Why are they a different length? AFAIK the cup uses the same upright geometry as non cup models, the same track rod ends and the same rack, and excluding the difference in wheel offset, runs the same track?
ClioSport.net
Register a free account today to become a member!
Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Read more here.
My Renaultsport Clio 172 Cup restoration project
- Thread starter Gibbo205
- Start date
KAM Racing are stating, no difference. PH1 172 uses different inners. PH2 172/182 all use same inner, I am now speaking with Renault direct for further confirmation.
OK Paul at RPD also says, there is no difference and said its a questioned asked often and pointed me to the answer on their FAQ:
https://www.renaultpartsdirect.co.uk/faqs/
He also did say, to only buy original confirming what others said here that the aftermarket items sold, particular by ECP will not fit.
https://www.renaultpartsdirect.co.uk/faqs/
He also did say, to only buy original confirming what others said here that the aftermarket items sold, particular by ECP will not fit.
Slick 50 is snake oil, don't use it.
For rear beam bushes use whiteline instead of powerflex, cheaper.
For track rods get genuine, they are a decent price as they come with a rack boot as well and the genuine one is good quality.
Just a shame they don't come with new lockstops.
For rear beam bushes use whiteline instead of powerflex, cheaper.
For track rods get genuine, they are a decent price as they come with a rack boot as well and the genuine one is good quality.
Just a shame they don't come with new lockstops.
Brigsy
ClioSport Club Member
T.Turbo
172cup has more castor than normal 172 setup.
Yes but only the same as the 182 as they standardised the wishbnes to the cup pattern I believe, and besides, its not going to make much difference to the track rod length at all as the wheel is moved forward in the arch
Already got the powerflex ones.
Order genuine inners from Renault and Lemforder ends from ECP as was £36 for the pair with 50% discount code.
Hi there
Well was expecting a lot more deliveries, but courier drivers must be taking a break, only DPD deliveries on time, so not so much to report.
But ordered a set of car mats to keep the interior carpets from getting worn and I like the blue accents and cup172 branding on them:
There is also a nice big mat in the boot too which was ideal as the original boot trim mat was ruined and the aftermarket mats are higher quality and better finish.
The Grams lowering springs arrived from KAM Racing which are made in the same factory as the Cooksports to a similar specification. The drop is in theory around 20-25mm on a 172 Cup so nothing outrageous and feedback is a tad firmer than stock but improve handling, as I have no real stock reference to go from the only kind of feedback I shall be able to give is how the car feels on them with a complete suspension refresh, but have nothing to compare too.
Here they are next to some pretty fresh 172 cup springs (20,000 miles) you can see the Grams are a small amount shorter, of course once on the car the originals will compress more with the cars weight whereas the Grams will compress less simply due to being a higher spring rate. (Grams are glossy ones and original cups are the matt ones):
I also weighed the springs, the original cup springs come in at 6.8kg total, whereas the Grams springs weigh in at 7.9kg total, this again makes sense due to the Grams having more material due to the closer packed coils and thus more coils.
Well was expecting a lot more deliveries, but courier drivers must be taking a break, only DPD deliveries on time, so not so much to report.
But ordered a set of car mats to keep the interior carpets from getting worn and I like the blue accents and cup172 branding on them:
There is also a nice big mat in the boot too which was ideal as the original boot trim mat was ruined and the aftermarket mats are higher quality and better finish.
The Grams lowering springs arrived from KAM Racing which are made in the same factory as the Cooksports to a similar specification. The drop is in theory around 20-25mm on a 172 Cup so nothing outrageous and feedback is a tad firmer than stock but improve handling, as I have no real stock reference to go from the only kind of feedback I shall be able to give is how the car feels on them with a complete suspension refresh, but have nothing to compare too.
Here they are next to some pretty fresh 172 cup springs (20,000 miles) you can see the Grams are a small amount shorter, of course once on the car the originals will compress more with the cars weight whereas the Grams will compress less simply due to being a higher spring rate. (Grams are glossy ones and original cups are the matt ones):
I also weighed the springs, the original cup springs come in at 6.8kg total, whereas the Grams springs weigh in at 7.9kg total, this again makes sense due to the Grams having more material due to the closer packed coils and thus more coils.
Hi there
Quite a few deliveries today including a new rear upper brake light, chipex platinum kit and the front steering components:
- Renault inner track rod kits x2
- Lemforder outer track rod ends x2
- Powerflex steering bushes x2
- Powerflex anti-roll bar bushes x4
- Upper spring seats
- gearbox sump plug and washer
- engine sump plug and washer
- Damper dust boots
So I got to work with Chipex kit and to start with removed old rear brake light as there was a lot of paint flaking behind it, so cleaned it all up and removed any flaking paint:
So did not make this perfect job as once the light is in, hard to see in there, so just made sure I applied plenty of paint and left it to dry:
I then did the chipped of paint on door edges and the deep scratch on the door:
Before:
After:
The results are not perfect, if you look close you can still see, but you now have to be close up and looking, all in all a great improvement and its my first attempt at touching in big chips and scratches, I was having some success and on other ones not so much. The Chipex Platinum kit is quite large so I'd used only 15-20% doing all this, so I can have another go or find someone with more experience to try and perfect for me.
The car is at Birchdown Auto Services tomorrow for the belts/pulleys and full service:
http://www.birchdown.com/
If all goes well, next week or following week wheels refurb and a set of AD08R's all round, looking forward to driving the car.
Quite a few deliveries today including a new rear upper brake light, chipex platinum kit and the front steering components:
- Renault inner track rod kits x2
- Lemforder outer track rod ends x2
- Powerflex steering bushes x2
- Powerflex anti-roll bar bushes x4
- Upper spring seats
- gearbox sump plug and washer
- engine sump plug and washer
- Damper dust boots
So I got to work with Chipex kit and to start with removed old rear brake light as there was a lot of paint flaking behind it, so cleaned it all up and removed any flaking paint:
So did not make this perfect job as once the light is in, hard to see in there, so just made sure I applied plenty of paint and left it to dry:
I then did the chipped of paint on door edges and the deep scratch on the door:
Before:
After:
The results are not perfect, if you look close you can still see, but you now have to be close up and looking, all in all a great improvement and its my first attempt at touching in big chips and scratches, I was having some success and on other ones not so much. The Chipex Platinum kit is quite large so I'd used only 15-20% doing all this, so I can have another go or find someone with more experience to try and perfect for me.
The car is at Birchdown Auto Services tomorrow for the belts/pulleys and full service:
http://www.birchdown.com/
If all goes well, next week or following week wheels refurb and a set of AD08R's all round, looking forward to driving the car.
MrBlonde
ClioSport Club Member
Whats the Chipex Platinum Kit mate,any more info on it?,wouldnt mind trying that on my Cup.
Jekyll
ClioSport Club Member
Fantastic project/thread so far. I've enjoyed reading it and your work is great ?
Absolutely, I literally bought it, drove it home and its been parked since. So a very gentle drive to Birchdown tomorrow and hopefully a more spirited drive home.
Then to get wheels repaired and a set of AD08R's all round as they seem the most fun tyre for the road and odd track day.
Yes I am going 205/45/16, which I prefer anyway as the stock 195/45/16 for whatever reason looks a little stretched on the Turini's.
Iain C
ClioSport Club Member
Looks great. I wouldn't use the ecp ht leads. They are useless and fail after a month or so.
MrBlonde
ClioSport Club Member
Be interesting to see how they look in Turinis mate in that size,they are a great tyre but at that size about £100 a tyre
i may go for these next or the Mich PS3's as there be a good all rounder for rain and winter times.
MrBlonde
ClioSport Club Member
Hi there
So 8am this morning I dropped the car of with Birchdown Auto Services who are a highly recommended Renault specialist, they provided me with a courtesy car so off I went to work:
http://www.birchdown.com/
Gave them the list of work I wanted doing knowing they would never get everything done in one day but to do their best with of course belts, pulleys and service taking priority.
Also requested they wipe and clean every as working on the car and thoroughly inspect and drive the car to give me a list of any issues or advise they find to get done on the car.
So come 17:30, I arrive back at Birchdown, the first thing I notice is the car parked outside looking incredible, the grams lowering springs aesthetically are spot on, not slammed, the huge arch gap that could previously be used for smuggling is now gone leave a 2-3 finger gap, they may settle a little more further but the car was full of original suspension in boot too so probably won't much, some pictures I took before chatting with Andy and Steve:
So they basically told me I am lucky as the pulley had broken which normally leads to the auxiliary belt slipping off and taking the cambelt with it, destroying the engine, not just that but the cambelt was very heavily cracked and did not have much life in in and was one of the worse they had seen. The dephaser was also totally knackered, but I knew that from how loud the engine was at warm idle.
Of course this was expected, hence parking it and keep RPM's very low, I enquired as to what other issues they found and they said the only issues they discovered was knackered rear dampers and a little play in the inner track rods, which you already have all the parts for.
They said they could not find any other issues with the car and said it was rust and corrosion free on the underside as well, commenting its a fantastic honest example just in need of TLC, which it has now had by myself and them. They did say on their test drive they were surprised at how strong the car feels, more so than normal and how tight it felt even though they did not complete the full suspension refresh. Again they said this was surprising considering the miss-matched tyres but it drove beyond expectations. They think the previous owner did not really drive it hard as even though were replacing all bushes, wishbones, the ones on there are in good condition and they said though the dog bone mount and lower mount were worn it was not typical wear of 50,000 miles, so its had an easy life, probably why the belts did not snap.
He also said that the oil leak was purely from the power steering valve which they fixed and that the engine had no oil leaks which is rare on them and now with a new rocker cover and re-seal should all be good.
So then I got the bad bit, the bill.
Very fair price as a full days work plus they also supplied a lot of the hardware, all paid up and time to look forward to the drive home which was all pretty much national speed limit country roads, oh boy is the car a huge amount of fun, its pretty damn epic, crazy how much fun can be had for so little money!
Car idles silent, no more rattle or diesel type noise. I never opened it up before but car at low RPM is smoother and feels like stronger torque. So I finally got to enjoy opening the car up and it pulls really strong through entire rev range but at 5500rpm area it seems to come on cam and pulls harder to around 7300rpm and is eager, it feels much stronger than 160HP they supposedly all run, of course it does not weigh much which will help but its quite torque for a petrol 2.0l, certainly in something only weighing a tonne.
Car has great corner grip once into the corner, you can then just make the tyres scream, I'd forgotton how easy and fun FWD can be in sorted chassis that just begs to be driven hard, huge fun.
Only complaints are steering is a bit vague and loose feeling over undulations which am putting down to track rods, steering rack bushes (still yet to do).
Brakes do the job, could be better though, going to look into what is available here.
Back-end feels planted now and turn in is fantastic, feels like it just holds on for deer life even with 4 budget tyres and one been a winter, lol.
Did I say, GREAT FUN! It gets to 100mph pretty swiftly too!
So time to give it a full tank of Vpower, £52, nice I cannot believe how good on fuel this car is, even driving it hard the consumption seems to good to be true, but in comparison the SVR and M3 absolutely drink fuel unless cruising, but the Clio on a cruise nearly returned 50mpg, but its not a cruising car as gearing is not suited to 70-80mph at all.
The drove home on some of my favourite roads, its amazing how you can chuck it in way too fast, my the tyres squeal through a corner or roundabout, then just bury the throttle with it giving a tad torque steer and the tyres screaming for mercy as you slide and accelerate down the road, a lot of fun, but also capable, can't wait to refresh suspension and get a set of AD08R's on the car!
So got home, emptied all the old stuff out the boot and parts they had not yet fitted, plus a spare litre of oil:
Plus a picture of the engine bay after some more cleaning and new header tank in place:
So its booked back in at Birchdown next month by which time the wheels will have been refurbed and have the AD08R's fitted to have the remainder done which is:
- Renault inner track rod arms x2
- Lemforder outer track rod arms x2
- Powerflex anti-roll bar bushes x4
- Powerflex steering bushes x2
- Upper engine mount and Powerflex insert (may do myself)
- Powerflex rear beam bushes
- New front pair wishbones
- Alignment to factory settings
- Might do a full brake refresh for some higher quality disc and pads, or maybe a Brembo conversion? Whats available?
- There is either a lot of tyre/road roar or a wheel bearing is a little dry as around 40-50mph got the typical wheel bearing humm/drone noise of a dry bearing, did typical clutch in neutral, no change so either bearing or tyre roar.
So now I can use the car, which I shall be doing, its a lot of fun and its only going to get better.
So 8am this morning I dropped the car of with Birchdown Auto Services who are a highly recommended Renault specialist, they provided me with a courtesy car so off I went to work:
http://www.birchdown.com/
Gave them the list of work I wanted doing knowing they would never get everything done in one day but to do their best with of course belts, pulleys and service taking priority.
Also requested they wipe and clean every as working on the car and thoroughly inspect and drive the car to give me a list of any issues or advise they find to get done on the car.
So come 17:30, I arrive back at Birchdown, the first thing I notice is the car parked outside looking incredible, the grams lowering springs aesthetically are spot on, not slammed, the huge arch gap that could previously be used for smuggling is now gone leave a 2-3 finger gap, they may settle a little more further but the car was full of original suspension in boot too so probably won't much, some pictures I took before chatting with Andy and Steve:
So they basically told me I am lucky as the pulley had broken which normally leads to the auxiliary belt slipping off and taking the cambelt with it, destroying the engine, not just that but the cambelt was very heavily cracked and did not have much life in in and was one of the worse they had seen. The dephaser was also totally knackered, but I knew that from how loud the engine was at warm idle.
Of course this was expected, hence parking it and keep RPM's very low, I enquired as to what other issues they found and they said the only issues they discovered was knackered rear dampers and a little play in the inner track rods, which you already have all the parts for.
They said they could not find any other issues with the car and said it was rust and corrosion free on the underside as well, commenting its a fantastic honest example just in need of TLC, which it has now had by myself and them. They did say on their test drive they were surprised at how strong the car feels, more so than normal and how tight it felt even though they did not complete the full suspension refresh. Again they said this was surprising considering the miss-matched tyres but it drove beyond expectations. They think the previous owner did not really drive it hard as even though were replacing all bushes, wishbones, the ones on there are in good condition and they said though the dog bone mount and lower mount were worn it was not typical wear of 50,000 miles, so its had an easy life, probably why the belts did not snap.
He also said that the oil leak was purely from the power steering valve which they fixed and that the engine had no oil leaks which is rare on them and now with a new rocker cover and re-seal should all be good.
So then I got the bad bit, the bill.
Very fair price as a full days work plus they also supplied a lot of the hardware, all paid up and time to look forward to the drive home which was all pretty much national speed limit country roads, oh boy is the car a huge amount of fun, its pretty damn epic, crazy how much fun can be had for so little money!
Car idles silent, no more rattle or diesel type noise. I never opened it up before but car at low RPM is smoother and feels like stronger torque. So I finally got to enjoy opening the car up and it pulls really strong through entire rev range but at 5500rpm area it seems to come on cam and pulls harder to around 7300rpm and is eager, it feels much stronger than 160HP they supposedly all run, of course it does not weigh much which will help but its quite torque for a petrol 2.0l, certainly in something only weighing a tonne.
Car has great corner grip once into the corner, you can then just make the tyres scream, I'd forgotton how easy and fun FWD can be in sorted chassis that just begs to be driven hard, huge fun.
Only complaints are steering is a bit vague and loose feeling over undulations which am putting down to track rods, steering rack bushes (still yet to do).
Brakes do the job, could be better though, going to look into what is available here.
Back-end feels planted now and turn in is fantastic, feels like it just holds on for deer life even with 4 budget tyres and one been a winter, lol.
Did I say, GREAT FUN! It gets to 100mph pretty swiftly too!
So time to give it a full tank of Vpower, £52, nice I cannot believe how good on fuel this car is, even driving it hard the consumption seems to good to be true, but in comparison the SVR and M3 absolutely drink fuel unless cruising, but the Clio on a cruise nearly returned 50mpg, but its not a cruising car as gearing is not suited to 70-80mph at all.
The drove home on some of my favourite roads, its amazing how you can chuck it in way too fast, my the tyres squeal through a corner or roundabout, then just bury the throttle with it giving a tad torque steer and the tyres screaming for mercy as you slide and accelerate down the road, a lot of fun, but also capable, can't wait to refresh suspension and get a set of AD08R's on the car!
So got home, emptied all the old stuff out the boot and parts they had not yet fitted, plus a spare litre of oil:
Plus a picture of the engine bay after some more cleaning and new header tank in place:
So its booked back in at Birchdown next month by which time the wheels will have been refurbed and have the AD08R's fitted to have the remainder done which is:
- Renault inner track rod arms x2
- Lemforder outer track rod arms x2
- Powerflex anti-roll bar bushes x4
- Powerflex steering bushes x2
- Upper engine mount and Powerflex insert (may do myself)
- Powerflex rear beam bushes
- New front pair wishbones
- Alignment to factory settings
- Might do a full brake refresh for some higher quality disc and pads, or maybe a Brembo conversion? Whats available?
- There is either a lot of tyre/road roar or a wheel bearing is a little dry as around 40-50mph got the typical wheel bearing humm/drone noise of a dry bearing, did typical clutch in neutral, no change so either bearing or tyre roar.
So now I can use the car, which I shall be doing, its a lot of fun and its only going to get better.
Nice, very nice!
Yes I want to get wheels done in bright silver like stock / yours. Calipers un-decided yet as I'd like better brakes, need to check the options.
I am considering a snappy wheel, what is the part number on that Renault blue top gear knob please? Easy to change?
P.S. Did you have spacers fitted?
Gaz_
ClioSport Club Member
Extreme mode
No spacers not a fan, cup doesn't need them anyway with the lower offset turinis over a standard 172
Snappy wheel is a good call, I ended up getting my hands on a replacement wheel. I had that car about 8 years ago now (I'd previously had another circa 2004) love them to bits, best MK2 Clio by far imo, looking at this is making me want another ?
The part no is the best pic I have of the gearknob uufortunately, though steve is a good mate of mine and does all my work so he *might* have record of it on the database, I'll ask the question. I just pulled the old one off (destroyed with mole grips) the new one just pushes on ?
One of it parked where yours was back In the day, bit of a slag with those roads ?
You local to birchdown?
Last edited:
Big_Steve_T
ClioSport Club Member
82 are the missing numbers from the photo
Unless you're keeping it oe the best way to improve the steering no end is a smaller after market wheel.
The RS's of this generation have coach wheels on them.
I put an Omp trecento uno on mine, 300mm. Drove like a go kart, it was epic fun.
Miss my old Cup but had to go slightly practical and got a meg 225 with having kids etc. I've also got another omp trecento on the meg.
Great job and so nice to see a cup being spoilt. Getting a bit rare now in good condition.
They are brilliant little hatches and fun for pounds spent there isn't much that beats it.
The RS's of this generation have coach wheels on them.
I put an Omp trecento uno on mine, 300mm. Drove like a go kart, it was epic fun.
Miss my old Cup but had to go slightly practical and got a meg 225 with having kids etc. I've also got another omp trecento on the meg.
Great job and so nice to see a cup being spoilt. Getting a bit rare now in good condition.
They are brilliant little hatches and fun for pounds spent there isn't much that beats it.
MrBlonde
ClioSport Club Member
Much better changing the steering wheel,end of the day you can always put the original back on for when you sell it.
Makes the driving experience so much better,i also put a OMP wheel on with a little custom touch.
Makes the driving experience so much better,i also put a OMP wheel on with a little custom touch.
The sabelt wheels are nice but I've always thought they're overpriced.
You'll need a boss either Omp or momo make them around £80.
Some resistors for the airbag connectors either 3.3 or 3.9 ohms, can't remember which.
The horn button will need the spring taken out as it short the horn out or people fit a phase one stalk which had the horn button on the end of it.
You'll need a boss either Omp or momo make them around £80.
Some resistors for the airbag connectors either 3.3 or 3.9 ohms, can't remember which.
The horn button will need the spring taken out as it short the horn out or people fit a phase one stalk which had the horn button on the end of it.
Can't go wrong with the omp wheels. Well made and have a good range of sizes and dishes.
MrBlonde
ClioSport Club Member
Defo do this or you may start a fire with the horn button like i did,i fitted the phase one stalk and cut the spring.
Oh it has torque steer, nothing extreme, but in 1st its very noticeable, also in 2nd and even in 3rd on undulations.
But do remember the car is running four miss matched tyres, one is a winter and the inner track rods have a little play.
I am sure once refreshed rest of suspension and bushes, plus a set of AD08R's, then the torque steer I am witnessing will be reduced.
Hi there
No real work progress on the car today as no parts arrived, still waiting on upper engine mount and a new number plate lens for rear bumper, probably land next week whilst I am in Germany.
So today it was time to properly clean the car further, so washed all the hard to get places like boot shuts, door shuts etc.
Then the car had the following process, all by hand:
1. Meguiars paint cleanse
2. Meguiars polish
3. Autobrite filler wax
4. Carplan no.1 sealeant
The car has gained so much more depth to the paint, not only that the paint is full of a pearl effect that was not showing so much when I collected the car, but now it really pops in the sun:
Then decided to go and drive some of my favourite roads, can really make the tyres squeal for life when throwing the car around corners, it skips, understeers and then just holds on like crazy, the best word to use is fun. Then driving home I parked up and grabbed a few more quick photos:
The miss matched tyres can certainly be felt, fast right hand corners the car is less stable, no doubt caused by the soft winter tyre on the front left which also has a smaller contact patch. Also a little squirmy under heavy braking again no doubt the tyres and no doubt same reason for torque steer. The brakes are good though, as I think there is maybe a wheel bearing issue am planning to just fit Brembo HC disc all round, the rears come with new bearings and fit EBC yellow all round.
Once rest of bushes, wishbones and track rods are done, with wheels refurbished with some stickier rubber should be even more fun.
No real work progress on the car today as no parts arrived, still waiting on upper engine mount and a new number plate lens for rear bumper, probably land next week whilst I am in Germany.
So today it was time to properly clean the car further, so washed all the hard to get places like boot shuts, door shuts etc.
Then the car had the following process, all by hand:
1. Meguiars paint cleanse
2. Meguiars polish
3. Autobrite filler wax
4. Carplan no.1 sealeant
The car has gained so much more depth to the paint, not only that the paint is full of a pearl effect that was not showing so much when I collected the car, but now it really pops in the sun:
Then decided to go and drive some of my favourite roads, can really make the tyres squeal for life when throwing the car around corners, it skips, understeers and then just holds on like crazy, the best word to use is fun. Then driving home I parked up and grabbed a few more quick photos:
The miss matched tyres can certainly be felt, fast right hand corners the car is less stable, no doubt caused by the soft winter tyre on the front left which also has a smaller contact patch. Also a little squirmy under heavy braking again no doubt the tyres and no doubt same reason for torque steer. The brakes are good though, as I think there is maybe a wheel bearing issue am planning to just fit Brembo HC disc all round, the rears come with new bearings and fit EBC yellow all round.
Once rest of bushes, wishbones and track rods are done, with wheels refurbished with some stickier rubber should be even more fun.
Hi there
OK ordered a set of R1R's, £300 for a set so not too bad, see if any good, supposed to be very grippy in wet and dry, but also fun and progressive.
Plus a very quick mod this morning:
Before:
After:
Very effective, very cheap, about £6 but just freshens the car up.
Weather is well this weekend, shall be changing the upper left engine mount for a new one along with Powerflex insert.
If tyres arrive shall probably book the car in for wheel refurbishment and the R1R tyres fitting.
OK ordered a set of R1R's, £300 for a set so not too bad, see if any good, supposed to be very grippy in wet and dry, but also fun and progressive.
Plus a very quick mod this morning:
Before:
After:
Very effective, very cheap, about £6 but just freshens the car up.
Weather is well this weekend, shall be changing the upper left engine mount for a new one along with Powerflex insert.
If tyres arrive shall probably book the car in for wheel refurbishment and the R1R tyres fitting.
