want one again but I don't miss its issues, its age, its expense, its candle sticks in the dark, when your using it as intended its fabulous but my 172 makes me feel better more of the time and is 90% as good as the williams was when really going for it - this for me makes the 172 a better car.
But I will always let people know I've owned a williams before I mention the 172.
i do have compassion for the newer renos....jons 172 is alrite...handles well, and puts a wry grin on my face evry time i drive it......but then........its quite heavily modified..and they need to be to be enjoyable to drive for me tbh. but as u say.diff opinions etc.
its good to see a decent write up of them with explanation to back up your opinions, rather than just a 'i own one so its best, i had one of those, which i deemed as best car ever til i got one of these which was best car ever til i got one of the other yada yada yada'
yes the williams has its faults, and il be the 1st to to admit, cos iv probably fixed evry fault they have on someone or others cars, but as far as electrics go, iv never really had any probs on any of my williamses in that respect. rust has been an issue on 1, gearboxes on all, and 1 has had very very limited problems, mainly wear n tear, and iv had that nearly 8 years. and as u know.....i dont drive like miss daisy.
and yes mate.....i am a litle bit more experienced than you
(i dont like bein older hehe) but i dont have the house, mortgage etc. been there done that..........i do have the kids tho loland tbh, i dont think i ever did scratch the black paint on the back of the seats. obv with 2 kids and an ex b**ch in the car, u cant really fold em forward and keep it practical. if i needed to fold the seats down i either took them out in less than a min, or used the van to put s**t in lol.
as far as straight line pace, back in the day we used to do a lot of york/pod trips, cars were all pretty much same spec wise, de-cat n zorst, this goes for the 172s as well as the williams es, and theres only 1 shape leading......and it was never a 172
once or thrice it was craggys freak of a vts up front surprisingly. lol.For me: Mk2 Ph1.
Nice driving in that video BTW 2 live - Though can't believe your mate was happy with you banging off the limiter every 30s!!
Oh, and that Elise driver can't drive for sh!t - hugely inconsiderate too! The S1 118bhp Elise might not be as fast as a Williams, but if his lines had been better through most of those corners he *should* have been out of your way!
yeah he was bein a prick . i tried to go up the inside jus before the back straight , but u can see the instructors arm popping out the skylines window showing me the error of my ways lol.....i did actually get a warning for that, which was retracted at the insistence of one of the other instructors whod seen what was going on
btw......bouncing off the limiter is the only way to drive em lol. i had to in some places just to stop myself running into the back of things. as for the passenger.....hes drove mine, and me his often enough to know thats just how we roll lol. he tried to kill my williams, and both of us at spa with a massive 4 wheel drift round pouhon at about 100.....thats just the way it is tbh. push hard, reap the rewards or fail massively.
A Car
Why dont you just get the car you like best? Do you ask your work mates what they think you should have for tea?
have you even been in a williams let alone driven one???
i like how many ppl on here have an opinion on something theyv probably had no experience of......
A Car
The problem is many people think that all williams are old tired and worn out. They have never visited a MK1 forum to see that some people maintain them regardless of effort or cost.
Sure there are some dogs about, but there are some great examples too. Just as there are some nasty MK1 and 2 escorts, but then look on piston heads, some go for 40k+.
Delta integrale? Rusty Lancia shite box? Most good ones go for 25K +
MK1 MR2? 20 year old tin worm? Youd pay 7 or 8 k for a rare supercharged one in A1 condition.
But you wouldnt buy one of these cars unless you knew how to remove an oil filter or had a big bag of money. Unfortunelty, most of the MK2 / MK3 owners on this site fall into both of these categories and as a result wont ever be able to have the pleasure of owning an old car, and all the benefits that come with your stewardship of a 'historic' model.
But to be honest the PH1 is starting to get old now, so unless you like getting your hands dirty, i wouldnt bother with one either. Unless of course you feel lucky.
Well do you punk?
SC Ph1 172 and M140i
Hi Stromba
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Owned many Integrale's or Lancia's have you?
NO
Williams's are good but there only a f**king Clio and have no real pedigree compared to any Lancia's so back in your box you.
A Car
Owned many Integrale's or Lancia's have you?
NO
Williams's are good but there only a lovely Clio and have no real pedigree compared to any Lancia's so back in your box you.
Let me see:
Both homologation specials.
Both very successful rally cars.
Both poorly made by manufacturers known for producing bad build quality
Pedigree is to do with breeding. So you could argue that neither have any pedigree, as they both came from run of the mill road cars.
A Ferrari F40 has pedigree, a Lancia or a Renault doesnt.
And how many A1 lancia delta evo 1's have you owned? List the exact model you owned please.
172 - 249bhp @ the wheels
Do you spend over a grand on your tea more to the point?
Integrale Evo 1 tuned by Holzer would you like to see the pics?
Having been a member of the Lancia Motor club for many years and owned a Delta HF Turbo I.E. before that which was featured in Auto Italia mag as it was one of the best in the UK.
Oh and also my Mum owned Williams 0077 and I owned 0087 so I feel that I am more than qualified to have an opinion.
Lancia won 6 back to back World Rally Championships with the Integrale and Renault won how many?
They might've won the French tarmac championship with the Williams but it was a cynical marketing exercise as shown by the 2 & 3.
My Father also tried to sue Renault for making the 2's and 3's as they said that the original was a limited edition.
So my family have a fair amount of history with both Williams's and Lancia's therefore I rule.
END.
LY 200
Having owned a good 16v, 2.0 hybrid and a 182 for near on 4 years as a drivers car there is only one choice if you can find a top notch one and it isnt the 172.
If you want a newer feel or a lower miler to use on a daily basis or maybe even the weekened then get a decent 182!
For the record i love my 182 but i wish i hadnt sold my hybrid when i did.
If you want a newer feel or a lower miler to use on a daily basis or maybe even the weekened then get a decent 182!
For the record i love my 182 but i wish i hadnt sold my hybrid when i did.
A Car
Integrale Evo 1 tuned by Holzer would you like to see the pics?
Having been a member of the Lancia Motor club for many years and owned a Delta HF Turbo I.E. before that which was featured in Auto Italia mag as it was one of the best in the UK.
Oh and also my Mum owned Williams 0077 and I owned 0087 so I feel that I am more than qualified to have an opinion.
Lancia won 6 back to back World Rally Championships with the Integrale and Renault won how many?
They might've won the French tarmac championship with the Williams but it was a cynical marketing exercise as shown by the 2 & 3.
My Father also tried to sue Renault for making the 2's and 3's as they said that the original was a limited edition.
So my family have a fair amount of history with both Williams's and Lancia's therefore I rule.
END.
And how does the williams compare to Janine?
I don't think its fair to speak about her on here but she was a lovely girl and I hope she's well.
SC Ph1 172 and M140i
A Car
I don't think its fair to speak about her on here but she was a lovely girl and I hope she's well.
She has a clio now. I will send her this way.
ChrisCurr
ClioSport Club Member
RenaultSport clio 17
Easy Tiger.............I've had a renault 5 Gordini Turbo, 2 Mk 5 Turbo's a Mk1 Clio 1.8 16v, a 19 16v, a Willy 1 and a willy 3 and now own a Ph1 for 4 years. Everyones allowed an opinion if that's what the thread was asking for?
SC Ph1 172 and M140i
No I think 2live just has his own opinions just like you and everyone else on here and if everyone didn't have a different opinion it would make for very boring threads imo.
But Willys are best :rasp:
But Willys are best :rasp:
fair play then mate. your in a position to comment moreso then. maybe you would like to give an explanation as to why the ph1 is better in every way.
each to their own mate. but we both know differently. maybe 1 day you will admit it to yourself
Daz.
ClioSport Club Member
Clio 200 RS EDC
I am - Robert lurves me
lol.....think he was meaning me mate. when theyv proven themselves to me to be a better car, then il admit it. std for std.....they arent tho.
Daz.
ClioSport Club Member
Clio 200 RS EDC
lol.....think he was meaning me mate. when theyv proven themselves to me to be a better car, then il admit it. std for std.....they arent tho.
Bah you lurve me too
Clio Williams & 182
Fun thread
With regards the OP, it really depends on what you want from a car and whether you are prepared to get your hands dirty or not.
172 will likely be a bit fresher, whereas the Williams is the drivers choice.
Every single Renault hot hatch I've driven has been really good fun, from R5 to R26R.
If you want a Williams, just make sure you buy a good one if you are not prepared to sort out the age related issues that invariably occur. Some have been really well looked after though and I dare say in better nic than more than a few 172's that are also now becoming quite old.
Personally, I'm from the old school 90's gang when the Willy was the feature of many a magazine (it still is), the media giving it such praise it's more or less become a Legend. The 172 will never achieve this status.
I love my Willy
With regards the OP, it really depends on what you want from a car and whether you are prepared to get your hands dirty or not.
172 will likely be a bit fresher, whereas the Williams is the drivers choice.
Every single Renault hot hatch I've driven has been really good fun, from R5 to R26R.
If you want a Williams, just make sure you buy a good one if you are not prepared to sort out the age related issues that invariably occur. Some have been really well looked after though and I dare say in better nic than more than a few 172's that are also now becoming quite old.
Personally, I'm from the old school 90's gang when the Willy was the feature of many a magazine (it still is), the media giving it such praise it's more or less become a Legend. The 172 will never achieve this status.
I love my Willy
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^^^^^ I love your Willy too.
SC Ph1 172 and M140i
ITB'd MK1
he's not fussy
- Status
