DS3000, Carbon Lorraine or Mintex?

[f0xy]

Ran DS2500s and HC disks all last year, liked them but considering its a 'track only' car, whats worth the extra money for the next step up?

DS3000s?
Carbon Lorraines?
Mintex 1144, or 1177 if you can get them in 172 fitment?

Im not bothered about noise or dust really either, just the best product for the money. Any other suggestions would be appreciated...Thanks.

 

[Fred@BTM]

PF97's or pagid blues, but they're now mega money (both!)

 

[DanFreemanPhoto]

I use 1144s at the moment with no complaints on track, but iirc they arent focussed track pads.
The carbon lorraines get good reviews, can't remember which variant to go for though.

 

[f0xy]

PF97's or pagid blues, but they're now mega money (both!)

I cant seem to find a supplier for either!

I use 1144s at the moment with no complaints on track, but iirc they arent focussed track pads.
The carbon lorraines get good reviews, can't remember which variant to go for though.

RC5+ maybe?

 

[Fred@BTM]

me you plonker, expensive, but they'll last for a long time (ie 2-3 pairs of discs to 1 set of pads)

 

[f0xy]

Price? also what you selling DS2500's for these days?

 

[Inferno]

PF97's get my vote. Out of curiosity how much are they now?

 

[Fred@BTM]

PF97's? knocking around £170 (ignore the price on yozzasport, he hasn't updated it!)

 

[Bazzon]

Think weve got a set of PF97s in the garage for when we put the car back on the road. But your car will be on track before ours, so give some feed back

 

[the_prophet]

rc5+ carbon lorraines would be my choice.

 

[Inferno]

PF97's? knocking around £170 (ignore the price on yozzasport, he hasn't updated it!)

Ouch! Think they were £120ish when I bought them (many moons ago).

 

[Fred@BTM]

the price has rocketed on them! we've had to stop using PF on the driversdreamdays high speed cars, they've become too expensive for the amount we get through!

 

[Tom]

me you plonker, expensive, but they'll last for a long time (ie 2-3 pairs of discs to 1 set of pads)

i did 5 discs to 1 set of pads. (1x HC, 4 X QH?)

Awesome.

 

[f0xy]

PF97's? knocking around £170 (ignore the price on yozzasport, he hasn't updated it!)

Hmmmm, so are they really THAT much better than the others in the title, to justify the higher price?

Think weve got a set of PF97s in the garage for when we put the car back on the road. But your car will be on track before ours, so give some feed back

I wish! looking late april/early may at the moment lol.

rc5+ carbon lorraines would be my choice.

Whats the deal with the RC6, better pad due to being more expensive?

 

[the_prophet]

^ different compound. think the 6 is more the endurance based pad.

 

[Fred@BTM]

yup, you know me, i don't recommend stuff i don't rate!

 

[chrispy.clio]

I run Carbone Lorraine RC5's (the older version of RC5+) and they are very good. I have never had any brake fade.

These types of pads need you to blead the system more often but its your track car so i suspect you do it after every trackday anyway.

 

[Dangerous_dave]

mintex = squeeling like a double decker bus!
pagid's

 

[chrispy.clio]

mintex = squeeling like a double decker bus!
pagid's

Dont the pads just squeel when light braking?

My cl's do when light braking but when i'm on track they stop.

 

[Dangerous_dave]

Dont the pads just squeel when light braking?

My cl's do when light braking but when i'm on track they stop.

yep, so basically only good for track ONLY if you use your motor on the road they will annoy the s**t out of you squeeling at any normal (non hard braking)

 

[f0xy]

Yeah was told they squeel until they have some proper heat in them (CL's that is)

And yeah Chrispy I do the brakes after every trackday anyway!

 

[chrispy.clio]

Squeeling doesnt bother me.

I think the carbone lorraines are the cheapest out of the "track pads"

I bought mine for £90

 

[f0xy]

Yeah was going to say around ~£100, will have to have a think!

 

[chrispy.clio]

I got mine cheaper than usual, cant remember how but i did. I think they are around £115 or something

 

[mr.valver]

Fitted some 1155's yesterday with HC and HEL Braided lines.

Never drove like a hero yet but my first impressions are looking impressive!

I think they are kinda cheap to around £80 a set.

 

[Kam.]

I'd go for the CL Brakes (used to be called Carbone Lorraine) RC6 over the RC5+ seems dust is not an issue. Both will cope well on track and you will not get fade from the pads. The RC5+ has a friction level of 0.42 which is a bit lower than the RC6 (0.5) but instead gives off barely any dust. The RC6 is about £15 more expensive for getting fronts and rears though.

If brake pad and disc wear are important there is also the RC6 Endurance compound which has virtually the same friction level (0.46) as the RC6 but will last longer as it was designed to not require changing during 6-24hr endurance racing. These are a nearly £50 more expensive for the front and rear set but they will last longer..

RC5+
http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.ph...e-pads-renault-clio-1-8-16v-2-0-williams.html

RC6 / RC6 Endurance
http://www.cl-brakes.co.uk/index.php/renault-clio-1-8-16v-2-0-williams-rc6-brake-pads.html

We can get RC8's also if you want the ultimate friction level (0.62), but I believe these will only come into their own with sticky trackday tyres or slicks. If you're running these either of these let me know and I'll get these up on the site.

The below graph shows the friction levels for the CL brakes. The new RC5+ is not on the graph but is slightly higher than the old RC5 for the friction co-efficient

The Mintex M1144's are not as track orientated as the CL Brakes and you may experience some fade with longer track sessions due to temperature build up. They have a friction level of 0.45

the M1155's are more track orientated than these and have the temperature band a bit higher

with the M1177's it will take longer to get up to temperature (not an issue with the CL Brakes). Not got a graph for these unfortunately. the friction level is around 0.61 and dropping off after 500 degrees C down to 0.55 at 700 degrees C

We can get the Mintex pads also but havent got them all on the site since going live with the new site..

Pagid blues in my opinion are well over priced for what you get. they work from cold up to about 550 degrees Celcius and are pretty similar to the Mintex m1155. They have a friction level of 0.4 from cold and go up to 0.46 at 550deg C where it then drops off

The DS3000s have a friction level of 0.62 so within their temperature band they are comparable with the RC8. The RC8 has a larger temperature band and so works from cold (unlike the DS3000's) to well above the temperature range of the DS3000's

PF97's have a friction co-efficient of about 0.4 if I remember correctly (just below the RC5+). I've not tried them myself but have heard that they don't give good pedal feel.

 

[Fred@BTM]

PF97's have a friction co-efficient of about 0.4 if I remember correctly (just below the RC5+). I've not tried them myself but have heard that they don't give good pedal feel.

ha! whoever told you that was either maureen from driving school or full of the preverbial!

 

[chrispy.clio]

Kam Racing that was really interesting to read. When i need new pads i will come back to you

 

[Kam.]

ha! whoever told you that was either maureen from driving school or full of the preverbial!

Do performance friction need to get up to temperature to work? that could be why people may have said it?

Either way the Carbone Lorraine pads offer better stable friction levels for lower prices

 

[Fred@BTM]

they "work" when cold, but are a full on race pad and hence need to be red hot to properly work (if you see sparks they're too cold still!) not exactly a road pad!

 

[Tom]

PF's do need a fair bit of heat.

I wasn't confident i would stop if they were cold. Took 2 short applications to warm them up and they were on the money. Crazy pads, sadly they make a load of mess. (Turbines solve that problem)

 

[f0xy]

I'd go for the CL Brakes (used to be called Carbone Lorraine) RC6 over the RC5+ seems dust is not an issue. Both will cope well on track and you will not get fade from the pads. The RC5+ has a friction level of 0.42 which is a bit lower than the RC6 (0.5) but instead gives off barely any dust. The RC6 is about £15 more expensive for getting fronts and rears though.

If brake pad and disc wear are important there is also the RC6 Endurance compound which has virtually the same friction level (0.46) as the RC6 but will last longer as it was designed to not require changing during 6-24hr endurance racing. These are a nearly £50 more expensive for the front and rear set but they will last longer..

RC5+
http://www.kamracing.co.uk/index.ph...e-pads-renault-clio-1-8-16v-2-0-williams.html

RC6 / RC6 Endurance
http://www.cl-brakes.co.uk/index.php/renault-clio-1-8-16v-2-0-williams-rc6-brake-pads.html

We can get RC8's also if you want the ultimate friction level (0.62), but I believe these will only come into their own with sticky trackday tyres or slicks. If you're running these either of these let me know and I'll get these up on the site.

The below graph shows the friction levels for the CL brakes. The new RC5+ is not on the graph but is slightly higher than the old RC5 for the friction co-efficient

The Mintex M1144's are not as track orientated as the CL Brakes and you may experience some fade with longer track sessions due to temperature build up. They have a friction level of 0.45

the M1155's are more track orientated than these and have the temperature band a bit higher

with the M1177's it will take longer to get up to temperature (not an issue with the CL Brakes). Not got a graph for these unfortunately. the friction level is around 0.61 and dropping off after 500 degrees C down to 0.55 at 700 degrees C

We can get the Mintex pads also but havent got them all on the site since going live with the new site..

Pagid blues in my opinion are well over priced for what you get. they work from cold up to about 550 degrees Celcius and are pretty similar to the Mintex m1155. They have a friction level of 0.4 from cold and go up to 0.46 at 550deg C where it then drops off

The DS3000s have a friction level of 0.62 so within their temperature band they are comparable with the RC8. The RC8 has a larger temperature band and so works from cold (unlike the DS3000's) to well above the temperature range of the DS3000's

PF97's have a friction co-efficient of about 0.4 if I remember correctly (just below the RC5+). I've not tried them myself but have heard that they don't give good pedal feel.

Thanks for the info, interesting read.

So can you get hold of DS3000s? If yes, what price?

 

[White16valver]

PF's do need a fair bit of heat.

I wasn't confident i would stop if they were cold. Took 2 short applications to warm them up and they were on the money. Crazy pads, sadly they make a load of mess. (Turbines solve that problem)

That sounds like fun... lol

For my money I'd go with the CL RC5+. I had the Pagid Blue before (with Brembo Max) and they simply didn't have any proper bite when cold. They were consistent when warmed up, in that I always had faith they would stop and never had any issues with fade, but they never inspired confidence.

The RC5+ are ridiculously good from cold - even in the snow they are better than standard IMO. While you're warming them up you can actually feel them biting harder if you leave your foot at the same pressure on the brake lol

I've not had them on track yet but if they get better than the do from cold, I can't see how you'd need anything else!!

Not dusty either, at least no more than normal, and they barely squeal (boring!)

Get a set - if you hate them, I'm quite sure someone on here will take them off your hands!

 

[Nick_C]

I used to use ferodo DS2500 on track (106 GTI) but found they transferred a lot of material to the brake disc making it judder. Changed to pagid blues and well impressed!

Nick

 

[Kam.]

Thanks for the info, interesting read.

So can you get hold of DS3000s? If yes, what price?

not as yet. we have the details of the Ferodo distributor now and will be set up soon; though this will be after we get our site with all the other products we want to sell from companies we are already set up with..

 

[Fred@BTM]

call me tomorrow Jord, i'll sort you a special price

 

[Kam.]

I used to use ferodo DS2500 on track (106 GTI) but found they transferred a lot of material to the brake disc making it judder. Changed to pagid blues and well impressed!

Nick

this is due to having organic content in the compounds. As the Carbone Lorraines are fully sintered metal (no organic content) you do not get any transference of material onto the disc

 

[calum001]

good read, how do the DS2500's compare to pads mentioned above then (since half of CS is using them it would be interesting to know)

 

[Riley!]

RRP on ds 3000 this time last year 113.84 + vat. They have gone up 5% since then. Just to give you an idea foxy

 

[Tony Hunter]

If you get Ds2500 so hot that they start to fade then you are doing something wrong.