Big brakes...yes or no?

[The Seer]

In the next few months I'll be upgrading the front brakes on my 182.

My dilema is that I feel for the optimum set up I should increase the disc size to a greater diameter than that of the standard disc. To do this I'll need to increase wheel size up from 16" to 17". I was told at GDI that increasing the wheel size to 17" will definately give adverse handling characteristics.

Is this so? Does anyone use a large big brake kit which required larger wheels for it to fit?

 

[Fear]

310mm discs under 17s:

but do fit under 16s:

but only just, thats a 5mm twist drill and it doesnt fit in:

 

[Peperami]

Why do you feel you need bigger discs?

Can get plenty of stopping power with the standard discs and calipers, or 4 pots if you want to splash some money. Even the race cars run standard size discs...

17's will indeed ruin the handling.

 

[The Seer]

I just feel that a big brake kit would improve the car's braking capability. After 120 mph I've noticed that fade is a problem. I suspect they'll warp soon enough. The fade is irratating to say the least.

4 pots will certainly help in grabbing the disc, but I figured a much bigger disc would eliminate any fade through greater heat dissapation+greater surface area for the pads to grip on to. A winner all round surely?

 

[Fletcher]

I'd keep your 16'' wheels and get the comp brake 4 pot kit, or some Brembo calipers.

 

[ado]

Standard size drilled disc to get rid of the boundray layer build up. Pads with a higher working temperature.

If you want 4 pots than AP racing. Floating discs aswell if you really want to.

 

[MarkCup]

I just feel that a big brake kit would improve the car's braking capability. After 120 mph I've noticed that fade is a problem. I suspect they'll warp soon enough. The fade is irratating to say the least.

4 pots will certainly help in grabbing the disc, but I figured a much bigger disc would eliminate any fade through greater heat dissapation+greater surface area for the pads to grip on to. A winner all round surely?

Better pads and discs, with lines and decent fluid and fade will be banished for good.

I've thought about bigger brakes/4-pots many times, then I go out on track and realise they just do not need it.

As above, standard capliers are up to the job.

 

[ado]

Or if you are really serious about disappating the heat you can go for different material disc.

 

[cat171]

Uprated standard sized discs & uprated pads & lines should be ample. The brakes aren't exactly rubbish on them anyway, if anything as standard I find them a bit on the sharp side, never had any fade either.

 

[Dan R]

Anything as long as you dont buy drilled!!! They crack from the holes out! Go for grooved or just normal uprated ones. Brembo discs are rated highly on clios. I have brembo max ones with ds2500 pads and braided lines and have been to the ring with them and cadwell park and suffered no fading at all. Great setup thats fairly inexpensive.Anyone who knows anything about brakes will tell you steer clear of drilled discs!

 

[ado]

Nothing wrong with drilled discs at all. The drilled discs are the last component to cause problems for us.

 

[Fred@BTM]

wait until they crack and then tell me you like them

 

[ado]

They never stay on long enough to crack though.

 

[SCOTT_182CUP]

i kept standard sized discs and as mark said changed lines fluid pads and discs and they dont fade at all.

 

[Anonymous]

I have 300mm discs and 4 pots and they rock

 

[The Seer]

I have 300mm discs and 4 pots and they rock

300mm discs will fit under the standard 16" s?

The OEM discs are 284 mm?

 

[homer simpson]

you don't need a 4 pot brake upgrade just better disk , pads and s/s braided hoses i run performance friction 97 pads with brembo high carbon disks and s/s braided hoses i have done 9 track days this year with the same set of pads and i will be doing my 10th at cadwell next month i have never had fade with them i have found they just get better and better with the more temperature you get in to them and the more you use them they will out brake most cars on track and the brakes on my car are even better than the brembo 4 pots on the new 197

 

[homer simpson]

o and don't by drilled disks they are prone to crack and shatter i have heard some horror stories about them

 

[Anonymous]

you don't need a 4 pot brake upgrade just better disk , pads and s/s braided hoses i run performance friction 97 pads with brembo high carbon disks and s/s braided hoses i have done 9 track days this year with the same set of pads and i will be doing my 10th at cadwell next month i have never had fade with them i have found they just get better and better with the more temperature you get in to them and the more you use them they will out brake most cars on track and the brakes on my car are even better than the brembo 4 pots on the new 197

lol

 

[The Seer]

I think a four pot conversion will probably be the best idea as I intend to transfer them, with other performance parts, to a Trophy eventually. I presume any uprgrade will for a 182 Cup will fit straight on to the Trophy?

Any idea what the OEM discs fitted to the 182 Cup are in mm?

Thanks.

 

[The Seer]

Standard size drilled disc to get rid of the boundray layer build up. Pads with a higher working temperature.

If you want 4 pots than AP racing. Floating discs aswell if you really want to.

AP items are usually rather costly. Godspeed items will do...if they arrive in time.

 

[GordonD]

... After 120 mph I've noticed that fade is a problem. ...

And this is a speed you get up to regularly enough on the road to need bigger brakes?

 

[Rich_16v]

280mm standard disc size

 

[Shindig]

Aftermarket pads and discs will be more than adequate. I had to stop sharply the other day... boy those Greenstuffs did their job!

 

[philmots]

Am i right in thinking the Brembo High Carbons with Greenstuff is the best set up for road use? No squeeks etc?

 

[edde]

Am i right in thinking the Brembo High Carbons with Greenstuff is the best set up for road use? No squeeks etc?

Depends on defininition of best stock is IMO best for most users.

Aftermarket pads and discs will be more than adequate. I had to stop sharply the other day... boy those Greenstuffs did their job!

Stock pads are good enough.

I think a four pot conversion will probably be the best idea as I intend to transfer them, with other performance parts, to a Trophy eventually. I presume any uprgrade will for a 182 Cup will fit straight on to the Trophy?

Any idea what the OEM discs fitted to the 182 Cup are in mm?

280mm

Yep brakes are the same on all 172/182 except the 172 cup has no Abs but only affects rear disk as you need to have the abs rings in them and the 172 front pad part has discontinued the 182 one is retrofitable only difference is a chamer to reduce rattle when bedding in.

 

[Gumby]

Get some ceramic coated discs... Job done

 

[The Seer]

... After 120 mph I've noticed that fade is a problem. ...

And this is a speed you get up to regularly enough on the road to need bigger brakes?

It happens...and when travelling at that speed braking on and off, fade is the last thing I want. Considering I've experienced it so far is warning sign to upgrade.

Generally heaving braking from 120-130 down to 40-50 is when the discs can't cope after repeating this procedure for ten minutes or so.

300 mm discs will fit with a clearance that is acceptable?

Thanks.

 

[Steve]

I got a kit from Yozzasport, Brembo HC DS2500 & lines.

Was worried about all the squeal comments but i have not had any at all & they are miles better than stock.

 

[ben_p]

gotta love the "you dont need 4 pots" comments. i'd put a load of cash on it that these people have NOT drivin a 1*2 with 4 pots fitted?

 

[ben_p]

you don't need a 4 pot brake upgrade just better disk , pads and s/s braided hoses i run performance friction 97 pads with brembo high carbon disks and s/s braided hoses i have done 9 track days this year with the same set of pads and i will be doing my 10th at cadwell next month i have never had fade with them i have found they just get better and better with the more temperature you get in to them and the more you use them they will out brake most cars on track and the brakes on my car are even better than the brembo 4 pots on the new 197

lol

+1

 

[edde]

It happens...and when travelling at that speed braking on and off, fade is the last thing I want. Considering I've experienced it so far is warning sign to upgrade.

Generally heaving braking from 120-130 down to 40-50 is when the discs can't cope after repeating this procedure for ten minutes or so.

300 mm discs will fit with a clearance that is acceptable?

Ist the pads and clipers which are the trouble not the disks themselvs going larger isn't the ideal choice.

 

[The Seer]

I got a kit from Yozzasport, Brembo HC DS2500 & lines.

Was worried about all the squeal comments but i have not had any at all & they are miles better than stock.

A four pot brake with increased disc size brake kit?

 

[The Seer]

It happens...and when travelling at that speed braking on and off, fade is the last thing I want. Considering I've experienced it so far is warning sign to upgrade.

Generally heaving braking from 120-130 down to 40-50 is when the discs can't cope after repeating this procedure for ten minutes or so.

300 mm discs will fit with a clearance that is acceptable?

Ist the pads and clipers which are the trouble not the disks themselvs going larger isn't the ideal choice.

Ok. Though surely having bigger discs is an overall improvement. Greater surface area for for heat disappation. Improved stopping because of that and the larger area for the pads to grab hold of.

 

[Peperami]

The magic is in the brake cooling fella. For what you've described id get some venting run to your brakes. These things have made the single biggest difference to my brake fade...

 

[Peperami]

Am i right in thinking the Brembo High Carbons with Greenstuff is the best set up for road use? No squeeks etc?

Hell no.

Ferodo ds2500's with brembo max discs fella.

The green stuff are a bit :S

 

[The Seer]

The magic is in the brake cooling fella. For what you've described id get some venting run to your brakes. These things have made the single biggest difference to my brake fade...

Really? Sounds a decent way of quelling fade. Just not to keen on removing my fog lights that's all. Any other way of tackling it?

 

[MarkCup]

Yep.

See post #7 above - no need to remove foglights if you get the pad/disc combo right.

I've run Pagid Blues with Brembo HC which were faultless. I'm now on Carbon Lorraine pads on the Brembos...initial thoughts are that they're up there with the Pagids.

That with braided lines and a good fluid will give you a firm pedal, good bite/feel, and no fade.

 

[Andy GDI]

pad compound is essential, the wrong compound for the type of driving and your not going to get the performance you want...

on the road, unless your really pushing it, there is little "need" for 4 pots...

however this is not to say that there are not benefits....

padid and mintex are our current favourites.... on the track clios we look after most use mintex 1144... on one of the track club 182's they get hammered all day and never miss a beat.

we use pagid rs14 on our willwood kit.... these are awesome on the road but for "race level" track use they do suffer a little... but this is in a std weight 182 with more power than std...

disc wise, as long as the quality is good, there is little problem...

its also very important and often overlooked to replace or skim off a disc when a different pad compound is used....

the new pads lay down a layer onto the disc and its this that heavily effects how efficient the breaking is... also bedding in is essential.... and how this is done is evey important...

 

[Fred@BTM]

best pads full stop = PF97 as used by the cup racers, the new Endless pads are incredible also