Difference in 172/182 engines

[Matteh]

Is there any difference in 172 ph1/ph2 and 182 engines

i.e. do they all use the same gearbox (or atleast the same mountings)?

what about the loom?

also, do these blocks have senders for oil pressure and temp?

 

[DrR]

Difference is ECU, exhaust manilfold and plenum i think.

Ph1 172 has cable throttle body (so must have a different wiring loom???)

Gearbox's are different on all varients.

 

[Matteh]

Can you stick a ph1 gearbox onto a ph2 (want to keep a cable throttle if possible)

would this upset the 182s road speed sensor or something?

 

[DrR]

I think the gearbox's would physically fit, but when getting one for my 172 had the choice of 3 172 cup, 172 ff and 172ff with speedo sensor.
Had to have 172ff with speedo thing, mine was a freak one though, most 172's use the ABS for the speedo.

 

[davebem]

The 172mk1 gearbox is sligthly different. It has longer gear ratios but the differences are minimal.

 

[edde]

Is there any difference in 172 ph1/ph2 and 182 engines

i.e. do they all use the same gearbox (or atleast the same mountings)?

what about the loom?

also, do these blocks have senders for oil pressure and temp?

Looms are different theres a few types of looms though after all some have cable throttle bodies some have electric

Geabox is different but exchangable only exception is the Cup needs a JC5 129 CUp spec box for the speedo output other cars using thw Cup box need to stick a sensor etc in the hole to stop the fluid etc comming out.

Engines whilst all the same swopble excpet form the throttle bodies and the intake plebham. The engines have different parts but it doens't realy matter in the terms of swopping.

Can you stick a ph1 gearbox onto a ph2 (want to keep a cable throttle if possible)

would this upset the 182s road speed sensor or something?

No problem with this the speedo on the phase 2's (bar the 172 cup) is powered from abs so there no issue.

The 172mk1 gearbox is sligthly different. It has longer gear ratios but the differences are minimal.

Yep longer ratios the differences are small though.

 

[Matteh]

So if I were looking to put one in a mk1, I would be able to use any engine block and a ph1 gearbox (with the cable) or the cup gearbox (again, JC5 with a cable speedo - same as the mk1s)

but, if I were to get a ph2 gearbox, the mk1's ABS probably wouldnt work with the mk2's ecu, and I certainly couldnt connect it to the dash speedo...

as for looms, a ph1 would work, but guessing due to the speedo issue for the ecu (and the clocks for my benefit) a ph2 loom would be out of the question?


any ideas on the oil temp/pressure senders on the block?
:edit: nevermind, seems you can use the mk1 sender instead, which has temp and level - and theres already a pressure sender

 

[16v_jon]

There are no senders as such but you can swap the F7R/P senders with the F4R senders so you can still have your gauges.
As for wiring your better off sticking with phase1 stuff, or talk to wayne on here about his, he is pretty clued up or dan.

 

[Matteh]

I intend to bug Dan a lot

 

[Dan@SJM]

oh great.




lol.

As above though, use a 172 ph1 loom, add in parts of your loom to run the oil sensors etc etc.

 

[donsrno1]

About gearboxes it depends how you work the loom etc but if you use a Mk1 setup or a 172 cup setup then you would have to use a Mk1 box or 172 cup box (either of which will fit). Or if you use a later setup you could use any box from across the Mk1/Mk2 range as far as I am aware as any Mk1/Mk2 box will match up to the block.

 

[Matteh]

great

i'll use ph1 172 loom, ph1 172 'box (or cup, but I cant see many of those coming up for sale.. although it is winter ) and then any old F4R i can get my mitts on

fed up of looking for F7Rs and the pricetag that comes with the williams label

and Dan, unlucky! i want a passenger ride in yours at the airfield

 

[edde]

If you don't wan to try find a gearbox speedo box you could alwoasy fit the later cars abs system advanatges
One the systems stand alone and works
Can use any box you want
Cn use an electric PAS rack if you want to limit power drian/complexity under the bonnet.

 

[Matteh]

would need mk2 clocks wouldnt it?

good point about the PAS, not though about that, cant you just connect the mk1 rack to the mk2s pump?

now aircon... thats something else!

 

[Dan@SJM]

The manifold goes between the bulkhead and the subframe, so the valver pas pipes get in the way. so you'll have to either run a new set of pipes, or see if the 172 rack will fit.

Im running no PAS and tbh the steering isnt that heavy compared to if the vaklver lump was in there.

You can run any box you want, im toying with the idea of a 1.9d box(think of the top end!lol) or just put the 172 box in.

It'll be at the airfield(provided it doesnt finish off this box before hand!) itas already broken the casing for one the top mount bolts!If your lucky you may even get a drive lol...

I do however still need to adjust the exhaust. Majorly. Its hitting somewhere, dont know where lol...

Try and get a ph1 engine as they do have the better heads, and are usually higher milage meaning they are quicker, mine feels like a rocket!

 

[Dan@SJM]

Also, for the dash, the rev counter doesnt work, and when you get it working it under reads. the temperature guage is also a problem, as there is no output on the ecu for temperature from the cts. if you splie into the cts signal it works until you get upto temp when it must add a load of resistance in and dump a load of fuel in causing it to stall and refuse to restart. Ive got the important ones working lol i,e the fuel and speedo, and got my oil pressure working now...

 

[Matteh]

are you running a manual rack or a 16v rack packed with grease

don't really want to put a manual rack in as they have more turns lock to lock


and no coolant temp guage?! :0 ... thats kinda risky? i take it the fan still cuts in like its meant to?

 

[Dan@SJM]

16v packed with grease.

fan wiring is all in the 16v loom so you have to wire in a new relay etc to use the old fan switch.

 

[Matteh]

all 1*2 engines are cable throttle and clutch?

 

[DrR]

no only ph1 have cable throttle sadly.

 

[Matteh]

would a cup be a cable throttle?

 

[Dan@SJM]

nope. only the ph1's have cable.

 

[stevo172-RWD]

unless you convert to cable lol.
see you wkd guys
airfield again at last

 

[Matteh]

how hard is it to convert to cable

new tb?

 

[Dan@SJM]

and plenham

 

[edde]

how hard is it to convert to cable

new tb?

And ECU wiring realy plus ECU plus pedal.

 

[D1CKY]

Difference is ECU, exhaust manilfold and plenum i think.

Ph1 172 has cable throttle body (so must have a different wiring loom???)

Gearbox's are different on all varients.

What did Renault do to Ecu on 182 to make it different to the 172 one ?

Was it a slight Remap ?

Or something else ?

 

[16v_jon]

Difference is ECU, exhaust manilfold and plenum i think.

Ph1 172 has cable throttle body (so must have a different wiring loom???)

Gearbox's are different on all varients.

What did Renault do to Ecu on 182 to make it different to the 172 one ?

Was it a slight Remap ?

Or something else ?

Its a different ecu and the map is modified due to the exhaust manifold the car seems to have less low down torque but more top end.

 

[dan_172sport]

hi didnt want to make a new post but can someone answer this.

my phase 1 clio 172's engines gone and ive been offered a 182 engine. Using my own gearbox, loom etc. will it fit?

cheers

 

[bmh.01]

You'll have to swap all the ancilliraries(sp?) over ie manifolds etc but it should fit afaik.