Cambelt. WTF am I doing wrong!?

[ben_r1]

This is really starting to piss me off. I've followed procedure 6 times now and the timing is still out.

Fit cambelt, tensioner adjusted on marks and pulleys spun 3 times then check tensioner. Horse shoe still fits nicely.
Lock inlet with renault tool and torque it up, same for exhaust. Then bottom pulley.

Rotate engine 3 times and then the horseshoe refuses to fit, it's always the inlet that looks a tiny but out. Tried 6 times now over about 4 hours of work and it's refusing to tighten up and keep timing, I'm 100% sure none of the pulleys move when torquing.

any tips otherwise im just gonna crack on regardless?

 

[mark123]

Do you have any play in the dephaser?

I seem to recall Fred saying he rotates the pulleys backwards and allows 3 fingers worth of force to get the horse shoe back in. http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...cking-pin-in&p=9866755&viewfull=1#post9866755

I know what you mean it can be a PITA.

 

[loggyboy]

Lock inlet with renault tool and torque it up, same for exhaust. Then bottom pulley.

Are you locking them both up at the same time?

 

[ben_r1]

Got it sorted in the end I could get the horse shoe in but with a little force, re timed it several times but it never changed so I reassembled and it's driving perfectly.

Strange thing is when I stripped it down the intake cam was well out of timing but the car drove perfectly and seemed very quick for a clio...

 

[MicKPM]

Posted this earlier for someone else... After its all been tightened and the engine turned over by hand this is how it should go:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=683120918421608&id=115299135203792

You really need to see what it's doing electronically or on a Dyno to gauge whether you are happy with the job or not. We had a 182 in on Monday which had a belt change 3 months ago by someone but the owner wasn't convinced it had been done correctly despite it starting/driving okay. Upon inspection he was right as the inlet was pretty advanced.

Timing reset, job done, car drove completely different.

 

[barnesautos]

That's Mint to achieve that cha cha slide @MicKPM

 

[ben_r1]

I'll see if my local dyno can fit me in tomorrow, it definitely wasn't that easy to fit it lol. Seems to drive nice and I've driven many 1*2s and this ones quick

 

[welshname]

I had a little play in my dephaser so it wouldn't go perfect. If I pit the shoe I the inlet cam and just rest my little finger on the rear of the tool it drops down just enough to fit in.

 

[ilovewilly]

Makes you wonder whether it's worth just dropping it off with a specialist doesn't it!

 

[N4TH4N]

Its crazy to think how many clios are around with the timing out and dont know it.. I got mine booked in with @MicKPM tomorrow to get the timing checked as belts done by a supposedly specialist..

 

[ben_r1]

Mine went in with a little wiggle but it wasn't a struggle, still I like to be thorough so gonna pop down to AmD for a power run later today. Will post up results

 

[ben_r1]

Well I went down to Atspeed after some research on here, AmDs dyno always seem to over read and on a dyno day a few months back cliosport attended all the readings seemed pretty honest.

So it read at 182.3bhp @ 6435rpm and 160 lb/ft @ 5297rpm...

Always thought it was a quick one but that seems a little high to me? Either way I can confirm the timing definitely isn't out!

 

[MicKPM]

That does indeed seem high for a standard car but it's not about the numbers. What does the graph look like?

 

[Mr R.]

My car with 421's and head work is only 192.1 and 160 lbft and that's on RS tuning rollers.

To high.

 

[ben_r1]

That does indeed seem high for a standard car but it's not about the numbers. What does the graph look like?

Although it's not heavily modified it's far from standard:

CNC matched to head lower inlet
Decat
Stainless exhaust system
KTR induction kit
RSTuner remap
Arp rod bolts
Aircon delete kit

And it has also just had new injectors, new lambda sensor, new plugs, all filters replaced and oil changed so it should be fresh as a daisy although i still agree it seems high.

I'll stick a picture of the graph up later, seem to have misplaced it already somewhere.

 

[Rob]

Although it's not heavily modified it's far from standard:

CNC matched to head lower inlet
Decat
Stainless exhaust system
KTR induction kit
RSTuner remap
Arp rod bolts
Aircon delete kit

And it has also just had new injectors, new lambda sensor, new plugs, all filters replaced and oil changed so it should be fresh as a daisy although i still agree it seems high.

I'll stick a picture of the graph up later, seem to have misplaced it already somewhere.

Had it RR'd to check timing and lost the only bit that matters? Sorry, but lol!

 

[ben_r1]

Had it RR'd to check timing and lost the only bit that matters? Sorry, but lol!

Wow thanks for the helpful input to this thread...

Anyway here it is, mrs filed it in her bag. Not great quality:

Red bhp, blue torque, yellow AFR.

 

[Rob]

Wow thanks for the helpful input to this thread...

Anyway here it is, mrs filed it in her bag. Not great quality:

Red bhp, blue torque, yellow AFR.

Alright alright, I was only having a laugh! Hopefully from that, one of the specialists should have a decent idea if it's peaking correctly etc.

 

[Fantom]

My fairly standard car only ran 161bhp on the same rollers
Wonder if my timing is out

 

[Mr R.]

Probably.

 

[The Fatty]

My car with 421's and head work is only 192.1 and 160 lbft and that's on RS tuning rollers.

To high.

not really, my 182 has run 189/190 twice now on different rollers with same sort of mods...

 

[Diagro]

My fairly standard car only ran 161bhp on the same rollers 😧
Wonder if my timing is out

Mine did
162BHP
144 torque
Stock 172

What did yours do?

 

[warwickstingray]

Mine did a 170bhp average after lots of two way runs using the torque app. Dirty itg filter and a kwikfit exhaust are my awesome mods. Was somewhere between 15 and 20C outside.

Was getting around 145bhp at the wheels. I adjusted the weight for me and the amount of fuel I was carrying.

6.7 to 60 with a slow start and sympathetic changes and 15.3 to the quarter on the same run in the direction that gave the lower outputs.

I have no complaints on track. Pulls to the limiter which is a pain. Have to keep an eye on it all the time.

Sounds ridiculous to use an app but probably as accurate as your average rolling road if you do enough two way testing and averages! I spent too much money on dynos and would only use one now to get a car mapped.

Find someone with a known Clio and follow them up a slip road.

 

[Addicted]

Sounds ridiculous to use an app but probably as accurate as your average rolling road if you do enough two way testing and averages!

I very, very, very much doubt that tbh.

 

[warwickstingray]

Knew someone would say that but 3 different cars, endless runs and several dyno visits later and my Vbox or dyno type apps come out with the more likely results!

2 directions to count out various factors and the tests are done up to the top of 2nd so wind resistance is still relatively low. Input as accurate a weight as you can and off you go.

This is CS. Low is always right.

It's not like calculating power at the wheels is complicated. It's the attempts at flywheel power that are the nightmare.

I don't care about bhp figures really. Acceleration figures and real world performance are what's actually important.

Don't take it too seriously it's all just a bit of fun.

 

[ben_r1]

Wow okay.

So in conclusion looks like i did manage to get the timing right and she's a strong old girl too
I know it's an ex press demo car, wonder if renault stuck a cheeky lump under there to impress the reviewers...

 

[Sam@NP]

Wow okay.

So in conclusion looks like i did manage to get the timing right and she's a strong old girl too :tongueout:
I know it's an ex press demo car, wonder if renault stuck a cheeky lump under there to impress the reviewers...

I work for an OEM very close to Renault, press cars are either the best of the best or s**t. Luck of the draw.

 

[Fantom]

Mine did
162BHP
144 torque
Stock 172

What did yours do?

Just dug out the graph. I got 161.0 bhp and 145.5 lb/ft
My car has a few mods but nothing major. Was exoecting a bit better than that though as it supposedly has had a remap and had a sports cat on it. On the plus side it accelerates well and does well on the track

 

[warwickstingray]

Probably one of CS's favourite rolling roads. Would most likely make 20bhp more anywhere else.

Ha!

 

[ben_r1]

Well seeing as it appears to be an honest figure I wonder how much it'd get it of a set of bodies.....

 

[warwickstingray]

If only engines worked like that!

 

[warwickstingray]

If only engines worked like that!

Mass produced engines are so odd. That's why if I was to go down the throttle body route I'd have the whole engine looked at so I knew I wasn't going to be short changed in the end. The F4R is hardly cutting edge.

 

[ben_r1]

I'm just happy i don't have to try timing it up again, proper pain in the arse

 

[warwickstingray]

Good stuff!