182 rear exhaust mount inserts recommendations

[finch wxm]

I need two inserts for the rear backbox hangers.

I know poweflex do afew different colour options.

Whats peoples preference ,think ive seen red and black insert , is black a hardened version ?

Its for my stripped white shell build

Cheers

 

[frayz]

Grams, honeycomb.

 

[Kev@KAM]

I'm not a fan of these solid mount inserts which was why we've worked with PhillipM to develop a honeycomb design that allows the exhaust to move with the engine. It means that the hangers and exhaust parts do not get stressed and crack.
Happily using the Grams bushes on my Clio

Grams Exhaust Mount Bush - Renault Clio Mk2 RS172 / RS182

The UK's number 1 source of quality OE and performance parts at affordable prices. Suppliers of BC Racing, Brembo, Catcams, CL Brakes, Ferodo, Godspeed, Grams, MeisterR, PBS, Pure Motorsport, Renault OE, RTS, Winmax Brakes and many more..

www.kamracing.co.uk

 

[finch wxm]

I'm not a fan of these solid mount inserts which was why we've worked with PhillipM to develop a honeycomb design that allows the exhaust to move with the engine. It means that the hangers and exhaust parts do not get stressed and crack.
Happily using the Grams bushes on my Clio

Grams Exhaust Mount Bush - Renault Clio Mk2 RS172 / RS182

The UK's number 1 source of quality OE and performance parts at affordable prices. Suppliers of BC Racing, Brembo, Catcams, CL Brakes, Ferodo, Godspeed, Grams, MeisterR, PBS, Pure Motorsport, Renault OE, RTS, Winmax Brakes and many more..

www.kamracing.co.uk

I have never heard of these Kev , maybe i should give these a try

 

[Kev@KAM]

I have never heard of these Kev , maybe i should give these a try

I'm a small fish in a big ocean

 

[Robbie Corbett]

I have never heard of these Kev , maybe i should give these a try

I have them, fit well and haven't died yet. I'll check under the car tomorrow to see if they have sagged at all. I still don't fully trust 3D printed parts and they are relatively pricey imo but do represent a solution to a real problem 👍

 

[finch wxm]

I have them, fit well and haven't died yet. I'll check under the car tomorrow to see if they have sagged at all. I still don't fully trust 3D printed parts and they are relatively pricey imo but do represent a solution to a real problem 👍

Let me know Rob , agree they are expensive especially when i need 2 of them.

 

[Robbie Corbett]

I looked under the s**t heap yesterday and the 3D printed mounts from KAM still look as new 👍

I still believe they are well over the top price wise - there will be £3 of filament used to print them but obviously some effort has gone into selecting an appropriate material and into the design its self plus KAM will be wanting to make a profit. Thats all very reasonable but would suspect more would buy if they were priced at something like £38-40 the pair.

 

[Kev@KAM]

I make more from selling Powerflex but this was one I felt needed to be sold. Sadly small volume manufacturing cannot compete with industrial leaders for cost per unit.

 

[finch wxm]

I looked under the s**t heap yesterday and the 3D printed mounts from KAM still look as new 👍

I still believe they are well over the top price wise - there will be £3 of filament used to print them but obviously some effort has gone into selecting an appropriate material and into the design its self plus KAM will be wanting to make a profit. Thats all very reasonable but would suspect more would buy if they were priced at something like £38-40 the pair.

Rob thanks for the update , totally agree like most things we buy massively overpriced . If they appear to be holding up and offer a better solution to the poweflex maybe i go with these.

Car is going to be a fast road set up with no interior just seats and a half cage

 

[Robbie Corbett]

I make more from selling Powerflex but this was one I felt needed to be sold. Sadly small volume manufacturing cannot compete with industrial leaders for cost per unit.

Just a recommendation, customer feedback. I was in two minds about buying them for a while likely because I am quite aware of the production cost but also because I am generally wary of the strength and longevity of 3D printed parts - I will say that PhillipM has done a great job on material selection and the print, printing flexible parts is hard work! Plus I am always happy to pay more to support a UK business.

Rob thanks for the update , totally agree like most things we buy massively overpriced . If they appear to be holding up and offer a better solution to the poweflex maybe i go with these.

Car is going to be a fast road set up with no interior just seats and a half cage

No worries mate - don't let my opinion on price put you off, the part is certainly solving a problem which we have all experienced! Ultimately if they last for more than 3 years they will have paid for them selves (I was going through two aftermarket bog standard mounts every year) and like Kev above I had concerns regarding solid mounts - for me mostly the noise they might cause.

The printed mounts seem no noisier than oem to my ears. My build thread has some fitting pictures too

 

[T3gav]

Unfortunately the hangers on my Miltek are not exactly in the centre so still have to modify whatever bush I fit to get the exhaust to sit correctly :/ If you've got an aftermarket exhaust which most people will have you may have to faff around anyway.

 

[Robbie Corbett]

Mines Miltek and lined up perfectly 🤷‍♂️

 

[PhillipM]

Just to clear things up a little on the price, the material alone for those is £70-80 per kilo, they take hours each to make and they need 24+ hours annealing at high temperature afterwards - yes, there's a lot of cheap polyurethanes on the market for printing, they're also terrible quality, stuff with fillers, low-temperature resins, or they're part blended with TPE's to make them easier to print which reduces their properties considerably.

Part of the reason the second batch took so long and Kev was out of stock for a while is that my original UK supplier that I use stopped producing materials, and I went through a dozen other suppliers that either had stuff that didn't match anywhere near the properties they advertised, would sag with heat, etc, or they couldn't guarantee decent tolerances or material certificates. The new material ones I have to import from a place extruding from BASF and Lubrizol resins.

TL : DR - For what I have to charge Kev for them, if anything I think he's undercharging for them just so you guys have a good alternative to powerflex.

 

[finch wxm]

I have a miltek system to go on the car , i will these a try rather than the powerflex

 

[SWL16]

For what it's worth, my GRAMS ones are still on and working ~2years later, no complaints! Saved the constant replacement / addition of bolts and cable ties to the OEM mounts I'd done for years and I certainly wouldn't go back! Exhaust is positioned a lot nicer too and stays there, even with trackdays etc.

I had a bit of a weird arrangement with one of the hangers of the Janspeed exhaust going the opposite way to most exhausts, but sorted with an extra nut and washer to keep the exhaust in the mount under load.

I did cable tie them on, just so I wouldn't lose them if they came out given the price, but doesn't seem to have been a problem anyway.

(I can't comment on the powerflex alternative as have never used)

 

[MRBILLYUK]

I'm not a fan of these solid mount inserts which was why we've worked with PhillipM to develop a honeycomb design that allows the exhaust to move with the engine. It means that the hangers and exhaust parts do not get stressed and crack.
Happily using the Grams bushes on my Clio

Grams Exhaust Mount Bush - Renault Clio Mk2 RS172 / RS182

The UK's number 1 source of quality OE and performance parts at affordable prices. Suppliers of BC Racing, Brembo, Catcams, CL Brakes, Ferodo, Godspeed, Grams, MeisterR, PBS, Pure Motorsport, Renault OE, RTS, Winmax Brakes and many more..

www.kamracing.co.uk

Is Grams your own make? I know you sell Grams springs.
I was just wondering as the Philipm exhaust mounts are branded as Grams?

 

[frayz]

The PhillipM/Grams mounts made a significant improvement in NVH and resonation coming through the flat boot floor.
Superb but of kit and a complete fit/forget item. 👌🏼

 

[Kev@KAM]

Mine are on with no cable ties and have not moved at all

Is Grams your own make? I know you sell Grams springs.
I was just wondering as the Philipm exhaust mounts are branded as Grams?

Yes. I separated my shop name from products I get created. Phillip is the supplier of the product and I brand and retail it.

 

[Robbie Corbett]

Mine are on with no cable ties and have not moved at all

Yes. I separated my shop name from products I get created. Phillip is the supplier of the product and I brand and retail it.

Mine are also in with no cable ties, they were a tight fit so I really don't think they will be moving anywhere.

 

[Bankrupt_drunk]

I've got one of these to fit. I'm a bit nervous about using a big clamp to force it in. Do they compress when you go to fit?

 

[SWL16]

I've got one of these to fit. I'm a bit nervous about using a big clamp to force it in. Do they compress when you go to fit?

They just push fit. The mount itself is slightly tapered.

 

[Robbie Corbett]

To update - several months later one of mine slipped out of the mount - so one side now has a couple of cable ties holding it in. No further issues.

If its super tight I would be tempted to clean up the shitty exhaust hanger casting with a file first. The printed mount went into the OEM exhaust casting much better than it went into a cheap aftermarket one.

 

[PhillipM]

It's surprising how much variation there is, the dogbone mount castings as well have the issue - they differ even from the same manufacturers depending on what batch they come from, bit of a struggle to get decent parts anywhere atm, the new foam ones have a little more preload to cope even more with housing variations but looks like there's still a few outside that.

I could possibly make some locking plates for them for troublesome castings, although cable ties work

 

[Robbie Corbett]

It's surprising how much variation there is, the dogbone mount castings as well have the issue - they differ even from the same manufacturers depending on what batch they come from, bit of a struggle to get decent parts anywhere atm, the new foam ones have a little more preload to cope even more with housing variations but looks like there's still a few outside that.

I could possibly make some locking plates for them for troublesome castings, although cable ties work

Honestly Phillip the cable ties work perfect

I did consider using something like a thin smear of silicon to lubricate the housing which would bond the mount into the casting too. As you say there is so much variation between the castings.

EDIT* Just thought i would also add, my car has seen mixed use, about 8 months of solid driving, and now 4 months of sitting through winter. Mounts still look mint 🙌

 

[PhillipM]

Good to hear, I did look at using some strips of preapplied sealants but they're a bit tricky with shelf life,

 

[Robbie Corbett]

Good to hear, I did look at using some strips of preapplied sealants but they're a bit tricky with shelf life,

I think your print orientation is perfect for bonding them into the housing. The little print ridges would make for good mechanical adhesion to the mount (even if they actual bond was quite weak). If the cast housing was scratched up a bit and well cleaned I think any silicon instant gasket in a tube would work well.

But when a minor issue can be so easily fixed with cable ties (which every Clio owner carries in their handbags) I suspect the issue isn't worth over thinking

 

[PhillipM]

Yep, the trouble is it's difficult to get encapsulated silicone for me to pre-apply - something that doesn't activate for a year of storage until fitted - of course people can use it when fitting if they like, silicone won't cause any issues with poly really - I was trying to find something I could already apply as a dry film that would only activate when fitted. I did try some polyurethane adhesive that's encapsuled in glass micro-balloons - that way they break when you fit it and release the adhesive to cure - but unfortunately the supplier went bust before I could get anything bar some test kits!

I spend way too much time thinking of ways to improve little things on parts, over thinking is my middle name

 

[dangerous dave]

12 years ago or more maybe, I got some new hangers, taped off the back and filled them with high temp silicone.

cost £6 in silicone and they’re still on the car today.. I made 2 backs ups which are in the shed and never needed to fit them.

the scorpion 192 exhaust has been on there just as long and no damage to welds etc.

it’s not great pub ammo to brag about my cheap exhaust hangers, but I did have more beer money that night.

 

[MRBILLYUK]

12 years ago or more maybe, I got some new hangers, taped off the back and filled them with high temp silicone.

cost £6 in silicone and they’re still on the car today.. I made 2 backs ups which are in the shed and never needed to fit them.

the scorpion 192 exhaust has been on there just as long and no damage to welds etc.

it’s not great pub ammo to brag about my cheap exhaust hangers, but I did have more beer money that night.

I did something similar 7 years ago and they're still on the car. I didn't tape them off, I just filled the holes in the rubber part from both sides.

 

[dangerous dave]

I polished the exhaust in 2020 lockdown, I might have finally swapped them out for other set as they look fresh..

 

[PhillipM]

You can flip the honeycomb ones if you need to move the exhaust up or down a little, they have the mounting holes off centre for that reason already.

 

[dangerous dave]

If ok to do so, bend the exhaust hanger bars, your cars right, the exhaust is wrong.

you only have to correct the exhaust once..

I’ve tweaked a few with 2 large spanners.. just don’t lever on the welds and you’ll be fine.