Can somebody please clear this up for me!

[Joe Hryszko]

As the title says, a Decat exhaust system, is it illegal or not?

I have been told a number of different things, yes its illegal, no its not illegal aslong as it isnt producing too many emmissions etc!

Might be a stupid question but if somebody could shed some light on this I would be very grateful! Thank you.

Joe

 

[Mr R.]

It is illegal.

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

Illegal, unless it is on pre 1992 cars I think and some jap imports...

But yer illegal for us

 

[LiamR172]

Technically anything that makes the car louder than standard is illegal iirc

 

[MarkX]

It's obviously an mot fail but actually illegal? there's a huge difference, bit of a grey area. I have two other cars that are both decatted and both insured as such, pace ward actually ask if if a decat is fitted and charge accordingly, if it was actually a legal matter wouldn't they just not offer cover?

 

[Joe Hryszko]

Illegal, unless it is on pre 1992 cars I think and some jap imports...

But yer illegal for us

I did think this was the case, just wanted to double check thank you guys!

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

It's obviously an mot fail but actually illegal, there's a huge difference? I have two other cars that are both decatted and both insured as such, pace ward actually ask if if a decat is fitted and charge accordingly, if it was actually a legal matter wouldn't they just not offer cover?

99.9999% insurance companies don't, that is the only one I have ever heard of, unless it is a diesel. Then de-cats are fine

I would double check it personally and get something in writing, if the police pulled you over and you had a de cat, I would think they would do something about it.

It is an MOT failure which therefore makes in unroadworthy in the eyes of the law.

 

[Joe Hryszko]

It's obviously an mot fail but actually illegal? there's a huge difference. I have two other cars that are both decatted and both insured as such, pace ward actually ask if if a decat is fitted and charge accordingly, if it was actually a legal matter wouldn't they just not offer cover?

Well my mates 182 passed its MOT and his is Decatted, they only fail the car on MOT if its above the emission levels that are legal!

As for legality I did think it was illegal but as we are seeing here there are so many differing opinions and views!

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

IF your insurance company allow it and you have a valid MOT but you took the CAT off after the MOT... then this surely would be ok?

Technically you can plead innocent to the whole thing and say you didn't know but at the end of the day, if you fail a roadside emission test, I would of thought not only would you be in trouble with the police but your insurance company would not back you instead of the police.

Besides, unless you go with a specialist insurer, most of the mainstream don't know that you are talking about a car part when you mention cat to them...

 

[MarkX]

99.9999% insurance companies don't, that is the only one I have ever heard of, unless it is a diesel. Then de-cats are fine

I would double check it personally and get something in writing, if the police pulled you over and you had a de cat, I would think they would do something about it.

It is an MOT failure which therefore makes in unroadworthy in the eyes of the law.

not diseasels buddy, two evos, decats are listed 100%, as are all my mods and power levels, they're a performance car insurer and decat/exhaust/suspension are the 1st questions they ask. I fully understand police looking for something to get me on May have something to say

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

not diseasels buddy, two evos, decats are listed 100%, as are all my mods and power levels, they're a performance car insurer and decat/exhaust/suspension are the 1st questions they ask. I fully understand police looking for something to get me on May have something to say

Wow, fair enough. Did they charge any extra for having a de cat?

 

[MarkX]

Wow, fair enough. Did they charge any extra for having a de cat?

Yes they did, can't put a figure on it though as all mods right down to injectors and forged engine internals are listed on mine, well covered, parts are like for like too, which is a bonus. They did add £80 for 3 points though
If you've not tried pace ward they are well worth a go for a modified car, only for over 25s though, they're based in Stoke.

 

[McGherkin]

I was under the impression that it was the emissions failing that stopped you from having a decat, not the lack of one. Could be wrong though.

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

They the ones that are more jap specialists? Evo's, imprezas and that?

Means I have to wait a few years unfortunately.

Might be worth Joe giving them a call just to see their stance on it, I am with greenlight and the don't cover de cats at all but the do do all mods like for like and free of charge to add cosmetics mods which is cool.

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

Talking of decats, one has just been put in the parts for sale bit, a miltek one for £60

I think they make the clio's sound toilet, imho

 

[Owen92]

IF your insurance company allow it and you have a valid MOT but you took the CAT off after the MOT... then this surely would be ok?

Technically you can plead innocent to the whole thing and say you didn't know but at the end of the day, if you fail a roadside emission test, I would of thought not only would you be in trouble with the police but your insurance company would not back you instead of the police.

Besides, unless you go with a specialist insurer, most of the mainstream don't know that you are talking about a car part when you mention cat to them...

You are misinformed. An MOT test only proves that car was in an MOT passable condition at that moment in time. What you are saying, is like telling a police officer "My O/S dipped beam was working when it passed it's MOT 11months ago."

 

[bloke]

Well my mates 182 passed its MOT and his is Decatted, they only fail the car on MOT if its above the emission levels that are legal!

As for legality I did think it was illegal but as we are seeing here there are so many differing opinions and views!

you can't get a 182 through mot without a cat full stop, you need lambda reading and a cat needs to be fitted regardless of it actually working or not. your mate got a dodgy mot

 

[MarkX]

They the ones that are more jap specialists? Evo's, imprezas and that?

Means I have to wait a few years unfortunately.

Might be worth Joe giving them a call just to see their stance on it, I am with greenlight and the don't cover de cats at all but the do do all mods like for like and free of charge to add cosmetics mods which is cool.

They insure all makes, but yeah, well into the evo/imprezza forums, they even do daily track day cover, won't consider quoting under 25s unfortunately

 

[Joe Hryszko]

Thanks for the replies guys, picking my RB 182 up on the 20th of June and its currently got a Miltek Decat exhaust system, now he is going to sort me a cat out but I didnt realise how expensive they were

 

[Addicted]

Get one from here in the Marketplace, only around £100 or so then.

 

[Joe Hryszko]

Get one from here in the Marketplace, only around £100 or so then.

I posted a wanted ad in the Marketplace last night but No replies, are there any for sale?

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

You are misinformed. An MOT test only proves that car was in an MOT passable condition at that moment in time. What you are saying, is like telling a police officer "My O/S dipped beam was working when it passed it's MOT 11months ago."

That was a very unlike scenario mate, if you look earlier on in the thread, I already said that a Decat is illegal

 

[Owen92]

That was a very unlike scenario mate, if you look earlier on in the thread, I already said that a Decat is illegal

Not really. A bulb being out makes a car unroadworthy and therefore illegal to drive on the road.

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

Not really. A bulb being out makes a car unroadworthy and therefore illegal to drive on the road.

ok... where are we going with this haha

Wanna just keep naming things that are illegal?

 

[Owen92]

I was just pointing out that just because a car has an MOT, it doesn't mean anything after it's left the test station. So whether you get a proper MOT with a cat fitted and then remove it afterwards, or get a dodgy MOT with a decat fitted you'll still run the risk of getting done for it.

 

[Will_bmx]

This is only an opinion I've built up based upon a lot of reading a few years ago but AFAIK the decat itself (which is the question) is not illegal. However with most cars, the by-product of having a decat is that you'll fail the emissions test which would make the car not roadworthy.
I had an MR2 turbo previously that had a decat, it was after the JDM emissions cut off (July 95 I think) so would require the stricter emissions and every member on that forum did actually pass the emissions with the decat as the engine was pretty "clean" emissions wise.
But again I will stress that this is only my understanding.
Quote from Milteks website:
Is it legal to de-cat my car?
De-catting a car in the UK registered after 1993 is illegal as it will fail an emissions check.

Even they've worded it that is illegal because it will fail an emissions check. Not simply because the decat has been fitted.
IMO if you meet emissions requirements with it or without, then it's ok.

 

[Saner]

This is only an opinion I've built up based upon a lot of reading a few years ago but AFAIK the decat itself (which is the question) is not illegal. However with most cars, the by-product of having a decat is that you'll fail the emissions test which would make the car not roadworthy.
I had an MR2 turbo previously that had a decat, it was after the JDM emissions cut off (July 95 I think) so would require the stricter emissions and every member on that forum did actually pass the emissions with the decat as the engine was pretty "clean" emissions wise.
But again I will stress that this is only my understanding.
Quote from Milteks website:
Is it legal to de-cat my car?
De-catting a car in the UK registered after 1993 is illegal as it will fail an emissions check.

Even they've worded it that is illegal because it will fail an emissions check. Not simply because the decat has been fitted.
IMO if you meet emissions requirements with it or without, then it's ok.

This used to be correct. If it passed emissions it would past teh test. However since recent introduction of EU Regs in 2010, the MOT test now states that if a cat was present at manufacture, it must be at time of test.

However, you go get some garages that still go by the older regs and don't enforce the visual check.

 

[JCC]

You'd have to be pretty unlucky to get done for having a decat anyway, the only likely chance you'd get caught is if you get pulled into a checkpoint. Police by themselves can't tell at the side of the road if you have a cat or not, VOSA would also have to be involved to prove the car is not road worthy.

As for insurance, if you do have to make a claim, as long as an exhaust is declared the engineer is not going to go crawling around on the deck to see if it has a decat.

 

[Will_bmx]

This used to be correct. If it passed emissions it would past teh test. However since recent introduction of EU Regs in 2010, the MOT test now states that if a cat was present at manufacture, it must be at time of test.

However, you go get some garages that still go by the older regs and don't enforce the visual check.

Ah that makes sense. Thank you for clearing that up. I presume this is the same EU reg that means you need an airbag if you had one fitted from factory? Basically a "you can add things but you can't take things away" regulation...

 

[Saner]

Pretty much yes. However the Airbags one is a grey area, lol.

Guidelines state that if it was fitted at the factory, removal is a fail. But if an air bag wheel and light is removed, how does a tester know if it had one fitted at the factory? There is not definitive database for them to check against, so it could in theory pass.

Also, passing is at a testers discretion. The guidelines have the leniency built in. If a car has been heavily modified for track use, roll cage, buckets, harnesses, it will still be safe, potentially safer than from teh factory, so absence of the factory air bag doesn't matter a tester can still pass it

 

[Joe Hryszko]

This used to be correct. If it passed emissions it would past teh test. However since recent introduction of EU Regs in 2010, the MOT test now states that if a cat was present at manufacture, it must be at time of test.

However, you go get some garages that still go by the older regs and don't enforce the visual check.

This was something I found out last night, If as standard they have a Cat and you decat it, it is still Illegal! But there is this ongoing debate of whether the decat itself is illegal, or whether it is decided entirely on the emissions... Hmm

 

[Saner]

I have clarified the answer to that debate in my post!

A de-cat is not illegal. If you fit it to a car that had a cat from the factory the car will be deemed un-roadworthy.

 

[Dan@Greenlight]

I have clarified the answer to that debate in my post!

A de-cat is not illegal. If you fit it to a car that had a cat from the factory the car will be deemed un-roadworthy.

Sounds about right to me

 

[TheCAB]

The fitting of aftermarket exhaust modifications, especially ones which increase the level of sound emitted, can contravene the Type Approval of the vehicle, which in itself is an offence.There is no requirement for Police to measure the sound level emitted, only offer an opinion that it is louder than the standard factory OE fitment.

So in short if you modify the standard system and as a result it is louder than as factory fitted then you are committing an offence if used on the road.

 

[Tim.]

I'm not attempting to scaremonger, I'm just wondering if anyone else has heard anything similar - as of April (not sure whether that's April this year, or April 2015), running a decat on a car will not only be illegal (no surprise), but also that the mod will be uninsurable by any UK insurer.

I know in the past people like Greenlight have been more than happy to insure cars with a decat so long as it's a declared mod, but it sounds like things are changing? 100 cell sports cats are fine, but if you're running a decat, you're involved in an accident, and it's identified that you're running a decat then you risk not receiving a payout.

Has anyone else heard this?

 

[Addicted]

Doubt it, there'd be more fuss kicked up if that was the case in all honesty.

I don't think we'd only be hearing about it in October.

 

[Advikaz]

It is illegal, however many gut the inside of the cat and replace it as a shell.

Likelyhood is it'll pass emissions without it anyway.

 

[raviedavie]

not diseasels buddy, two evos, decats are listed 100%, as are all my mods and power levels, they're a performance car insurer and decat/exhaust/suspension are the 1st questions they ask. I fully understand police looking for something to get me on May have something to say :smile:

My Evo also passed an MOT with a decat. Having said that the place that fitted it charged me £30 then said they would have to report the car as illegal for road use.... t***s !